Repair or replace

Jerry11826 · September 11, 2010, 12:16 PM

I have a Model 60-4, 3", 38 Spec. the has a lot of "end shake". Maybe 3/16ths. of an inch. I bought it used and have fired it a lot. All light loads. 2.8 grns of Bullseye under a 158 grn round nose cast bullet.

I am getting unreliable ignition using Wolf primers. Federals work ok. Also the trigger pull changes. I think the cylinder may be rubbing on the barrel.

I am pretty sure the gun is not under S&W life time repair policy.

Have been thinking of returning it to S&W for repair. That would cost $100 - $150 just for freight. Then there is the cost of the repair.

Would you have it repaired or just toss it in the dumpster and buy a new pistol?

I like 3" J frame Smith's. I use it to shoot in a local "Concealed Carry" match. I definately want to have one of this model. Perfect revolver! Relatively light and accurate. Shoots good. With "outlaw" 38 loadings has just about the power of a 357.

What would you do?

Thanks,

Jerry

Don P · September 11, 2010, 12:28 PM

I have to ask where you live that shipping is going to be $100-150? Possible local gunsmith? Fix and NEVER throw it away.

Standing Wolf · September 11, 2010, 04:12 PM

Quote:

I have to ask where you live that shipping is going to be $100-150?

If you're planning to pay for shipping and insurance for the replacement value of the gun both ways, I'm sorry to tell you that's by no means an unheard of cost anywhere in the U.S.A.

shepherddogs · September 11, 2010, 04:44 PM

Take it to your local FFL. They can ship USPS insured for probably $25. My experience with S&W CS has been outstanding. I wouldn't be surprised if they fixed it for free. Also Wolf products are not known for outstanding quality. It's probably the worst choice of components available.

sw282 · September 11, 2010, 04:48 PM

Call Smith & Wesson. Ask them for a "prepaid" label. That way you get their discount price for shipping. Or use a gunshop. They can ship USPS which is only maybe $30 round trip

seeker_two · September 11, 2010, 05:20 PM

I'd let your local gunsmith have a go at it first. You may come out better off, and you'll help your local economy....

Nomadicone · September 11, 2010, 05:31 PM

Endshake is easy to fix and any local gunsmith worth his salt can fix it at very little cost. Heck you may want to tackle it yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmYzA...eature=related

Bullseye Smith · September 11, 2010, 07:48 PM

Call Brownells and ask for some cylinder shims for the "J" frame and add till you get 4 to .006 barrel gap and the correct head space.Should be less than $30 bucks to do it.

Jerry11826 · September 12, 2010, 12:41 PM

Thank you for your responses. I didn’t realize this was an easy fix.

About the shipping, I sent an old Colt Officers Model to “Cylinder and Slide” for repair. A requirement of the shipping was “overnight delivery”. It cost about $75.00 from Tampa, Florida to Nebraska. C&S charged me about $55.00to ship it back to me.

I will take it to a local “smith” and ask him to make the repair. It is hard to find a gunsmith in Tampa, Florida. Check the yellow pages or “on-line”, very little shows. If his estimate is over $250.00 I think I will “dumpster” the pistol. Who wants to pay $400.00 to get an old gun repaired, when you can buy a new pistol for $652.00, and the new one has a “life time warranty” .

Thanks again for your responses!

Jerry

Casimer · September 12, 2010, 04:46 PM

If it's too much, transfer it to someone who wants it, don't just throw it away. It could get into the wrong hands.

Bullseye Smith · September 12, 2010, 05:21 PM

Even a bad smith should be able to fix it for less than $100 buck, and fix it right.

Jim Watson · September 12, 2010, 06:56 PM

3/16" of END SHAKE? THREE SIXTEENTHS? .1875"?

There is not that much room to spare in a reasonably sound revolver frame.
The topstrap would have to be badly stretched ffrom those "outlaw loads."

You should be able to see rub marks or a lack of gap if the cylinder is rubbing the barrel breech.

I'd see if S&W would send a call tag or if your FFL would ship it for you on his business contract. You DO support your local dealer, don't you? If so, maybe he will support you.

Scout1 · September 14, 2010, 10:56 PM

As a gunsmith, I have repaired more guns than I can remember, so unless your S&W revolver was tested in the Nevada Desert during a discreet nuclear testing phase, it can be repaired and if it did cost between 100-150 including parts/total overhaul, it would still be worth it. Have you priced good; and I mean good quality guns built today. The way they were built less than 40 years ago was better accidently than they are today on purpose.

James K · September 15, 2010, 10:39 AM

Jim Watson is right. 3/16" is an unbelievable amount of endshake and I would even think of things like the gun having the wrong cylinder. Shims will not work because they just push the cylinder back. That may solve the misfiring (headspace) problem but will open the barrrel-cylinder gap to an unacceptable amount.

Yes, send the gun back to S&W. I wouldn't even bother with a local gunsmith.

Jim

FlyFish · September 15, 2010, 11:20 AM

I agree with those who think that 3/16ths seems an impossibly large amount of endshake. It might be worth taking the gun to a local smith just to make sure you're measuring things right (no offense intended). If it is really that large, then it sounds like something the factory should take a look at. Typical endshake, say in the several thousandths range or a bit more, is a simple thing for any smith worthy of the name to correct - mine charges me $25 to take care of it.

AKsRul.e · September 15, 2010, 11:31 AM

"Would you have it repaired or just toss it in the dumpster and buy a new pistol?

I like 3" J frame Smith's. I use it to shoot in a local "Concealed Carry" match. I definately want to have one of this model.
What would you do?"
-------------
I'm also a big J frame fan.

IMHO I would sell it off Cheap ,BUT WITH FULL DISCLOSURE to the buyer.

Then I would buy the gun I wanted.

BODAME · September 15, 2010, 11:45 AM

Take it to a Good Honest Smith for a opinion, might surprise you.

temmi · September 15, 2010, 01:05 PM

I would get it fixed....

Jerry11826 · September 15, 2010, 02:54 PM

Sorry I stated the end shake was 3/16th. I measured again, it somewhere between 1/16th and 1/8th. After all the nice feed back, I am going to try to take it to a gun smith this weekend. If he wants less than $400.00 for the repair I will probably get it fixed.

If not a couple of responders sent me PMs wanting to purchase the pistol. If the repair is $400+ I will get in touch with you and maybe we can work something out.

Thanks again for the responses.

Jerry

September 11, 2010, 12:16 PM	#1
Jerry11826 Member Join Date: July 12, 2009 Posts: 76	Repair or replace I have a Model 60-4, 3", 38 Spec. the has a lot of "end shake". Maybe 3/16ths. of an inch. I bought it used and have fired it a lot. All light loads. 2.8 grns of Bullseye under a 158 grn round nose cast bullet. I am getting unreliable ignition using Wolf primers. Federals work ok. Also the trigger pull changes. I think the cylinder may be rubbing on the barrel. I am pretty sure the gun is not under S&W life time repair policy. Have been thinking of returning it to S&W for repair. That would cost $100 - $150 just for freight. Then there is the cost of the repair. Would you have it repaired or just toss it in the dumpster and buy a new pistol? I like 3" J frame Smith's. I use it to shoot in a local "Concealed Carry" match. I definately want to have one of this model. Perfect revolver! Relatively light and accurate. Shoots good. With "outlaw" 38 loadings has just about the power of a 357. What would you do? Thanks, Jerry

September 11, 2010, 12:28 PM	#2
Don P Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 2005 Location: Swamp dweller Posts: 6,187	I have to ask where you live that shipping is going to be $100-150? Possible local gunsmith? Fix and NEVER throw it away. __________________ *NRA Life Member, NRA Chief Range Safety Officer, NRA Certified Pistol Instructor,, USPSA & Steel Challange NROI Range Officer, ICORE Range Officer, ,MAG 40 Graduate* *As you are, I once was, As I am, You will be.*

September 11, 2010, 05:20 PM	#6
seeker_two Senior Member Join Date: August 31, 2002 Location: Deep in the Heart of the Lone Star State (TX) Posts: 2,169	I'd let your local gunsmith have a go at it first. You may come out better off, and you'll help your local economy.... __________________ Proud member of Gun Culture 2.0......

September 11, 2010, 05:31 PM	#7
Nomadicone Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 2008 Location: Arizona Posts: 214	Endshake is easy to fix and any local gunsmith worth his salt can fix it at very little cost. Heck you may want to tackle it yourself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmYzA...eature=related __________________ Outdoor Equipment Outfitter for your outdoor equipment needs www.outdoorequipmentoutfitter.org

September 12, 2010, 12:41 PM	#9
Jerry11826 Member Join Date: July 12, 2009 Posts: 76	Thanks Thank you for your responses. I didn’t realize this was an easy fix. About the shipping, I sent an old Colt Officers Model to “Cylinder and Slide” for repair. A requirement of the shipping was “overnight delivery”. It cost about $75.00 from Tampa, Florida to Nebraska. C&S charged me about $55.00to ship it back to me. I will take it to a local “smith” and ask him to make the repair. It is hard to find a gunsmith in Tampa, Florida. Check the yellow pages or “on-line”, very little shows. If his estimate is over $250.00 I think I will “dumpster” the pistol. Who wants to pay $400.00 to get an old gun repaired, when you can buy a new pistol for $652.00, and the new one has a “life time warranty” . Thanks again for your responses! Jerry

September 11, 2010, 04:44 PM	#4
shepherddogs Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2007 Posts: 1,007	Take it to your local FFL. They can ship USPS insured for probably $25. My experience with S&W CS has been outstanding. I wouldn't be surprised if they fixed it for free. Also Wolf products are not known for outstanding quality. It's probably the worst choice of components available.

September 11, 2010, 04:48 PM	#5
sw282 Member Join Date: July 19, 2009 Posts: 88	Call Smith & Wesson. Ask them for a "prepaid" label. That way you get their discount price for shipping. Or use a gunshop. They can ship USPS which is only maybe $30 round trip

September 11, 2010, 07:48 PM	#8
Bullseye Smith Member Join Date: September 10, 2010 Posts: 26	Call Brownells and ask for some cylinder shims for the "J" frame and add till you get 4 to .006 barrel gap and the correct head space.Should be less than $30 bucks to do it.

September 12, 2010, 04:46 PM	#10
Casimer Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2007 Location: Pennsylvania, USA Posts: 1,918	If it's too much, transfer it to someone who wants it, don't just throw it away. It could get into the wrong hands.

September 12, 2010, 05:21 PM	#11
Bullseye Smith Member Join Date: September 10, 2010 Posts: 26	Even a bad smith should be able to fix it for less than $100 buck, and fix it right.

September 12, 2010, 06:56 PM	#12
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,543	3/16" of END SHAKE? THREE SIXTEENTHS? .1875"? There is not that much room to spare in a reasonably sound revolver frame. The topstrap would have to be badly stretched ffrom those "outlaw loads." You should be able to see rub marks or a lack of gap if the cylinder is rubbing the barrel breech. I'd see if S&W would send a call tag or if your FFL would ship it for you on his business contract. You DO support your local dealer, don't you? If so, maybe he will support you.

September 14, 2010, 10:56 PM	#13
Scout1 Junior Member Join Date: June 16, 2004 Location: Florida Posts: 5	As a gunsmith, I have repaired more guns than I can remember, so unless your S&W revolver was tested in the Nevada Desert during a discreet nuclear testing phase, it can be repaired and if it did cost between 100-150 including parts/total overhaul, it would still be worth it. Have you priced good; and I mean good quality guns built today. The way they were built less than 40 years ago was better accidently than they are today on purpose.

September 15, 2010, 10:39 AM	#14
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Jim Watson is right. 3/16" is an unbelievable amount of endshake and I would even think of things like the gun having the wrong cylinder. Shims will not work because they just push the cylinder back. That may solve the misfiring (headspace) problem but will open the barrrel-cylinder gap to an unacceptable amount. Yes, send the gun back to S&W. I wouldn't even bother with a local gunsmith. Jim

September 15, 2010, 11:20 AM	#15
FlyFish Senior Member Join Date: January 20, 2009 Location: Overlooking the Baker River Valley Posts: 1,723	I agree with those who think that 3/16ths seems an impossibly large amount of endshake. It might be worth taking the gun to a local smith just to make sure you're measuring things right (no offense intended). If it is really that large, then it sounds like something the factory should take a look at. Typical endshake, say in the several thousandths range or a bit more, is a simple thing for any smith worthy of the name to correct - mine charges me $25 to take care of it. Last edited by FlyFish; September 15, 2010 at 11:50 AM.

September 15, 2010, 11:31 AM	#16
AKsRul.e Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2010 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 234	"Would you have it repaired or just toss it in the dumpster and buy a new pistol? I like 3" J frame Smith's. I use it to shoot in a local "Concealed Carry" match. I definately want to have one of this model. What would you do?" ------------- I'm also a big J frame fan. IMHO I would sell it off Cheap ,BUT WITH FULL DISCLOSURE to the buyer. Then I would buy the gun I wanted.

September 15, 2010, 11:45 AM	#17
BODAME Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2006 Location: The Dodge House, NC Posts: 183	Before you toss it Take it to a Good Honest Smith for a opinion, might surprise you. __________________ "A Man's got to have a Code, a Creed to Live By, No Matter his Job"

September 15, 2010, 01:05 PM	#18
temmi Senior Member Join Date: June 13, 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 531	I would get it fixed....

September 15, 2010, 02:54 PM	#19
Jerry11826 Member Join Date: July 12, 2009 Posts: 76	Sorry I stated the end shake was 3/16th. I measured again, it somewhere between 1/16th and 1/8th. After all the nice feed back, I am going to try to take it to a gun smith this weekend. If he wants less than $400.00 for the repair I will probably get it fixed. If not a couple of responders sent me PMs wanting to purchase the pistol. If the repair is $400+ I will get in touch with you and maybe we can work something out. Thanks again for the responses. Jerry