+P in a Colt 1911?

Walter · October 6, 2006, 07:33 PM

I picked up a couple of boxes of Hornady TAP FPD 230 gr. JHP,
didn't realize they were "+P". Anybody think it would be unsafe to
shoot them in a Series 70 Government Model Colt?
The gun was built in '71, is pretty much stock, and has maybe 6000
rounds through it.
What do you guys think?

Walter

johnbt · October 7, 2006, 01:27 PM

I had to look it up and it's only 950 fps. I'd shoot a few boxes through my Kimber and Colts and have shot other brands of +P, like the Georgia Arms 230 gr. +P. It just wears the guns out a little faster.

John

ClarkEMyers · October 7, 2006, 02:00 PM

I wouldn't worry - though I'd take a close look at the collet style bushing and I might consider a buffer.

I'd also look at the history of the recoil spring over 6000 shots it might have been replaced a few times or maybe not - I'd consider replacing the recoil and the firing pin spring and maybe even the mainspring if that has ever been lightened for trigger feel or otherwise.

Of course if it were really a 1911 rather than a 1911A1 then I wouldn't shoot +P but I'd bet almost all the +P on the market is shot regularly in stock pistols that have the recoil spring they were shipped with regardless of shot count.

**Unclenick** · October 7, 2006, 02:30 PM

I think the collet bushing was only in the Goldcup, back then. Increasing the recoil spring to 18 lb or even 20 lb would be a good idea. This will increase the breech lockup dwell time a little. An even better way to do it would be to install a square bottom firing pin retainer, like those EGW makes. That increases lockup dwell, and reduces percieved recoil, too.

The reason to increase the lockup dwell is that the weak spot for the standard 1911 is the unsupported bottom side of the casehead. When the gun is driven to recoil quickly, it can begin extraction before barrel pressure is fully down, and this results in a bulge in the side of the case at that unsupported spot. Increasing the lockup dwell minimizes that. You may, however, find the brass is too bulged for reloading anyway.

Nick

U.S.SFC_RET · October 8, 2006, 09:14 AM

I wouldn't worry about it too much as long as you don't consider it as your standard ammo of choice. Don't change anything in the gun, that in itself desn't pass the common sense test. Just return the ammo or sell it off if you are uncomfortable shooting it. I have never heard anyone having to alter their .45 ACP pistol to shoot +P. Shoot the ammo, just don't consider it as plinking ammo.
Just remember when and if you alter that gun IMHO it better be for a darn good reason

Hunter Customs · October 8, 2006, 09:55 AM

I agree with U.S.SFC RET, any steel frame Colt 1911A1 in good working condition will handle +P ammo without changing anything in the gun.
The standard weight recoil spring will be just fine, +P ammo is not that high of pressure ammo like some high velocity ammo in different calibers.
As for the collet bushing they will break no matter what type of ammo is used in the gun, that's why Colt quit using them.
Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com

Walter · October 8, 2006, 06:26 PM

Thanks for the feedback, guys. I figured it would be safe to shoot
but I thought I't tap the vast experience of TFL and see if anybody
disagreed with me.
I also checked the MV, and @ 950 fps that didn't seem too far out
there. As for the collet barrel bushing, that thing in long gone,
replaced with a drop-in Ed Brown solid bushing that has proven to
be very reliable.
Again, thanks for the responses.

Walter

King_chin0 · October 9, 2006, 12:53 PM

I have a MKIV GM Series 80, and shoots Federal +Ps out of it normally, and not have a single problem. It functions even better then regular loads, It burns cleaner then most ammo too.

October 6, 2006, 07:33 PM	#1
Walter Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2004 Location: North Texas Posts: 641	+P in a Colt 1911? I picked up a couple of boxes of Hornady TAP FPD 230 gr. JHP, didn't realize they were "+P". Anybody think it would be unsafe to shoot them in a Series 70 Government Model Colt? The gun was built in '71, is pretty much stock, and has maybe 6000 rounds through it. What do you guys think? Walter

October 7, 2006, 02:00 PM	#3
ClarkEMyers Senior Member Join Date: November 13, 2004 Location: PacWest Posts: 455	I wouldn't worry - I wouldn't worry - though I'd take a close look at the collet style bushing and I might consider a buffer. I'd also look at the history of the recoil spring over 6000 shots it might have been replaced a few times or maybe not - I'd consider replacing the recoil and the firing pin spring and maybe even the mainspring if that has ever been lightened for trigger feel or otherwise. Of course if it were really a 1911 rather than a 1911A1 then I wouldn't shoot +P but I'd bet almost all the +P on the market is shot regularly in stock pistols that have the recoil spring they were shipped with regardless of shot count.

October 7, 2006, 02:30 PM	#4
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	I think the collet bushing was only in the Goldcup, back then. Increasing the recoil spring to 18 lb or even 20 lb would be a good idea. This will increase the breech lockup dwell time a little. An even better way to do it would be to install a square bottom firing pin retainer, like those EGW makes. That increases lockup dwell, and reduces percieved recoil, too. The reason to increase the lockup dwell is that the weak spot for the standard 1911 is the unsupported bottom side of the casehead. When the gun is driven to recoil quickly, it can begin extraction before barrel pressure is fully down, and this results in a bulge in the side of the case at that unsupported spot. Increasing the lockup dwell minimizes that. You may, however, find the brass is too bulged for reloading anyway. Nick __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

October 8, 2006, 09:14 AM	#5
U.S.SFC_RET Senior Member Join Date: December 12, 2005 Location: The Old line State Posts: 282	I wouldn't worry about it too much as long as you don't consider it as your standard ammo of choice. Don't change anything in the gun, that in itself desn't pass the common sense test. Just return the ammo or sell it off if you are uncomfortable shooting it. I have never heard anyone having to alter their .45 ACP pistol to shoot +P. Shoot the ammo, just don't consider it as plinking ammo. Just remember when and if you alter that gun IMHO it better be for a darn good reason __________________ 1. Treat every firearm as if it were loaded. 2. Never point a firearm at anything you do not intend to shoot. 3. Keep the finger off the trigger and firearm on safe until ready to shoot. 4. Know the target and what's beyond it.

October 7, 2006, 01:27 PM	#2
johnbt Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1999 Location: Richmond, Virginia USA Posts: 6,004	I had to look it up and it's only 950 fps. I'd shoot a few boxes through my Kimber and Colts and have shot other brands of +P, like the Georgia Arms 230 gr. +P. It just wears the guns out a little faster. John

October 8, 2006, 09:55 AM	#6
Hunter Customs Senior Member Join Date: March 26, 2005 Location: Osborn, Missouri Posts: 2,697	I agree with U.S.SFC RET, any steel frame Colt 1911A1 in good working condition will handle +P ammo without changing anything in the gun. The standard weight recoil spring will be just fine, +P ammo is not that high of pressure ammo like some high velocity ammo in different calibers. As for the collet bushing they will break no matter what type of ammo is used in the gun, that's why Colt quit using them. Regards Bob Hunter www.huntercustoms.com

October 8, 2006, 06:26 PM	#7
Walter Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2004 Location: North Texas Posts: 641	Thanks for the feedback, guys. I figured it would be safe to shoot but I thought I't tap the vast experience of TFL and see if anybody disagreed with me. I also checked the MV, and @ 950 fps that didn't seem too far out there. As for the collet barrel bushing, that thing in long gone, replaced with a drop-in Ed Brown solid bushing that has proven to be very reliable. Again, thanks for the responses. Walter

October 9, 2006, 12:53 PM	#8
King_chin0 Junior member Join Date: May 2, 2006 Location: Kansas City Posts: 303	I have a MKIV GM Series 80, and shoots Federal +Ps out of it normally, and not have a single problem. It functions even better then regular loads, It burns cleaner then most ammo too.