Question Concern Winchester USA 115 gr 9mm Ball...

Stephen A. Camp · May 21, 2001, 08:24 PM

This post does not have to do with reloading and may be out of place. It does concern ammunition and I didn't see a more "appropriate" place to ask. If the moderator needs to move this, there is no problem.
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Hello. To begin with, I've been shooting this stuff in 9mm and .45ACP since the early '80s...if not earlier; I cannot
remember, but am quite familar with it.

In 9mm, some of my previously-purchased USA 115 gr 9mm FMJ's average velocity was 1161 ft/sec out of a Browning HP
and very close to the same from a CZ75. Some new Magtech 115 gr ball from the same BHP averages 1167 ft/sec.

Today, I went shooting and decided on the SIG P210 as I've not shot it in a good while. I fired a box of the Magtech with no surprises no problems. Expecting the same thing with the Winchester (You'll note how close the previously
chronographed velocities were), I was quite surprised to note quite an increase in recoil! Now, I realize that we are "talking 9mm" here, but the increase in recoil was substantial. l did not have my chronograph with me at the range. Being quite sure that this felt like Plus P or Nato loads, I checked the cases but there was no cross in the circle indicating Nato loading, nor was there the Plus P stamp. Neither did the box mention anything like this. I did note that the box says "Q4172" on it. My friend said that such was the military designation. I do not know.

I'll chronograph it to be sure and am not particularly concerned, but does anyone know if Winchester's loading overruns of the Nato stuff in non-Nato-marked cases or if they've just hopped up their standard velocity USA load?
I will chronograph the stuff to know exactly what's going on, but wondered if anyone else has experienced this or has any insight in this?

Best.

May 21, 2001, 08:24 PM	#1
Stephen A. Camp Staff In Memoriam Join Date: April 16, 1999 Posts: 2,570	This post does not have to do with reloading and may be out of place. It does concern ammunition and I didn't see a more "appropriate" place to ask. If the moderator needs to move this, there is no problem. ************************************************************ Hello. To begin with, I've been shooting this stuff in 9mm and .45ACP since the early '80s...if not earlier; I cannot remember, but am quite familar with it. In 9mm, some of my previously-purchased USA 115 gr 9mm FMJ's average velocity was 1161 ft/sec out of a Browning HP and very close to the same from a CZ75. Some new Magtech 115 gr ball from the same BHP averages 1167 ft/sec. Today, I went shooting and decided on the SIG P210 as I've not shot it in a good while. I fired a box of the Magtech with no surprises no problems. Expecting the same thing with the Winchester (You'll note how close the previously chronographed velocities were), I was quite surprised to note quite an increase in recoil! Now, I realize that we are "talking 9mm" here, but the increase in recoil was substantial. l did not have my chronograph with me at the range. Being quite sure that this felt like Plus P or Nato loads, I checked the cases but there was no cross in the circle indicating Nato loading, nor was there the Plus P stamp. Neither did the box mention anything like this. I did note that the box says "Q4172" on it. My friend said that such was the military designation. I do not know. I'll chronograph it to be sure and am not particularly concerned, but does anyone know if Winchester's loading overruns of the Nato stuff in non-Nato-marked cases or if they've just hopped up their standard velocity USA load? I will chronograph the stuff to know exactly what's going on, but wondered if anyone else has experienced this or has any insight in this? Best.