An inexpensive kick cutter....

Dave McC · August 24, 2000, 07:20 AM

Had a serendipitious moment yesterday....

I was down in the walk in closet my Wonderful Wife calls my store(as in,"You've got enough stuff in there to start a store") getting the 870 ready for dove season and messin' around with the 20 ga Youth Express. I had stripped the 20 and was relubing it a bit, and planned on weighing the darn thing.

As I was trying to figure out how to cut the kick a bit for the kids, I glanced at some of my bowhunting stuff, and noted that one of the stabilizers was roughly the same diameter as the mag on the 20 ga. Eureka!!

I didn't have an extra mag tube cap for the 20, but I did for the bird 870.So, it took but a moment to remove the cap, thread the bolt the shortie was mounted on through the sling stud hole and tighten the nut up to handtight. Assembly was quick and I took some swings with it.

The weight of a couple of shells in the tube always seems to smooth out the swing for me, and this stabilizer weighed about the same, 7 oz. In my bunty little 21" bbled 870, the swing seemed steadier and smoother, with more inertia.

And weighing all the stuff was in order. The little stabilizer weighed in at 7 oz, the 870 at roughly 7 lbs. So, a basic calculation shows that adding the weight reduces the FELT recoil by 6%,and may smooth the swing.

And application here?

For beginners, less recoil is good. For those past beginner stage, a little more weight when shooting lots in one day at a clay sport or dove hunt means less kick fatigue/soreness.

And in the field,removing the extra weight is simple, requiring no gunsmithing.

And how about sighting in your slug gun?
Reducing the kick means shooting better, longer,and getting that thing to shoot just where you want it to, with the most accurate slug.Here,since it's being benched, one could go to a stabilizer weighing a lb or more.

Downside,you lose your sling stud, possibly.
An extra mag cap will fix that, and they're cheap. And most of us know bowhunters with boxes full of old stuff.

Alternately, one could build up a weight with a bolt, washers and a nut or two.

Questions, comments, donations(G)?

teknobel · August 24, 2000, 12:47 PM

If you use the stablizer when siting in the slug gun, does the point of impact change when you remove it?

Dave McC · August 24, 2000, 12:54 PM

It shouldn't, assuming that you do not use the stabilizer to rest the weapon,and everything is tight before and after.A loose fit between receiver and bbl is the biggest accuracy robber I've found so far.

Take your pump/auto and grasp it at the wrist of the stock as if you're shooting, then grab the bbl with your support hand and attempt to move it. If it does move w/o major effort, something's loose and needs to be tightened. I learned at an armorer's segment of an instructor's school that 870s can be tightened ONE click beyond handtight with channelocks. This eliminates the slop and shrinks groups.

KAM_Indianapolis · August 25, 2000, 01:24 PM

Not being an engineer, or playing one on tv...

It seems like a good idea. Longer barrel guns track better (or so I've read ever where). What you're doing is changing the center of gravity of the gun. And adding mass to handle the recoil. Making it feel like a longer barrel gun, more weight foward of the forearm.

I'm betting you could get by with more weight. Maybe clamp two weights on either side of the barrel & mag extension.

[This message has been edited by KAM_Indianapolis (edited August 25, 2000).]

Dave McC · August 25, 2000, 05:36 PM

Ain't an engineer either, KAM, just a tinkerer.

I recall seeing weighted mag caps for the 1100,etc, in Shotgun News maybe ten years back.The best I can remember, they ran about
10 oz.

Also, I built this 870 for birds, and it has no extension.

There IS a limit on how much a shotgun should weigh.My HD 870 runs about 9 1/2 lbs, and at one point considerably heavier.The trouble was, it handled like a railroad tie, so I backed off.

IMO, the best thing to do here is to add weight slowly, keep the balance between the hands,and make sure you use good form when shooting.

If I can get a pic, with Son's digital camera, I'll post,but don't hold your breath, I'm a techno dunce...

Dave McC · September 10, 2000, 10:52 AM

Finally got a pic, with my son's assistance....

jrhines · September 10, 2000, 11:30 AM

I did this with both my sons Youth 870 20ga guns. I tricked 'em out for skeet, which are light loads, but many, many of them. So for an 8 & 11 year old, any kick reducing touch was a good thing. I turned a couple of castiron slugs to the proper size, drilled & tapped a bolt hole in the end, gave it a coat or two of cold bluing - presto, some custom made & fitted barrel weights, just like the one's on the K-guns. I also ported the barrels, but mostly to reduce flip. There was some other stuff, adjusting the combing for fit,... But seeing these guys break doubles with a pump-20 next to some 3 grand O/U, does a body good!! Like fishing, time spent shooting with your kids dosn't count on you lifetime.

Dave McC · September 10, 2000, 04:51 PM

Agreed on the time thing, should have plenty of years left(G).

That's another approach, and even cheaper.

August 24, 2000, 07:20 AM	#1
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Had a serendipitious moment yesterday.... I was down in the walk in closet my Wonderful Wife calls my store(as in,"You've got enough stuff in there to start a store") getting the 870 ready for dove season and messin' around with the 20 ga Youth Express. I had stripped the 20 and was relubing it a bit, and planned on weighing the darn thing. As I was trying to figure out how to cut the kick a bit for the kids, I glanced at some of my bowhunting stuff, and noted that one of the stabilizers was roughly the same diameter as the mag on the 20 ga. Eureka!! I didn't have an extra mag tube cap for the 20, but I did for the bird 870.So, it took but a moment to remove the cap, thread the bolt the shortie was mounted on through the sling stud hole and tighten the nut up to handtight. Assembly was quick and I took some swings with it. The weight of a couple of shells in the tube always seems to smooth out the swing for me, and this stabilizer weighed about the same, 7 oz. In my bunty little 21" bbled 870, the swing seemed steadier and smoother, with more inertia. And weighing all the stuff was in order. The little stabilizer weighed in at 7 oz, the 870 at roughly 7 lbs. So, a basic calculation shows that adding the weight reduces the FELT recoil by 6%,and may smooth the swing. And application here? For beginners, less recoil is good. For those past beginner stage, a little more weight when shooting lots in one day at a clay sport or dove hunt means less kick fatigue/soreness. And in the field,removing the extra weight is simple, requiring no gunsmithing. And how about sighting in your slug gun? Reducing the kick means shooting better, longer,and getting that thing to shoot just where you want it to, with the most accurate slug.Here,since it's being benched, one could go to a stabilizer weighing a lb or more. Downside,you lose your sling stud, possibly. An extra mag cap will fix that, and they're cheap. And most of us know bowhunters with boxes full of old stuff. Alternately, one could build up a weight with a bolt, washers and a nut or two. Questions, comments, donations(G)?

August 24, 2000, 12:47 PM	#2
teknobel Junior Member Join Date: June 14, 2000 Location: Colorado Springs, CO USA Posts: 10	If you use the stablizer when siting in the slug gun, does the point of impact change when you remove it?

August 24, 2000, 12:54 PM	#3
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	It shouldn't, assuming that you do not use the stabilizer to rest the weapon,and everything is tight before and after.A loose fit between receiver and bbl is the biggest accuracy robber I've found so far. Take your pump/auto and grasp it at the wrist of the stock as if you're shooting, then grab the bbl with your support hand and attempt to move it. If it does move w/o major effort, something's loose and needs to be tightened. I learned at an armorer's segment of an instructor's school that 870s can be tightened ONE click beyond handtight with channelocks. This eliminates the slop and shrinks groups.

August 25, 2000, 01:24 PM	#4
KAM_Indianapolis Senior Member Join Date: February 3, 1999 Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA Posts: 612	Not being an engineer, or playing one on tv... It seems like a good idea. Longer barrel guns track better (or so I've read ever where). What you're doing is changing the center of gravity of the gun. And adding mass to handle the recoil. Making it feel like a longer barrel gun, more weight foward of the forearm. I'm betting you could get by with more weight. Maybe clamp two weights on either side of the barrel & mag extension. [This message has been edited by KAM_Indianapolis (edited August 25, 2000).]

August 25, 2000, 05:36 PM	#5
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Ain't an engineer either, KAM, just a tinkerer. I recall seeing weighted mag caps for the 1100,etc, in Shotgun News maybe ten years back.The best I can remember, they ran about 10 oz. Also, I built this 870 for birds, and it has no extension. There IS a limit on how much a shotgun should weigh.My HD 870 runs about 9 1/2 lbs, and at one point considerably heavier.The trouble was, it handled like a railroad tie, so I backed off. IMO, the best thing to do here is to add weight slowly, keep the balance between the hands,and make sure you use good form when shooting. If I can get a pic, with Son's digital camera, I'll post,but don't hold your breath, I'm a techno dunce...

September 10, 2000, 10:52 AM	#6
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Finally got a pic, with my son's assistance....

September 10, 2000, 11:30 AM	#7
jrhines Member Join Date: September 3, 2000 Posts: 51	I did this with both my sons Youth 870 20ga guns. I tricked 'em out for skeet, which are light loads, but many, many of them. So for an 8 & 11 year old, any kick reducing touch was a good thing. I turned a couple of castiron slugs to the proper size, drilled & tapped a bolt hole in the end, gave it a coat or two of cold bluing - presto, some custom made & fitted barrel weights, just like the one's on the K-guns. I also ported the barrels, but mostly to reduce flip. There was some other stuff, adjusting the combing for fit,... But seeing these guys break doubles with a pump-20 next to some 3 grand O/U, does a body good!! Like fishing, time spent shooting with your kids dosn't count on you lifetime.

September 10, 2000, 04:51 PM	#8
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Agreed on the time thing, should have plenty of years left(G). That's another approach, and even cheaper.