Near disaster 20 minutes ago...

Blue Duck357 · April 29, 2001, 02:36 PM

shooting some reloads (38 special) a friend made up (I don't reload yet). First box said 158 grain SWC Green Dot powder CCI primers. Shot them with no problem out of my SW model 65. Decided to do some fast work with the second box same recipe but winchester primers. First few rounds went fine, draw fire three fast as I could stay on target and repeat.

Around the third time I did this I noticed something wrong, less noise and recoil and I actually SAW the first two rounds heading toward the target, hit and exit (looked like little black dots). I got stopped with the trigger halfway back for the third shot, Checked the barrel for obstructions and fired again. Boom, full power no problem, next shot was another squib and this time it got stuck halfway down the barrel. If I had loaded these up in a different order, it would not have been good.

Can't get ahold of my friend right now, and I'm no reloading expert, anyone have any ideas whats going on? My relaoding manual does not even list a green dot powder for the 38, the bullet I recovered from the barrel is sitting in front of me, looks normal with some type of blue lube in the groove.

Thanks for any ideas, Blue Duck

slo_dog · April 29, 2001, 03:58 PM

Sounds like it was short on powder to me .

WESHOOT2 · April 29, 2001, 06:04 PM

I can only suggest that you buy reloads from Georgia Arms or Bull-X, and avoid at all cost the loads your friend makes.

There is no economy in cheap ammo that breaks something (like your gun, or your skin).

Green Dot meters for [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color].

Poodleshooter · April 30, 2001, 11:47 AM

Green Dot is like all the other Alliant flake powders as to how it meters. I use it a lot in 12 gauge loads. Probably just a light load.

Kframe · April 30, 2001, 01:06 PM

Just another reason to never ever shoot somebody else's reloads, whether made by a friend, or some brown bag mystery ammo at a gunshow.

The only "reloads" I will use are the Black Hills remanufactured stuff; that, and my own reloads.

Just my $.02, -Kframe

Intel6 · April 30, 2001, 01:22 PM

Your problem may have been powder choice. Green Dot is a little to slow burning for lite .38 loads. It is also the bigger flakes which means that there was possible powder bridging in the measure which resulted in some rounds not getting a full charge.

My reccomendation is to go to your buddys house and have him help you reload your own reloads. You will be able to learn the rocess and you will both be able to double check each other on the procedures.

Sub MOA · April 30, 2001, 01:54 PM

It's the person reloading, not the powder.

I have loaded thousands of .38 rounds with Green Dot. I have never had a squib load or any functioning problems and I tear small, ragged holes shooting 158 gr. SWC hardcast. As to metering Green Dot, my Lyman 55 throws charges very consistently. To each his own.

I agree, be wary of the handloads of others.

Sub

Big Bunny · May 2, 2001, 06:00 PM

I use Green Dot and Du Pont HS 700X in .38SPL and shotshells with no problems. ****Don't 'bag' the old Herc GD please - it is not to blame!

Get your "friend" to check all his cases are filled equally on the blocks with a small maglite torch(not a match OK!).Be there when he does it for your peace of mind and confidence in future. If he uses a progressive reloader watch out with flake loads as previously mentioned.

Double loads and underloads are clearly visible if "blocked". Try a few examples as a test and see how easy it is to see only .2gn of a difference.

Hey...why not now start reloading yourself and THEN you will be SURE of your ammo!

BB

Patrick Graham · May 2, 2001, 09:13 PM

He needs to shake up his powder measure thingy before he reloads. If it sat long enough with the wrong powder (any flake powder) then it starts to cake or bridge.

better to leave the powder measure empty when not in use and fill only when needed. Has the same effect as shaking it.

Cheapo · May 3, 2001, 04:16 PM

Big Bunny, us 'Mericuns call it a flashlight. Far less ambiguous as well as far less flammable!

Unless you're in a flammable vapor or flammable gas environment

!!! That's why my car flashlight is a USGI anglehead, with rubber O-rings and NIOSH/Mine safety certification. There are stories to be told, but not now.

Anyway, our wise ones posting above are correct about the powder being okay. Light charges are the most likely culprit. Another way this can happen is through an automatic powder measure getting short-stroked on the powder pickup cycle.

Both Dillon and Lee now have their own versions of a fail-safe mechanical retraction system to force the powder charge bar to fully return. Progressive press reloading is MUCH safer now because of that.

But I still peek inside the cases just before placing the bullet in the neck. My dream is to install a small dental-type mirror on the press (hello, my friend epoxy!) so I can more easily look.

If your buddy gave you short-charged reloads using a single stage press and the loading blocks described above, shame on him. If such is true, he MUST take remedial education before reloading again!

Ain't it interesting how we get lucky even in our bad luck? God loves us enough to keep each of us alive (and as intact as needed) until our individualized E-ticket ride is completed. I like that.

April 29, 2001, 06:04 PM	#3
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	I can only suggest that you buy reloads from Georgia Arms or Bull-X, and avoid at all cost the loads your friend makes. There is no economy in cheap ammo that breaks something (like your gun, or your skin). Green Dot meters for [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color]. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

April 29, 2001, 02:36 PM	#1
Blue Duck357 Senior Member Join Date: October 6, 2000 Posts: 1,460	shooting some reloads (38 special) a friend made up (I don't reload yet). First box said 158 grain SWC Green Dot powder CCI primers. Shot them with no problem out of my SW model 65. Decided to do some fast work with the second box same recipe but winchester primers. First few rounds went fine, draw fire three fast as I could stay on target and repeat. Around the third time I did this I noticed something wrong, less noise and recoil and I actually SAW the first two rounds heading toward the target, hit and exit (looked like little black dots). I got stopped with the trigger halfway back for the third shot, Checked the barrel for obstructions and fired again. Boom, full power no problem, next shot was another squib and this time it got stuck halfway down the barrel. If I had loaded these up in a different order, it would not have been good. Can't get ahold of my friend right now, and I'm no reloading expert, anyone have any ideas whats going on? My relaoding manual does not even list a green dot powder for the 38, the bullet I recovered from the barrel is sitting in front of me, looks normal with some type of blue lube in the groove. Thanks for any ideas, Blue Duck

April 29, 2001, 03:58 PM	#2
slo_dog Member Join Date: February 20, 2001 Location: Mi. Posts: 23	Sounds like it was short on powder to me .

April 30, 2001, 11:47 AM	#4
Poodleshooter Senior Member Join Date: August 7, 2000 Location: Floating down the James River in VA Posts: 2,599	Green Dot is like all the other Alliant flake powders as to how it meters. I use it a lot in 12 gauge loads. Probably just a light load.

April 30, 2001, 01:06 PM	#5
Kframe Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 1999 Location: MN Posts: 640	Just another reason to never ever shoot somebody else's reloads, whether made by a friend, or some brown bag mystery ammo at a gunshow. The only "reloads" I will use are the Black Hills remanufactured stuff; that, and my own reloads. Just my $.02, -Kframe

April 30, 2001, 01:22 PM	#6
Intel6 Senior Member Join Date: October 13, 2000 Posts: 425	Your problem may have been powder choice. Green Dot is a little to slow burning for lite .38 loads. It is also the bigger flakes which means that there was possible powder bridging in the measure which resulted in some rounds not getting a full charge. My reccomendation is to go to your buddys house and have him help you reload your own reloads. You will be able to learn the rocess and you will both be able to double check each other on the procedures.

April 30, 2001, 01:54 PM	#7
Sub MOA Senior Member Join Date: June 28, 2000 Location: WA Posts: 292	It's the person reloading, not the powder. I have loaded thousands of .38 rounds with Green Dot. I have never had a squib load or any functioning problems and I tear small, ragged holes shooting 158 gr. SWC hardcast. As to metering Green Dot, my Lyman 55 throws charges very consistently. To each his own. I agree, be wary of the handloads of others. Sub

May 2, 2001, 06:00 PM	#8
Big Bunny Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 1999 Location: New South Wales - Australia Posts: 605	I use Green Dot and Du Pont HS 700X in .38SPL and shotshells with no problems. ****Don't 'bag' the old Herc GD please - it is not to blame! Get your "friend" to check all his cases are filled equally on the blocks with a small maglite torch(not a match OK!).Be there when he does it for your peace of mind and confidence in future. If he uses a progressive reloader watch out with flake loads as previously mentioned. Double loads and underloads are clearly visible if "blocked". Try a few examples as a test and see how easy it is to see only .2gn of a difference. Hey...why not now start reloading yourself and THEN you will be SURE of your ammo! BB

May 2, 2001, 09:13 PM	#9
Patrick Graham Junior member Join Date: January 18, 1999 Location: Kokomo, Indiana USA Posts: 674	He needs to shake up his powder measure thingy before he reloads. If it sat long enough with the wrong powder (any flake powder) then it starts to cake or bridge. better to leave the powder measure empty when not in use and fill only when needed. Has the same effect as shaking it.

May 3, 2001, 04:16 PM	#10
Cheapo Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 1998 Posts: 986	Big Bunny, us 'Mericuns call it a flashlight. Far less ambiguous as well as far less flammable! Unless you're in a flammable vapor or flammable gas environment !!! That's why my car flashlight is a USGI anglehead, with rubber O-rings and NIOSH/Mine safety certification. There are stories to be told, but not now. Anyway, our wise ones posting above are correct about the powder being okay. Light charges are the most likely culprit. Another way this can happen is through an automatic powder measure getting short-stroked on the powder pickup cycle. Both Dillon and Lee now have their own versions of a fail-safe mechanical retraction system to force the powder charge bar to fully return. Progressive press reloading is MUCH safer now because of that. But I still peek inside the cases just before placing the bullet in the neck. My dream is to install a small dental-type mirror on the press (hello, my friend epoxy!) so I can more easily look. If your buddy gave you short-charged reloads using a single stage press and the loading blocks described above, shame on him. If such is true, he MUST take remedial education before reloading again! Ain't it interesting how we get lucky even in our bad luck? God loves us enough to keep each of us alive (and as intact as needed) until our individualized E-ticket ride is completed. I like that.