.300 WSM=300 Win Mag?

wudjalike2no · February 4, 2005, 06:46 PM

are 300 WSM loads the same as 300 win mag loads? i mean like if i had a book that had 300 win mag loads in it, would a 300 WSM perform the same ?

MTMilitiaman · February 4, 2005, 07:07 PM

In factory loads, perhaps, but if you handload, the belted .300 Winchester's edge in case capacity means you'll probably be able to get more velocity out of it, esp with heavier bullets. Whether or not it makes as much difference as some people suggest, the WSM isn't going to do quite as well with the longer, heavier bullets.

Smokey Joe · February 6, 2005, 06:15 PM

From Lyman's 48th Ed. Reloading Handbook:

"Winchester launched their Short Magnum line of cartridges with the .300 WSM in 2001. The .300WSM is Winchester's first completely new cartridge to come along in quite a few years as well as their first non-belted magnum. The appearance of the WSM is very similar to the PPC series of cartreidges and features a slightly rebated rim. Benchrest shooters discovered long ago the inherent accurach advantages of short. stubby cartridges. Many shooters report outstanding accuracy with this cartridge as well as lower percieved recoil. The absence of the belt found on traditional magnum cartridges offers smooth feeding and more positive headspacing. Its 2.100" case length, 35-degree shoulder, and pressure limit of 65,000 psi are desighed to offer magnum level performance in a short action rifle.

"Ballistics of the .300WSM averaged 30 TO 50 FEET PER SECOND BELOW THE FULL SIZED .300 WINCHESTER MAGNUM WHILE CONSUMING AROUND EIGHT TO TEN PERCENT LESS POWDER in our lab tests...."

(Emphasis added.)

So there you have it, the advantages and disadvantages of the .300WSM. IMHO, Bambi will never know the difference, but on your end, you use less powder and get less felt recoil. And the "outstanding accuracy" ain't a bad thing, either.

BTW, it's none of my business, but: If you are reloading and you DON'T have a handbook of loads, for heaven's sake--and yours, too--get one before proceeding, and follow it.

wudjalike2no · February 7, 2005, 07:23 AM

i was just wondering because if i start reloading and and the book doesnt have many 300WSM loads if i could use the ones in the 300 Win Mag

Lycanthrope · February 7, 2005, 08:30 AM

There are a million loads listed on various sites out there......don't EVER guess on a load.

bergie · February 7, 2005, 06:58 PM

No you cannot use the load data for the .300 Win Mag in the .300 WSM!!!!

I see that you are asking "if I start reloading and the book doesn't have many", do yourself a favor and get a couple of books. Go to bullet and powder manufacturer's websites, I think they all give at least some data.
A lot of gun shops especially ones that sell reloading equipment have small giveaway booklets put out by powder companies, they usually put out a new one every year or two. I pick them up even though I have half a dozen manuals.
Gather up all of the information that you can, and compare the data for each load. It might surprise you to see that a powder company will say a certain amount of powder is max with a particular bullet, but when you look at the data from the bullet company they say a different amount is max. Start with the lower starting weight and work up.
It takes quite a bit of experience and knowledge to experiment safely, so stay with data provided by a reliable source.
However, i know where you are coming from on the lack of data, it seems that most of the companies just kind of skip over 165 gr. bullets in the WSM going from 150 to 180 with maybe only 3 or 4 loads for 165 but dozens for the others.

Be careful, and good luck
bergie

Walter · February 11, 2005, 10:14 PM

wudjalike2no, let me show you just one example of why you should never
transpose loading data from one cartridge to another.

My Hornady book (6th Edition) lists the red-line (maximum) load for a 180 gr.
bullet in the 300WSM, using H 4350, at 65.2 gr. That is an estimated muzzle velocity of 2950fps.

The red-line load for the 300 WinMag, using the same powder, same bullet, is 69.5gr. That would supposedly give you a m.v. of 2900fps.

However- If you were to use the 300 WinMag 'loading data' to load a
300WSM cartridge, and if you were able to stuff 69.5 grains of H 4350 into the WSM case, you would probably be in for a shock when you pulled the trigger. You might be risking serious injury.

You really should invest in a couple of reloading manuals. Also, many of
the reloading-component manufacturers have web-sites that contain a
lot of reloading info, including specific loading charts.

Be safe!

Walter

Johnny Guest · February 12, 2005, 10:20 AM

They've already said it, but it bears saying again: The answer to your question is NO!

The companies are eager to send you information in the mail. Also, almost any store which stocks reloading components has powder, brass, and bullet manufacturers' pamphlets giving good, safe, CURRENT load information. This material is free for the asking. Additionally, you should have at least one loading manual printed within the past few years.

Safety first!

Good luck to you.
Johnny

K9 Big Dog · February 13, 2005, 09:03 AM

If you buy a manual that doesn't have WSM data in it by now, or at the very least doesn't have supplemental data for the WSM's available online, you need to think about using a different manual.

OldGunner · February 19, 2005, 02:44 PM

The biggest advantage of the new WSM & WSSM series of cartridges is that they are made with shorter or much shorter actions. This can result in big savings in weight of the rifle & scope combo. Browning rifles are as light as 6.5 pounds. Big difference, and when you're old as dirt like me (64 & counting) the "big difference" becomes a HUGE difference.

Ackley Improved User · February 23, 2005, 06:37 PM

The "new" stubby MAGs are just __ hype to sell more guns. To do that, the manufacturers must create demand with something new and glitzy – the latest and greatest. The stubby MAGs are supposed to be more accurate. But, the cognoscenti know that barrel stiffness, hand load, and quality create accuracy. This is well known among the benchrest rifle shooters (I’m one) who use the stubby 6mm BR – as well as, the highest quality, stiff (thickest), heaviest barrel allowed.

February 4, 2005, 06:46 PM	#1
wudjalike2no Senior Member Join Date: November 29, 2004 Posts: 109	.300 WSM=300 Win Mag? are 300 WSM loads the same as 300 win mag loads? i mean like if i had a book that had 300 win mag loads in it, would a 300 WSM perform the same ?

February 6, 2005, 06:15 PM	#3
Smokey Joe Senior Member Join Date: July 14, 2001 Location: State of Confusion Posts: 2,106	.300 WSM vs. .300 WinMag From Lyman's 48th Ed. Reloading Handbook: "Winchester launched their Short Magnum line of cartridges with the .300 WSM in 2001. The .300WSM is Winchester's first completely new cartridge to come along in quite a few years as well as their first non-belted magnum. The appearance of the WSM is very similar to the PPC series of cartreidges and features a slightly rebated rim. Benchrest shooters discovered long ago the inherent accurach advantages of short. stubby cartridges. Many shooters report outstanding accuracy with this cartridge as well as lower percieved recoil. The absence of the belt found on traditional magnum cartridges offers smooth feeding and more positive headspacing. Its 2.100" case length, 35-degree shoulder, and pressure limit of 65,000 psi are desighed to offer magnum level performance in a short action rifle. "Ballistics of the .300WSM averaged 30 TO 50 FEET PER SECOND BELOW THE FULL SIZED .300 WINCHESTER MAGNUM WHILE CONSUMING AROUND EIGHT TO TEN PERCENT LESS POWDER in our lab tests...." (Emphasis added.) So there you have it, the advantages and disadvantages of the .300WSM. IMHO, Bambi will never know the difference, but on your end, you use less powder and get less felt recoil. And the "outstanding accuracy" ain't a bad thing, either. BTW, it's none of my business, but: If you are reloading and you DON'T have a handbook of loads, for heaven's sake--and yours, too--get one before proceeding, and follow it. __________________ God Bless America --Smokey Joe

February 7, 2005, 06:58 PM	#6
bergie Senior Member Join Date: April 19, 1999 Posts: 567	No! No! No! No! No! No you cannot use the load data for the .300 Win Mag in the .300 WSM!!!! I see that you are asking "if I start reloading and the book doesn't have many", do yourself a favor and get a couple of books. Go to bullet and powder manufacturer's websites, I think they all give at least some data. A lot of gun shops especially ones that sell reloading equipment have small giveaway booklets put out by powder companies, they usually put out a new one every year or two. I pick them up even though I have half a dozen manuals. Gather up all of the information that you can, and compare the data for each load. It might surprise you to see that a powder company will say a certain amount of powder is max with a particular bullet, but when you look at the data from the bullet company they say a different amount is max. Start with the lower starting weight and work up. It takes quite a bit of experience and knowledge to experiment safely, so stay with data provided by a reliable source. However, i know where you are coming from on the lack of data, it seems that most of the companies just kind of skip over 165 gr. bullets in the WSM going from 150 to 180 with maybe only 3 or 4 loads for 165 but dozens for the others. Be careful, and good luck bergie

February 11, 2005, 10:14 PM	#7
Walter Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2004 Location: North Texas Posts: 641	An example of why NOT wudjalike2no, let me show you just one example of why you should never transpose loading data from one cartridge to another. My Hornady book (6th Edition) lists the red-line (maximum) load for a 180 gr. bullet in the 300WSM, using H 4350, at 65.2 gr. That is an estimated muzzle velocity of 2950fps. The red-line load for the 300 WinMag, using the same powder, same bullet, is 69.5gr. That would supposedly give you a m.v. of 2900fps. However- If you were to use the 300 WinMag 'loading data' to load a 300WSM cartridge, and if you were able to stuff 69.5 grains of H 4350 into the WSM case, you would probably be in for a shock when you pulled the trigger. You might be risking serious injury. You really should invest in a couple of reloading manuals. Also, many of the reloading-component manufacturers have web-sites that contain a lot of reloading info, including specific loading charts. Be safe! Walter

February 12, 2005, 10:20 AM	#8
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	Good Advice Above! They've already said it, but it bears saying again: The answer to your question is NO! The companies are eager to send you information in the mail. Also, almost any store which stocks reloading components has powder, brass, and bullet manufacturers' pamphlets giving good, safe, CURRENT load information. This material is free for the asking. Additionally, you should have at least one loading manual printed within the past few years. Safety first! Good luck to you. Johnny

February 4, 2005, 07:07 PM	#2
MTMilitiaman Senior Member Join Date: October 14, 2004 Location: NW Montana Posts: 1,875	In factory loads, perhaps, but if you handload, the belted .300 Winchester's edge in case capacity means you'll probably be able to get more velocity out of it, esp with heavier bullets. Whether or not it makes as much difference as some people suggest, the WSM isn't going to do quite as well with the longer, heavier bullets.

February 7, 2005, 07:23 AM	#4
wudjalike2no Senior Member Join Date: November 29, 2004 Posts: 109	i was just wondering because if i start reloading and and the book doesnt have many 300WSM loads if i could use the ones in the 300 Win Mag

February 7, 2005, 08:30 AM	#5
Lycanthrope Senior Member Join Date: October 1, 2001 Location: PA Posts: 1,752	There are a million loads listed on various sites out there......don't EVER guess on a load.

February 13, 2005, 09:03 AM	#9
K9 Big Dog Junior Member Join Date: May 28, 2004 Posts: 13	If you buy a manual that doesn't have WSM data in it by now, or at the very least doesn't have supplemental data for the WSM's available online, you need to think about using a different manual.

February 19, 2005, 02:44 PM	#10
OldGunner Member Join Date: February 18, 2005 Location: Dallas Posts: 28	The biggest advantage of the new WSM & WSSM series of cartridges is that they are made with shorter or much shorter actions. This can result in big savings in weight of the rifle & scope combo. Browning rifles are as light as 6.5 pounds. Big difference, and when you're old as dirt like me (64 & counting) the "big difference" becomes a HUGE difference.

February 23, 2005, 06:37 PM	#11
Ackley Improved User Member Join Date: January 31, 2005 Posts: 56	The Stubby MAGs Are All Hype The "new" stubby MAGs are just __ hype to sell more guns. To do that, the manufacturers must create demand with something new and glitzy – the latest and greatest. The stubby MAGs are supposed to be more accurate. But, the cognoscenti know that barrel stiffness, hand load, and quality create accuracy. This is well known among the benchrest rifle shooters (I’m one) who use the stubby 6mm BR – as well as, the highest quality, stiff (thickest), heaviest barrel allowed.