AK47 Why must we pay top dollar?

[graysmoke]

My question is this....Every time I watch the News on TV. And I see all this turmoil and anger in the Middel East, Samalia, Angola Africa, Pakistan, Indonesia.
And when the TV camera goes on an angry crowd of people, all I see are many AK47's being raised, and some being fired into the air.
Males of all ages young, and old holding an AK47 rifle....

How do they aquire and get these rifles and the ammo.?

I am shure they don't pay $500 - $1000 for the rifle. Because all those folk look like they have'nt got $50.00 to their name....
But yet here in the U S we must pay top dollar for an AK47.

WHATS UP WITH THIS.?

[Skans]

First, most of those AK's are pretty well beat up. Second, these folks probably do spend the equivalent of $500 on a beat up AK. Third, they can build them like we can build them, plus they aren't restricted from buying them from China.

[Mike Irwin]

The Middle East, like much of the world, was flooded with AKs by the Soviets.

Hey, thanks for becoming our satellite state! Have a million AKs! Here, have a billion rounds of ammo! Here, have a ready to set up plant to make your own AKs and ammo!

Not hard to get an AK over there. They may be beat up, but they're still extremely durable.

The guy who wrote the recent book on the AK notes that many 50 + year old AKs are still in service, and working fine, in Africa and other garden spots.

I forget where I read it (might have been the above book) but in some places AKs are so common that they are sold for the equivalent of a few dollars.

[Willie D]

Back in 2008 China sold Libya some huge number of AKs at $80 a piece.

But for import (and NFA) restrictions that's about what they would be worth here.

[Skans]

Back in 2008 China sold Libya some huge number of AKs at $80 a piece. ut for import (and NFA) restrictions that's about what they would be worth here.

I don't think an AK would only be worth only $80 in the US. Even in the early to mid 1980's (around 1983) a chinese AK was selling for $250 in gun shops. By 1988 they were selling from $350 - $400 for fixed stock stamped Polytech's.

Also, there is no semi-auto rifle that I know of being produced domestically that fires .223 or 7.62x39 for under $350 or so.

The Chinese SKS rifles were dirt cheap, but that's because they were dumping a bunch of old surplus rifles on us - i.e. no one was actually building them for our market. I'm sure you could buy 5-year old laptop computers for $50 a piece in bulk too.

[Stressfire]

What Mike said. Most were given to Soviet loyalists defend "the cause" and left there after Soviet withdrawal or the dissolution of the USSR, whichever happened to occur first, depending on the country.

[Ridge_Runner_5]

Not to mention the market.

It's capitalism at it's finest. If people are willing to pay more, why sell for less?

[Tom Servo]

But for import (and NFA) restrictions that's about what they would be worth here.

The other thing to consider is that the rifles on the shelf at the local gun shop aren't really AK-47's. They're semiautomatic "sporter" variations on the platform, which have been retooled with aftermarket parts.

[Mike Irwin]

"The other thing to consider is that the rifles on the shelf at the local gun shop aren't really AK-47's."

Bingo.

There is a whole different set of philosophical parameters behind the military full-auto version vs. the commercial semi-autos.

The full-auto ones are an extension of China's political philosophy. That $80 price to Libya was very likely a heavily discounted price based on political goodwill, or at least anticipation of political goodwill.

The United States does the exact same thing when it curries the favor of our allies with military aid.


The sporters, however, that are manufactured solely for sale in the United States to people like you and me? That's an extesion of China's economic philosophy, which says yeah, we may not like you much, but we're more than willing to take your money!

[Boatme98]

Because we will.

[carguychris]

Because all those folk look like they have'nt got $50.00 to their name....

Second, these folks probably do spend the equivalent of $500 on a beat up AK.

I'm reminded of a conversation I once had. Have you ever driven into a bad neighborhood and seen a house with peeling paint, a lawn overgrown with weeds, and the doors falling off the frames... yet there's a shiny late-model BMW in the driveway? Or pictures of shantytowns in third-world countries where most of the nearly-translucent run-down shacks have satellite dishes?

It's about priorities. In many of these areas of the world, I suspect that an AK serves basically the same purpose that an old V-8 Camaro served when I was in high school: it's a symbol of manhood. I'm sure that many of these young men saved 4 months pay to buy one that's old, barely works, looks awful, and was assembled from mismatched parts- but they're proud to own it, just like the high school kid with the Camaro that fits the same description.

[Willie D]

The other thing to consider is that the rifles on the shelf at the local gun shop aren't really AK-47's. They're semiautomatic "sporter" variations on the platform, which have been retooled with aftermarket parts.

Correct. But that's part and parcel with what I was saying. Without NFA or any import restrictions the US would suddenly have access to the full pool of 100,000,000+ 'real' AKs floating around the planet. New Norincos might not be selling at $80 but with that kind of supply AKs wouldn't cost $400 either. Heck, countries in Africa could probably jump-start their economies selling us AKs.

Keeping out cheap imports was part of the 1968 Gun Control Act that domestic manufacturers wholeheartedly supported and probably don't mind to this day.

[trg42wraglefragle]

If they are weapons from the Soviets they could well be genuine Izhmash made AK47, aka a top dollar one.
They could possibly even have original milled receiver ones floating around.

[Pistolgripshotty]

Its the market!

[Stressfire]

Heck, countries in Africa could probably jump-start their economies selling us AKs.

Leaving them nothing to kill each other with....wait a tick....Could the repeal of the various gun contol acts be the first step on the path to world peace?

[jimbob86]

Next question: Do you really want a flood of AK-47's and ammo for same here?

Were a FA AK-47 as cheap and easy to obtain as a used hi-point or jennings, and twice as plentiful, 10x as lethal ....... would that be a good thing?

I'm not a big fan of gun control and I like free markets, but even drinking enough pure fresh water can poison you.

[bumnote]

In Africa, I heard, you can buy 'em for $25-50, sounds cheap until you factor in the average income in Somalia, for example, is $600.
Factor the cost for the gun with what the actual income of the owner is and we're the ones getting the bargain.

[jimbob86]

+1, bumnote.

Finding a spare $25-$50 for the majority of people living in Africa would be akin the average American finding an extra Jag XJ in the driveway: not going to happen without resorting to extralegal activities.

[Microgunner]

I know several Palestinians from the neighboring business who tell me that the AKs that we buy here for $500 all day long cost $5000 where they're from and are hard to get at that price.
He claims that the stories of cheap firearms in the middle east are a fallacy.

[Patriot86]

I guess it depends on what country you are talking about.
If you are in a period of high demand; in a country like Libya that is trying to scoop up as many weapons from the people as possible I can see how they are expensive. If you like in a place like Syria; where both sides of the conflict are smuggling in small arms; including AK's I would imagine the price might be a touch lower. Just because the people of a country are poor does not mean Capitalism will not reign; a good salesmen be it a car, eggs or an AK will charge and get whatever price the market can bear.


Right now this "AK-type" rifle is on the top 10 sellers list this year @ Bud's Guns. Cheap but has pretty good reviews
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...VIP+FAST+TRACK

[carguychris]

Re: Africans being unable to pay $25-$50 for a rifle, I think that this view embraces stereotypes of Africans that aren't true, or at least aren't relevant.

See my prior post about priorities; never underestimate man's tendency to make sacrifices and spend seemingly irrational amounts of money on unnecessary or impractical items when those items are seen as status symbols in the person's peer group.

[WV_gunner]

AKs around here are worth more than $500 now. A year ago, the cheapest new Century was worth $500. Now, I see the exact gun used for $800 in stores regulary. And I've seen many for over $1000. But I've heard many stories from about 12-15 years ago about AKs being $50-$100 guns. I remember when I was 8 or 9 my dad selling an AK pistol for $80. From what my dad and his cousin tells me, in gun stores you could pick up one for less than $100. I've heard a few shop owners tell similar stories.

[KyJim]

Re: Africans being unable to pay $25-$50 for a rifle, I think that this view embraces stereotypes of Africans that aren't true, or at least aren't relevant.

I'm sure there's a wide range of incomes of individuals within each country and a wide range of average incomes between countries. I work with a woman from a fairly well to do African family but she has told me her country has no formal social support services so that starvation is a possibility for some.

Obviously, though, average incomes are very relevant to the cost of goods, especially for items which are not critical for survival. In the U.S. the gross domestic product per capita is $49,000 per year. In Liberia and Zimbabwe, it's $500 per year. CIA World Factbook. Guess who can afford to pay more for a rifle.

[Skans]

Do you really want a flood of AK-47's and ammo for same here?

Were a FA AK-47 as cheap and easy to obtain as a used hi-point or jennings, and twice as plentiful, 10x as lethal ....... would that be a good thing?

ABSOLUTELY!! Why not? Should only wealthy elites be permitted to own full-auto? Assuming that FA would still be registered and you'd still have to undergo a background check to own one, I see no problem with letting in millions of AK's at $100/piece.

The problems you see in the Middle East has nothing to do with access to guns.....or cartoons, or youtube videos.

[graysmoke]

Watching some news, about constant trouble with rebels in Rowanda.
And theres video of some 10-13 year old shirtless, under-nourished, skinny boy, holding an AK47 rifle. .....
Seeing that, Irks the crap out of me.