Help, my brass is collapsing when I seat the bullet

kingknives · October 15, 1999, 09:48 PM

.....and I don't know why! I'm using Lee Carbide Dies with brand new Remington brass and Remington 185 gr JHP's. I think I've flared the mouth as much as I can, and stil the edge of the cases are collapsing.

<img src=http://members.aol.com/kingknives/bulge.jpg>

Any clues as to what I might be doing wrong?
This is a "used" Die set that I'm using for the first time, could it be the culprit? I just finished loading 250 rounds of 9mm with a "new" die set and no problems. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!!

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Knee deep in brass, still shootin fast!

karlfitt · October 15, 1999, 10:47 PM

You mention load 250 sucsessfully, Is this the first time you are loading on you own?

I mean why now a used set of dies when you had loaded before with new ones?

If you are loading on a single stage press the only reaason I can think that your cases are colapsing is not enough bell.

There is a SLIGHT possability the bullet is getting cocked a little before it enters the case. Are you guiding the bullet into the die as you operate the handle?

If these don't help, more details will be necassary to help

Karl

zot · October 16, 1999, 12:14 AM

too much crimp too, Lee will exchange those dies for free if they break, break it?:]

kingknives · October 16, 1999, 08:06 AM

Thanks Karl,
Yes, I am new at this. That's one of the reason I mentioned that I just reloaded 250 rds of 9mm. The new die set was for the 9mm and worked fine, the used set for the .45 came with my reloader. I seem to be guiding it in okay.

Zot,
You may have an idea on the crimp. I was adjusting the bullet seating depth and I may be starting to crimp before the bullet is fully seated. I'll check it out. Thanks!

John Lawson · October 18, 1999, 03:42 PM

Some neck sizing plugs prepare the case for .451" bullets and you may be using .452"'s. A good micrometer is a wise investment and will last a lifetime if you care for it.
If you back the seater up to clear the crimp and use a separate crimping operation you will get more uniform ammo. You can use the same die set closer for the crimp and the bullet seater to just clear. Last, you should dust the inside of the case mouth with motor mica on a brush. Midway sells the whole kit to do this for very little cash outlay.

Sport45 · October 19, 1999, 08:29 AM

Are you adjusting the seating/crimping die correctly? If memory serves, the die should be backed out about 3 full turns off the shell holder. You can get in the ballpark by backing the seater and the die way out. Put a factory round in the shellholder and run the ram to the top of the stroke. Screw the die in until you feel it start to press on the case. Then screw the seater plug in until it rests on top of the bullet.

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"An unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."

Cesare Beccaria, the father of modern criminology

[This message has been edited by Sport45 (edited October 19, 1999).]

10mmrules · October 19, 1999, 11:17 AM

you need to do 4 step reloading. seat the bullet in the 3rd step only. and taper crimp in the last step. If you use a Lee factory crimp die, it will resize the Entire case also. I had the same problem with .40 caliber. the problem is that all of your brass isnt exactly the same length. therefore when you crimp you are over crimping some of the shells crushing them.

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10MM Magnum.... tried the rest, now I got the best

TheOtherMikey · November 6, 1999, 05:36 PM

I gotta say that using the 4 step reloading works wonders for me. I don't worry about crimp when I seat the bullet....that is taken care of in stage 4 where I use a Lee taper crimp die for all my auto rounds.

Lee taper crimp dies are the best money I have spent and I also use them on .223 and .308 Win rifle cartridges!

Hope this helps, Mikey

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When Guns Are Outlawed, I Will Be Another One Of The Quarter Million Violators Who Are Not Prosecuted

WalterGAII · November 7, 1999, 06:02 PM

I saw this exact problem related on another board. The reloader was, in fact, not backing the die out three turns as instructed. This is pretty common when folks get used dies with no instructions. Or they get istructions and don't read them. There simply arent any other possibilities.

October 15, 1999, 09:48 PM	#1
kingknives Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 1999 Location: SW Florida Posts: 214	.....and I don't know why! I'm using Lee Carbide Dies with brand new Remington brass and Remington 185 gr JHP's. I think I've flared the mouth as much as I can, and stil the edge of the cases are collapsing. <img src=http://members.aol.com/kingknives/bulge.jpg> Any clues as to what I might be doing wrong? This is a "used" Die set that I'm using for the first time, could it be the culprit? I just finished loading 250 rounds of 9mm with a "new" die set and no problems. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!! ------------------ Knee deep in brass, still shootin fast!

October 15, 1999, 10:47 PM	#2
karlfitt Member Join Date: October 11, 1999 Location: Loveland,CO,USA Posts: 34	You mention load 250 sucsessfully, Is this the first time you are loading on you own? I mean why now a used set of dies when you had loaded before with new ones? If you are loading on a single stage press the only reaason I can think that your cases are colapsing is not enough bell. There is a SLIGHT possability the bullet is getting cocked a little before it enters the case. Are you guiding the bullet into the die as you operate the handle? If these don't help, more details will be necassary to help Karl

October 16, 1999, 12:14 AM	#3
zot Senior Member Join Date: April 2, 1999 Location: U.S.A. Posts: 566	too much crimp too, Lee will exchange those dies for free if they break, break it?:]

October 16, 1999, 08:06 AM	#4
kingknives Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 1999 Location: SW Florida Posts: 214	Thanks Karl, Yes, I am new at this. That's one of the reason I mentioned that I just reloaded 250 rds of 9mm. The new die set was for the 9mm and worked fine, the used set for the .45 came with my reloader. I seem to be guiding it in okay. Zot, You may have an idea on the crimp. I was adjusting the bullet seating depth and I may be starting to crimp before the bullet is fully seated. I'll check it out. Thanks!

October 18, 1999, 03:42 PM	#5
John Lawson Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 1999 Posts: 281	Some neck sizing plugs prepare the case for .451" bullets and you may be using .452"'s. A good micrometer is a wise investment and will last a lifetime if you care for it. If you back the seater up to clear the crimp and use a separate crimping operation you will get more uniform ammo. You can use the same die set closer for the crimp and the bullet seater to just clear. Last, you should dust the inside of the case mouth with motor mica on a brush. Midway sells the whole kit to do this for very little cash outlay.

October 19, 1999, 08:29 AM	#6
Sport45 Senior Member Join Date: May 25, 1999 Location: Too close to Houston Posts: 4,196	Are you adjusting the seating/crimping die correctly? If memory serves, the die should be backed out about 3 full turns off the shell holder. You can get in the ballpark by backing the seater and the die way out. Put a factory round in the shellholder and run the ram to the top of the stroke. Screw the die in until you feel it start to press on the case. Then screw the seater plug in until it rests on top of the bullet. ------------------ "An unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." Cesare Beccaria, the father of modern criminology [This message has been edited by Sport45 (edited October 19, 1999).]

October 19, 1999, 11:17 AM	#7
10mmrules Senior Member Join Date: July 29, 1999 Posts: 140	you need to do 4 step reloading. seat the bullet in the 3rd step only. and taper crimp in the last step. If you use a Lee factory crimp die, it will resize the Entire case also. I had the same problem with .40 caliber. the problem is that all of your brass isnt exactly the same length. therefore when you crimp you are over crimping some of the shells crushing them. ------------------ 10MM Magnum.... tried the rest, now I got the best

November 6, 1999, 05:36 PM	#8
TheOtherMikey Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 1999 Location: Surprise, Arizona, USA Posts: 171	I gotta say that using the 4 step reloading works wonders for me. I don't worry about crimp when I seat the bullet....that is taken care of in stage 4 where I use a Lee taper crimp die for all my auto rounds. Lee taper crimp dies are the best money I have spent and I also use them on .223 and .308 Win rifle cartridges! Hope this helps, Mikey ------------------ When Guns Are Outlawed, I Will Be Another One Of The Quarter Million Violators Who Are Not Prosecuted

November 7, 1999, 06:02 PM	#9
WalterGAII Junior member Join Date: November 7, 1999 Posts: 1,516	I saw this exact problem related on another board. The reloader was, in fact, not backing the die out three turns as instructed. This is pretty common when folks get used dies with no instructions. Or they get istructions and don't read them. There simply arent any other possibilities.