Where can I buy "less lethal" shot shells?

[martin6]

My wife and I go round and round on this... She is what the military would call a "consciencious objector". She does not believe in using lethal force, even in self defense situations. She would not defend herself with "real" ammo but would use bean bag rounds, rubber bullets and the sort. Is there a source for this "less lethal" stuff for the non-LEO buyer? Any suggestions? Websites? Thanks, -martin6
PS - please keep this thread on the topic of sources for less lethal ammo and not people who disagree with the use of lethal force. Thank you.

[C.R.Sam]

Just remember "Less Lethal" does not imply non-lethal. Just usually less effective in a defensive situation.

Sam

[Dorcas]

You might want to do a search on less lethal ammo, there is alot of good discussion about how unwise it is. That said, see http://www.hi-vel.com

bkm...

[Dead]

If you are justified in using "Less Lethal" ammo you might as well use "normal" ammo. Just tell her that, the 00Buck is plastic

[Al Thompson]

Martin, several of the cop shops here carry the bean bag rounds. While they are not cheap, they can be purchased a few at a time to spread the expense.

I'm sure that your aware that these rounds need to be tested for point of aim/point of impact per the gun used. I would also think that a pump would be indicated as it would take a bunch of shooting to convince me that they are reliable in an automatic.

I would check your phone book for "police supplies" and see what you can find.

Giz

[po boy]

check out the NURFF ball site they have reloading supply products in super soft nurff balls and also one kit that just comes out and says BANG!!on a little flag the thought being the bad guy will laugh himself to death after he's done with you..It's endorced by HCI and the Brady bunch!!

[DML]

I have some Fioche shells loaded with 12 plastic 00 buck.
I tried them at 15 yards on 5 layers of heavy cardboard. They went through all 5 layers (1 1/4") with no problem at all. I think this stuff was designed to shoot at the pavement in front of rioters. A direct hit at close range might still be deadly. The recoil was like a .410.

I have seen Remington rubber buckshot loads and solid round ball loads in blister packs, but not for a long time.

[Dangus]

Get her a good paintball gun and turn the velocity up real high. At 300FPS or over, in a defense situation he WILL be bleeding severel at the kind of range involved in that.

At 350FPS, I shot a set of 5 paintballs through an old paneled mahagony door that was on it's way to the fire pile. Shot in one side and out the other. Use RPS Big Ball, it's the hardest of the .68 cal rounds that are still reliable.

No, I'm not kidding, give it some thought!

[Country Boy]

I have a catalog at home, "Firequest" if I recall, that has less than lethal rounds like rubber buckshot, rubber slugs, bean bag rounds, etc. It also has some wacky ammo like flichettes (sp) that I really wouldn't consider buying. I don't feel like hollering out "beehive!" every time I fire one of those off. I'll try and remember to find the catalog and post the infor for you.

[Zoosh]

Sounds like she should get some pepper spray, take
Aikido or something. The general wisdom seems to be
that using "less lethal" rounds could result in serious
legal trouble for a civilian shooter. If she has
a moral objection to use of lethal force in self
defense, a shotgun is obviously the wrong weapon.
The other poster who recomended a paintball gun dialed
up to a high pressure may be onto something here.

[ModIMark0]

I think that Sellier and Bellot manufactured plastic buckshot that was available in boxes of 25 rounds. It was available from The Sportsman's Guide, but I have not seen it in some time. Or perhaps it was Fiocchi.
However, I recall that the box did have warnings stating that it should be considered lethal at distances of up to 50 feet, which is really too far a distance in actual defensive shooting cases.

[jhunnetaz]

you might want to check this one out....
http://www.firequest.com/

[SDC]

You can also get "flexible baton"/beanbag rounds from http://www.mkballisticsystems.com, but it specifies that these "less than lethal" rounds can still cause death at ranges less than 12 feet; ie. at the ranges you'd expect to see in most homes. In a recent shooting near to me, one of these rounds was fired (by police) at a psycho with a knife, and the round hit him sideways between the ribs; he was DOA at the hospital. I think your wife should think over who is the more important person in her life, her or the person she's shooting at.

[Double Naught Spy]

Let your wife have the shotgun with the bean bags in it. You keep your gun loaded with whatever you want. Keep in mind that the bad person, upon hearing the shotgun shot, even if it is just a bean bag, will think she is shooting real ammo and may either retreat or attack appropriately. Just get her a BB gun like a Daisy Red Rider and let her be happy.

Funny thing I have read...those people against lethal force change their minds very quickly after having been attacked.

[Al Thompson]

Let's hope and pray that never happens.

Giz

[Quartus]

It also has some wacky ammo like flichettes (sp) that I really wouldn't consider buying.

Flechettes are deadly serious stuff, my friend. They have their place.

[VictorLouis]

If a miscreant decides to rob a store with a toy gun, that's using DEADLY FORCE. The fact that the gun was not real is moot. If you(civilian) point a SG at a NON-LETHAL threat, then you are using deadly force. The fact that the gun is loaded with 'less-than-lethal' ammo wouldn't matter, nor whether it was empty. I could see its employment for pest(as in: animal) control, but not for what you are asking.

I am not an attorney, nor do I play one on television.

[Al Thompson]

Looks like this one has run it's course.

Giz