I need some help with choosing a good shotgun...

[Big Tom]

So I was looking at a 2010 shooter's guide catalog and three model shotguns caught my eye. One I can afford now, the other two I will have to wait for a while before I can get one of them but they might just be worth it. This will be my first shotgun so I am getting a 20 gauge. So out of the following which would you reccomend?

-H&R Topper

-Century Arms Coach Gun

-Remington Spr 220

[oneounceload]

This will be my first shotgun so I am getting a 20 gauge

One aspect has nothing to do with the other.

What is the purpose for the gun?

[Big Tom]

getting familiar with handling a shotgun. I was reading up online an from what I know starting with a 20 gauge is ideal for a starting gauge. Eventually when I get better my father and I are going to be going hunting for pheasant and quail. But I also want it for home defense...

[oneounceload]

For what you mention, a 12 would be far and away the better choice. The 12 has a greater number of choices for those applications, a greater variety of easily found ammunition, and can be loaded down to 20 or even 28 gauge levels with great success more readily than a 20 can be loaded upwards. Recoil is also NOT necessarily less with a 20 because those guns tend to be lighter.

Low recoil is achieved through the use of a heavy gun with light loads. Low FELT, or perceived recoil, is achieved by doing the above with a gas-operated semi.

Home defense can be done with a 20, but is better with a 12.

Pheasants, especially late-season wildly flushing birds can be more readily taken with some nice 12 gauge loads that aren't available in a 20.

Sporting clays and other clay games are typically shot with a 12 and there are greater choices of target ammunition available.

Just some food for thought.

My suggestion would to go to a gun club (not an indoor range) and rent/borrow some guns of different types and gauges and try them for yourself to see what you like better. Go with a completely open mind and no preconceived notions for the best results.

Good luck.

[Will Fennell]

Tom,
How old are you buddy? I ask only to ascertain some understanding of your size. Assuming your are "grown up"....I would suggest a 12ga, and in your price range, try to get up the the Remington 870 Express or Mossberg pump price range. This will make a great first shotgun, that can be very versitle for you to get started with.

[the rifleer]

It doesnt really matter. 12 and 20 kick about the same. 12 kicks slightly harder, but not by much.

i recommend getting either one. when you are dealing with 20 and 12 gauge, its up to the shooter, not the gun. you cant miss and say "i would have hit it with a 12 gauge", because it isn't true. I have friends with 12 gauges and i have a 20 gauge and i shoot clays better than all of them. i think that 20 gauge was a good choice for me for my first shotgun, but i think i would have been equally well off with a 12.

the reason i took the 20 gauge over the 12 was that i was interested in a mossberg 500 with the sole purpose of busting clays, and hopefully next year hunting with it. the 20 gauge came with a screw-in choke, the 12 gauge had a cylinder bore with no choke, so i took the 20 gauge. if the 12 gauge had a choke, i would have taken it.

I am satisfied with my decision, however the only down side is that all the up grades and add-ons for the 500 are for the 12 gauge and there are very few for the 20 gauge, however i like mine stock so its no big deal.

[BigJimP]

Like others advised - recoil is primarily a function of the weight of the gun, the ounces of shot in the shell and velocity of the shell .... so a 12ga does not necessarily kick more than a 20ga .....it depends on the factors above.

Like OneOunce advised - before you buy a shotgun - spend some time at the local Trap or Skeet club / maybe rent a gun if you can --- but talk to a lot of guys on what they shoot, why .... maybe somebody will let you shoot their guns ...

As you get started on this jouney / price is often an indication of longer term quality. The question is what do you want in terms of quality / how many shells a year will you shoot ( some of us shoot 10,000 - 20,000 shells a year ). Fit is the #1 issue - so the gun hits where you look / and you need to know the stock dimensions that fit you ( drop at comb, drop at heel, length of pull )... Having said all this, a 12ga is more versatile / you can easily find loads from 7/8 oz - 1 1/8 oz in a variety of speeds ....

If none of this makes any sense / or you just want to buy a gun - then buy a pump gun with a 28" barrel for "clays" in 12ga - Browning BPS Hunter model is my personal favorite for about $ 500 / but there are others.

[hogdogs]

Home defense can be done with a 20, but is better with a 12.

FAR AND AWAY BETTER!!! Try to fing 00 buck in a 20? Rare as hens' teeth! I actually do not have #2 buck in the city I live.

With the added variety of shell options, the 12 wins right there.

Brent

[Magnum Mike]

I bought a 20 Ga. for my daughter when she was 10. When she turned 12 I got rid of it because of the following.
1. It beat her up if we use factory loads. ( reloaded just for that reason)
2. Shell selection was limited. (you can get some light loads in 12 ga.)
3. Shells generally cost more than 12 ga.
4. I wanted her to have the same ammo I use.
If I had to do it all over I'd start her with a 12 ga. 870 or an 1187.

[zippy13]

BigTom,
Unless you're very small, as noted by the esteemed Will Fennell, a 12-ga is your best choice for a first shotgun. I know small women who compete with 12-ga guns -- they shot them a lot. After you've become so proficient with the 12-ga that you're taking unfair advantage of your prey, then consider a 20-ga or smaller.

When I was young and on a limited budget, my first shotgun was a 20-ga bare bones pump gun that had been marked way down on sale. Almost immediately, I was wishing that I'd spent a little more a got a 870 Wingmaster and in 12-ga. Do yourself a favor, don't buy a compromise gun, wait and save.

[Big Tom]

Okay guys. I am a 20 years old and am on the low end of 6'3 and around 300lbs. I did handle a mossberg 88 and fell in love with the feel. But my dad sid it was a piece of junk and was a cheap gun. IDK, I liked it...but I never shot a shotgun and he's been shooting for 42 years so idk...

I did go into a walmart planning on getting the New England Pardener. But I held it and disliked the feel. I am on a low budget, but either way I still loved that mossberg...

[inSight-NEO]

My vote is the Mossberg 590. Reason? High capacity, great ergonomics, good quality and relatively inexpensive.

Of course, you are dealing with a smoothbore here, so if you are wanting range, this wont do. But, for HD (buckshot or whatever) and mid-range (using rifled slugs), this gun would do just fine.

I would recommend Benelli, but as nice as they are, they are not the most practical of the bunch. And the Remington 870 (at least the newer ones...not including the Police model)? Well...no thanks.

Oh..and in terms of gauge, Id stick with 12. Sure, the 20 may shoot "softer," but given that there are plenty of "easy" firing loads available for the 12 (and lets not forget the 12 gauge is quite versatile as well), I personally cannot justify going with less...particularly given your mentioned size. Heck, Im 5' 8" @175lbs. and can handle a 12, regardless of load. Keep in mind, Ive only been "introduced" to this weapon within the last 15 months or so.

So, again, I would skip the 20 and go with something which allows for more "mileage."

[Doyle]

Tom, that "88" was not real Mossberg. It was a Maverick. Made by the same company and with most parts that interchange with the Mossberg 500 but not made with the same level of quality. If you really liked it, then try the real Mossberg 500. It only costs about $50 more than the Maverick.

[Big Tom]

about the 500...does it come in synthetic or wooden stock? I find synthetic more comforitable....

[inSight-NEO]

about the 500...does it come in synthetic or wooden stock? I find synthetic more comforitable....

The only ones Ive seen were synthetic. BTW- Why the 500 vs. the 590? Either can be had for less than $450 if you shop around.

If you are interested in the Mossbergs, and it seems as if you are, check out there website and take a look at what they have to offer in the 500/590 line, then go from there.

Oh, and as Im mentioned before, given your size, I really do not see much need or benefit from starting with a 20 gauge. Most people recommend this for smaller individuals and/or women who may be a bit hesitant in taking on the shotgun. But, in actuality, the 12 gauge is not the beast its purported to be....particularly with the "right" loads. If we were dealing with, say, questioning whether to start with a .38 Special or a .357 Magnum or a 9mm vs. a .45ACP, I could understand. But, this is not the case as I see it.

[Big Bill]

Tom - Despite what your dad told you, Mossbergs are good guns for one just starting into shotgunning.

For and all purpose gun, I wouldn't buy a short barrel home defense only type shotgun. Just get a regular hunting type shotgun. You might even look at an over/under 12 gage Stoeger Condor or something similar. Or, perhaps even a Pardner Pump.

Then, after you get better at shooting it, add a HD shotgun. I'd recommend a Mossberg 500 or 590.

[Ricklin]

I too vote 12 ga. for you 1st shotgun. Why not look for a good used gun? Your $$$ will go farther.
The biggest issue you will have given your size is finding a shotgun that fits you! Fit is critical! Remember your eye is the rear sight on a shotgun, the gun must be mounted the same each time to be consistent.
Given your size with most guns you will have to add a recoil pad or spacer to get the Length of pull correct, and that is just the begining of proper fit. Your journey into shotgunning will be far less frustrating if the gun fits you well.

[zippy13]

I did handle a mossberg 88 and fell in love with the feel. But my dad said it was a piece of junk and was a cheap gun.

Big Tom,
You dad is partially correct, Mossbergs are cheap. But, inexpensive doesn't mean they are pieces of junk. The company goes to great efforts to produce a serviceable gun that will be a strong competitor in the entry-level gun market.

I've been shooting a little longer than your dad, and, believe me, back in those days there were some real junkers in the entry level gun arena. Thanks to Mossberg and the Remington 870 Express, the those old cheap junk models have, to a greater extent, been driven out of the market place. Figuring in the decreasing value of the dollar, today's entry level guns are fantastic bargains, you get much more bang for your buck, compared to the guns of 40+ years ago.

[the rifleer]

Mossberg is used by the military and law enforcement. The 500 works in all weather conditions, rain, sleet, snow, ice, sand, mud... its keeps working. you will notice that it is kinda loosely built. that's so that when rain, sleet, snow, ice, sand, or mud gets in it, it keeps working.

The 500 and 590 are tried and proven and work very well.

its competitor is the Remington 870, which if you look at this forum as well as other forums has had some major problems with the chambers being rough... the mossberg doesnt have this problems, or any other common problems. (actually the 590 had a bad batch of springs a while back, but thats not a 500)

I really dont want to start a 870 vs. 500 debate, but i do NOT think my 500 is a piece of crap, it has always worked when i need it to and has never had a problem. im sure that the 870 is a fine shotgun, but i'll take my 500 anyday.

[bigwrench]

Well tom, if presnted with the three choices you have provided, I would go with the H&R. It has a proven design and is american made (last time I checked). No frills but also verry reliable.

[AZwarts]

12 GA. 870 express is an AMAZING starting shotgun.

[Big Tom]

Hey guys, just so you all know my budget maxes me out at $300...so anything beyond that is a little more than I can chew...infact $300 is already pushing is by about 50-75 bucks...I did see this Century Arms Ultra 87. It kinda caught my eye because it has the option to switch out its 19 inch barrel with a 28 inch barrel that comes with it, plus it's a 12 gauge...so has anyone tried this gun or know anything about it?

[the rifleer]

its a Chinese knock off of the Remington 870. ive heard they are decent guns, but i would buy a quality gun made in American. Europeans make good guns too, but i would prefer to buy american when i can (i do have several guns that weren't made here)

I bought a mossberg 500 20 gauge with a 18.5'' barrel and a 26'' barrel with a screw in choke at Big 5 brand new in the box for $219+tax. it was tagged at $289 or something like that, but when they scanned it at the counter it was only $219. i didnt complain.

save up and buy a good quality gun, dont jump into something that you dont really want. get a mossberg 500 or a remington 870.

edit- there is nothing wrong with a used shotgun if it is in good shape. check gun shops, gun shows, and pawn shops.

[Big Tom]

I actually dont really mind the gun. I think it would be a nice gun its jus that I have never handled it. On the other hand I have handled the 88 maverick. And if the 500 is like it in feel I know for a fact I will like it. That said, I didnt like the Remington 870's feel but in a snthetic stock just maybe... So this Ultra 87 may not really be all that bad of a choice. While I do want to support American brands I also wouldn't mind supporting our over sea allies like Germany and Italy. After all I can trace my Italian roots back about 2,000 years, so why not. I know China is not really an "ally", right no they are actually in ways helping are own economy. But enough with politics...as for finding the guns you speak of at those prices where I live....well, guns in general I guess are more expensive around here. I do go to one dealer for the time being, Shooters Supply in New Castle, DE. I speacil ordered th Marlin 795ss....should be in within a week. Still can wait... and then their is walmart...but alot of the guns from the are pretty banged up (I go t the one in Elkton, Maryland). The one in New Castle has a tough crowd...their are other places, but they are hours a way from my house, not something my dad is crazy about doing....

[Sport45]

12 GA. 870 express is an AMAZING starting shotgun.

Couldn't agree more. Look in pawn shops for the best deals. If it looks good on the outside you can bet it's good on the inside. It's hard to tear up a Remmy 870.