Fixed sights

[Drummer101]

This has always sort of bugged me about most handguns. And that is fixed sights. It would bug me to no end having fixed sights and have them be and inch or half an inch off...

Is this a problem or are all pretty darn close?

[roklok]

Maybe I am lucky, but all my fixed sight guns have always been very close if not dead on out of the box. Most autoloaders with "fixed" sights can be drifted for windage, and sights can be replaced with higher or lower if needed to get the elevation right. The nice thing with fixed sights, is there is no worry about losing adjustment on a hard use or carry gun.

[Auto426]

Most modern handguns come from the factory with their sights already zeroed in using the standard load for the gun's particular caliber. In other words, if you buy a fixed sight .45 ACP handgun, it should shoot to point of aim with standard 230 gr. loads. Different weight bullets will have higher or lower points of impact. I'd say more often than not if a gun isn't shooting to point of aim, it's the shooter and not the gun. However, inaccurate guns have left the factories before, and will continue to do so in the future.

The last handgun I bought was a Ruger SP101 with a 3" barrel. It shoot right to point of aim using standard 158 gr. .357 magnums. I actually like the fixed sights on the gun, since I don't have to worry about knocking them around or tightening screws to keep the sights zeroed in.

[Drummer101]

That would bug the crap out of me...

[jaughtman]

most are not true (permanently) fixed sights - they can be drifted to correct any shooting to the right or left.

J

[drail]

The factories usually get them pretty close for the standard loading for that caliber. In shop I worked in we would install a tall front sight and file it down to the elevation needed for the customer's favorite load and then drift the rear for correct azimuth. If the ammo was consistent and the barrel centered in the slide we could get them pretty close to point of impact. Final testing was done with a Ransom mechanical rest and the target would be included with the gun. All of my 1911s wear fixed sights and all shoot exactly where the sights are looking. Change your load though and you will need to compensate a little. Adjustable sights can get knocked out of alignment pretty easy and aren't really necessary unless you're always experimenting with different loads. I always like to find "THE LOAD" and shoot nothing else. If you have fixed sights and they're off they can be regulated to your preferred ammo.

[oldkim]

You should really know that as mentioned above - factory fixed sights are designed to be spot on. Now before you go hammering away - adjusting that fixed sight.

Make sure it's not really you.

What I mean is sometimes folks think there is something "wrong" with the firearm if it consistently shoots to the left or right or low or high, etc. I find it's 99% the shooter - not the gun.

I had one guy a few years back... just came from the gun show with a new XD. I was the safety officer. After a few rounds he started hammering on the rear sights - he was shooting a bit to the left. He's not a beginner shooter. I stopped him, asked him if I could shoot a few rounds. I benchrested the firearm and shot 3 rounds dead center at 10 yards. I told him to do the same. He benched rested with sandbags (I propped up his forearms and had him tighten on his grips). He shot right on.

We sometimes get into a mentality it's the gun - not the shooter but I find it's most of the time it's the shooter not the gun.

Of course, I have dropped a few in my time and I had the front sights clear to one side.

Luckily for him he only ended up with a few dings he made with his hammer - the sights hadn't even budged.

So back to topic: fixed sights have their uses - if you are frustrated with them - buy ones you like. Seems simple to me but I'm a simple kind of guy.

[stevieboy]

I presently have 3 fixed sight guns, a 1911, a CZ 75, and a Smith & Wesson Model 36. Every one of them shoots right to point of aim provided, however, that I feed them with the right ammunition. Obviously, certain ammunition will shoot higher or lower than others. So, finding the right stuff is the trick. But, once you've found it, accuracy is more or less assured. I like the fact that I don't have to resist temptation with my fixed sight guns and adjust the rear site.

[EdInk]

I prefer fixed sights on handguns. One less thing to be finicky on a gun. I've never had to adjust any of my dovetailed sights. They've all been pretty close from the factory. The only gun I wish had a better from sight is my LCP.

[Mosin44az]

I have owned quite a few handguns at this point, close to 50, and never felt I wanted fixed sights. I can see wanting adjustable for hunting or competition, but for regular plinking or defense fixed is fine. Yes some loads hit a bit high or low, but it's easy to adjust if you know where it's likely to go.

[radom]

Murphys rule of sights...if its adjustable you will clean and dicker with the things and get them out of adjustment. Most guns I carry have fixed sights and are adjusted to point of aim and its not that hard to zero the things. Range or hunting guns then adjustable is just fine. And as for being a inch and a half off what do you expect? GPS guided bullets? My guess is you are probably more than a inch and a half off if you shoot offhand anyways so thats a silly moot idea.

[kraigwy]

Any fix sight gun can be adjusted and done right with the right equipment.

I use to do a lot of adjusting of adjustable sights when I was in the gun tinkering business.

BUT

The first thing I would do is shoot the gun, with the proper ammo and see if its really the gun. For example fixed sight 38 revolvers are designed to shoot 158 grn bullets. That normally takes care of elevation. You can shop around for different ammo until you find the ammo that shoots in your gun where you want it to shoot.

As far as windage, its often the placement of the trigger finger that determines which way the gun will shoot. You can adjust for windage by adjusting the trigger finger. Push the finger in the direction you want to move the impact. If you are shooting left, and want to move the impact right, pull your finger a bit out of the trigger guard. If shooting right and want to move left, push your finger deeper into the trigger guard.

This will take care of 90% of your fixed sight problems.

However for the rear occasions the sights are really off, take the gun to a smith who has a milling machine and knows how to use it, and knows the math to figure how much can be shaved to move the sights. It doesn't take much to move the impact on short barrel guns.

So in short, if you really find you have sight problems on a fixed sight pistol, forget the hammer, file, pliers, etc. Use the proper tool, if done right it will fixed the problem and you'll never be able to tell you've done any work on the gun.

[Reloadkid]

I tried an adjustable rear sight and was constantly fooling around with the settings and wasting ammo.

I got too aggravated and went back to my fixed sights. I felt like I was not getting the performance in accuracy as I expected. Perhaps I was not patient enough but at least I know how my shots are grouping, they are on target, and I am no longer wasting ammo from making adjustments.

Maybe some day I will go back and try it again.

[kraigwy]

In pistols ( and in rifles) forget about adjusting three round shot groups and trying to adjust the group to the center.

Go at it like you are patterning a shotgun.

Get a bullseye 25 yard rapid fire target and shoot 20 - 25 rounds. Take the target and draw a like down the center of the bullseye, 12 to 6 o'clock. Now draw another line from 9 to 3 o'clock. You now have 4 quarters. Count the rounds in each quarter. Some will have more rounds then the other quarters. Adjust a click or two from the quarter with the most shots toward the quarter with the least shots.

Shoot again. Forget about little tiny groups, thats what discourages people. Keep shooting and adjusting ( a click or two at a time) until you get an equal number of shoots in each quarter of the target.

In rifle shooting we call this determining your true, no-wind, zero.

[SIGSHR]

To quote a popular song from 1971 or so "When they're hot, they're hot-when they're not they're not." I would distinguish between pistols with drift adjustable rear sights and revolvers with fixed ones. I recall Skeeter Skelton said fixed sighted guns usually shot to the right for him and Charlie Askins said he selected the Colt New Service in 38 Special for the Border Patrol and made a tool to adjust the front sight for windage-I have never seen a description of it though. When they're right on, they're terrific, when they're not....
Also I have found most "drift adjustable" rear sights are wedged in so tight that you really have to hammer on them-I have ruined a couple of brass punches that way. Better to use some sort of pusher tool-or make your own.

[Drummer101]

The reason for me asking is the CZ 75B has fixed sights but to get adjustable ones you have to go up to the CZ 85 Combat.

[KyJim]

One advantage of fixed sights is that they won't be knocked out of whack with everyday carry or rough use. This is particularly helpful in a defensive handgun.

If you shoot at different distances, with different bullet weights, or in windy conditions, you are going to have use Kentucky windage with adjustable sights anyway unless you want to constantly be adjusting sights.

[The Great Mahoo]

I rather like fixed sights, simply because they don't get bumped from where they belong. Thereare lots of variables in shooting different loads, different distances, etc; so much that I don't find fixed sights to be that much of a problem. Then again, most every gun has been pretty dead on right out of the box.

[2afreedom]

Fixed sights are really no big issue. The windage can be adjusted fairly easily and you just adjust your point of aim if you need to shoot higher or lower. For a carry gun I prefer fixed sights because they are usually harder to damage.

[Sarge]

Drummer, I can't stand a gun to shoot 'off' and I don't want anything but fixed sights on my hard-use handguns- which is pretty well all of them. I've lost my aversion to beating, filing, twisting or anything else it takes to get them zeroed to a chosen load.

To me the only thing that matters is that they are zeroed to 50 yards. After that, the only downside is that I can't blames misses on the gun anymore.

[Hawg]

I prefer fixed sights and most of mine hit pretty close to POA laterally. If they shoot too low I can file the front sight down If too high I can use less of front sight in rear. If they're off laterally I just learn where to aim. No biggie.

[Daryl]

This has always sort of bugged me about most handguns. And that is fixed sights. It would bug me to no end having fixed sights and have them be and inch or half an inch off...

Amigo, if you can shoot well enough to keep your shots in a half inch, or even an inch at an "acceptable" handgun distance (most folks like to shoot 25 yards or so, but 10 is good too), then buy a gun with adjustable sights.

Don't take me wrong, because it's entirely possible, but if all of your bullets hit your target within a half inch of where you aim, be happy.

In fact, be VERY happy.

I like fixed sights. Drift adjustable are fine too. Fully adjustable sights are more fragile, and can break at times. They're great for range shooting, but not-so-great for hard, heavy use.

I once found that out the hard way on a bear hunt using a Ruger Super Blackhawk. Ruger was great to deal with, and they sent me a new site free of charge, but that was after my hunt was over. Ol' Murphy is evil.

But don't sweat the small stuff; if fixed sights are going to bug you, then buy your handguns with adjustable sights.

Easy fix, right?

Daryl

[44 AMP]

Because I really like to be able to have my guns shoot where I aim. Not the other way around.

Fixed sights come zeroed from the factory for one load, at one range. And not every one looks through the sights the same way.

Depending on the use of the gun, fixed sights don't bother me much, however I find adjustble sights very preferable for some guns. I prefer them on my .22s. And on magnums. Got no problem with fixed sights on belly guns.

Everybody knows "adjustable sights are too fragile, too easily knocked out of wack".....I don't see that as true today. A century ago, when adjustable sights were flimsy target sights that sat high up off the frame, ok, I buy that.

But not so much today. Yes, I know that they are not quite as rugged as fixed sights, but to be honest, I don't put my guns through that kind of abuse. Guess I don't lead the same kind of life as some guys.

Fixed sights can be adjusted, by modifiying the gun. Once changed, there's no easy way back. Actually I rarely adjust adjustable sights. But I like having the ability to do so, when and if I need to. I shoot different bullet weights, different velocities, and different ranges, and I like to be able to fine tune things if I want.

Not all handgunning is 7yd self defense shooting. How many .44 magnums come with fixed sights? I can only think of two, the Ruger Vaquero (to keep its Colt SAA appearance) and the Desert Eagle (and I have no idea why they don't come with an adjustable sight as standard, except to be cheap).

None of my Contender barrels have fixed sights, its either adjustable or a scope base (and a scope is an adjustable sight!).

Fixed sights are way better than no sights. Fixed sights are fine for a lot of shooting. But for my use, if I have the option, I'll pick adjustable sights, every time. I have about a half dozen fixed sight handguns. I have a bit more than that with adjustable sights. And none of my rifles has fixed sights. Ever wonder why?

[L_Killkenny]

BIG +1 .44 AMP.

For a small SD gun fixed sights are fine and probably preferable. But for any other shooting adjustable sights, a minimum of drift adjustable, are a requirement IMO.

LK

[Kreyzhorse]

I prefer fixed sights or drift sights to fully adjustable sights. I've never had an issue with any handgun where it shot outside of the sight picture and have never even had to even adjust my drift sight models.