Mossberg's 464 Tactical 30-30 & 7.62x39

[Smork]

Hey guys, I'm new to this forum. I joined out of the complete lack of information seems to be plaguing the web, or maybe what I want to do just can't or hasn't ever been done before.

As the thread name suggests, I own Mossberg's tactical 30-30 and while I know the die hard lever gun fans out there hate it, I love it and wouldn't trade it for nothing.


I have not been able to find the information I need so I'm hoping to pick some brains here.

I have once fired, cleaned, trimmed, re-sized, and primed brass.

Due to the lack of firearm resources on the interweb I purchased 100 Hornady .310" 7.62x39 123 gr Z-Max bullets with polymer pointed tips.

The only powder I have access to is Alliant Reloder 17. I speculate this powder may be acceptable due to the fact that the 464 SPX 30-30 has a 16.25" long barrel and the web site says RL 17's alternate use is medium rifle powder though it does not provide any data for the 30-30 caliber cartridge.

I have access to 30-30 and .308 reloading dies, tools, and a press.

What I am having trouble finding; because these bullets are not typically used in the 30-30 caliber as the guns are usually tube fed and the bullets pointed, and the powder isn't usually used for this round either, what I need to know is can it be done, has it been done, and if so how many grains of this RL 17 powder should I start out with?

I do not have the money to buy appropriate bullets even if I could find them and my friend was lucky enough to find the powder he did much less any powder at all. I'm sure you guys understand that with the scarcity of affordable items on today's market it's either make do or just don't at this point.

Any advice, experience, tips tricks and techniques out there are welcome as there is what I perceive to be a general scarcity of 30-30 data both on this forum and the web.

Thanks guys!

[jimbob86]

.310" bullets forced down a barrel designed for .308" bullets in a gun designed for a cartridge that operates at around 40K PSI ...... that there sounds like a recipe for, at best, unnecessary gun beating harshness, and an extremely short termed exciting event, at worst.

Use the correct ammunition components.

It will be cheaper in the long run- guns are expensive, and gunsmiths don't work cheap. Doctors, even more so.

[Boomer58cal]

I concur! Please don't use .310 in a .308. Bad jew jew. Bad idea. Bad form. I wouldn't tell my worst enemy to try this. It may send hot, smoking shrapnel towards someone I do care about. Be safe friend. Never try something like this. It's bad enough I've seen people rap electrical tape around the neck of a 30-30 and shoot it out of a 32 special. If I had some spares I'd send you a box of sst's just to stop you. I'm so glad you asked. Please be safe.

Edit...
I thought I'd recommend 140 gn Hornady ftx. My friend has a Remington 788(I think that's right) in 30-30. It's bolt action and clip fed. Definitely has more range than my 94 30-30's with round nose. The FTX(flex tip expanding) was specifically designed for the 30-30 with inline magazines but work well in any 30-30. I know money is tight so good luck.

[steve4102]

Sorry wrong bullet, wrong powder.
R-17 is too slow for the 30-30.

[Magnum Wheel Man]

as far as the powder... I don't have my loading info here, but you can also look for 30-30 loading data for the Contender, & may find some more powders to choose from...

as far as the oversized bullet, people do it more than most realize, if your bore is on the tight side of spec, & the bullets on the loose side, but I wouldn't recomend doing it on purpose with a jacketed bullet...

[jimbob86]

I had good results with H335 and 150gr bullets in 30/30.

I did have one good RL-15 load, but it was with a 170gr Partition (not a good whitetail load, BTW).

[Smork]

Thanks guys I really appreciate the input. I just spent the last of my money on 300 Sierra pro-hunter 170 gr fn bullets.
Unfortunately I can do nothing about the type of powder I have.
AlliantPowder's RL 17
I went onto alliantpowder.com and looked at the powder information again and it said that it has a similar burn speed to IMR 4350 with added velocity. Do you think it would be ok to try this powder with this bullet? My barrel is only 16 1/4" long.

[Smork]

The site has 308 Winchester information using a Speer 180 gr bullet and 48.7 gr of Reloder 17 for a velocity of 2,641. If it can be used in .308 winchester why cant it be used in 30-30?

[mikld]

I would say trying to exrapolate data form one powder to another, without a lot of reloading experience, could be disastrous, likely you'd damage your gun, if not lose some fingers. It sounds like you need info. and while I understand you're on a tight budget, you will need certain things to learn to reload safely; A copy of The ABCs of Reloading, Lyman's 49th Edition Reloading handbook, and since you'r using Sierra bullets get a Sierra manual. Check the library, look at used book stores., etc...

[griz]

The site has 308 Winchester information using a Speer 180 gr bullet and 48.7 gr of Reloder 17 for a velocity of 2,641. If it can be used in .308 winchester why cant it be used in 30-30?

Even though they are somewhat close in length, the 308 has a good bit more case capacity, and the 30-30 operates at a lot lower pressure. So R-17 just isn't well suited for the 30-30.

On a side note, I wish I was in your town, I would love to trade you a pound of 322 for the bullets you don't need. But shipping makes it impractical.

Hope you find a proper powder.

[jimbob86]

The site has 308 Winchester information using a Speer 180 gr bullet and 48.7 gr of Reloder 17 for a velocity of 2,641. If it can be used in .308 winchester why cant it be used in 30-30?

The 308WIN was designed to operate around 60K PSI, in modern guns made with the metallurgy of the middle of the 20th Century. It was an attempt to get 30-06 performance out of a shorter case.

The 30/30WIN was designed to operate under 40K PSI, in lever action guns made with the metallugy of the late 19th Century. It was one of the very first smokless powder centerfire rifle cartridges- it's competitors were all low pressure black powder cartridges, so though it is not terribly high powered compared to modern rounds, it sure was when it came out!

[Nathan]

Don't make load data like this.

If you think you have a hot combo which was overlooked, call the bullet or powder maker and ask. I have gotten help like this, but my guesses were never good enough.

[Boomer58cal]

As a kid I watched my father work up many, many loads with different powders in different cartridges. The way he did this is by finding another similar cartridges or even better 3 or 4 cartridges that use that powder and make an educated guess. If you can't find a particular powder in a very similar cartridge there is probably a good reason. It is probably unsafe, performs badly or burns to fast or slowly for the barrel length that particular cartridge is most commonly produced with. R-17 will probably launch a projectile out of your barrel. How well or how safely you cannot know without testing. If you don't have the proper knowledge and equipment to do this safely then don't do it. Be safe.