Glaser Opinions

madmurdoc · November 27, 2004, 04:37 PM

I know what they say about opinions so just let them fly anyway.

What do you think about Glaser Saftey Slugs? Are they reliable? Do they actually reduce ricochet and over penetration? I am interested in them as home defense ammo not for carry.

I have also heard that there is increased liability in civil suits that involve them. I don't trust where I heard this, but I do wonder if anyone else has heard this and if there is any proof behind it.

If it comes down to shelling out cash or protecting my family, I choose to pay the bill.

Jeff Gonzales · November 27, 2004, 04:44 PM

Quote:

If it comes down to shelling out cash or protecting my family, I choose to pay the bill.

You really cannot be wrong for having this attitude. I will tell you this, they are poor performers at stopping dedicated humans. Speaking of humans, they make great backstops, so find something that fits into your situation and train with it, train hard with it.

When that days comes, do what you trained to do and worry about your family first, legal ramifications second.

Also, feel free to do a search of previous threads. There is a wealth of knowledge already posted that may answer your questions. Yes, I know it takes a little bit of time to go through the volumes collected here, but it is worth it and it is free

camaroman · November 27, 2004, 09:56 PM

my .02$--

The Glaser /Mag Safe type ammo is a great idea for home defense and reduces penetration through walls etc etc. I have had feeding problems with glasers and therefore stick with magsafe for home defense. I have never seen proof of suits involved in this type of ammo. It is for sale to the public as a defense ammo. There will always be someone trying to twist the facts, but that could happen regardless. Whatever you choose, take it to a range and test it in your firearm.

Tamara · November 27, 2004, 11:03 PM

When they work well, they work very well, and when they fail, they fail spectacularly.

I'd rather not rely on a round that depends on such narrow parameters to function properly; if you get a lightly-clad opponent and are able to hit him square on in the torso without any intervening obstacles, such as his arms or weapon, getting in the way, they should perform well. Given the slim odds of that happening, I prefer a more general purpose loading.

pax · November 27, 2004, 11:34 PM

Quote:

What do you think about Glaser Saftey Slugs? Are they reliable? Do they actually reduce ricochet and over penetration? I am interested in them as home defense ammo not for carry.

Last year, a friend of mine built a mock-up of a typical home exterior wall -- sheet rock, insulation, plywood, and siding. We rigged up a shelf behind the wall and set jugs of water on the shelf. Then we shot at the wall with various types of ammunition, from a distance of ~15 feet.

One of our observers had Glasers in her carry gun and asked us to shoot it. If I remember correctly, it was 9mm blue.

Glasers penetrated the wall just as easily and thoroughly as all other ammunition had done.

Personally, I wouldn't rely on it to be a magic bullet. If I were looking at home defense, I would look most carefully at the possible lines of attack and figure safe angles from there.

pax

Danindetroit · November 28, 2004, 01:19 AM

It looks like Glaser penetrates about 5 inches of gelatin. It does not say if it is a blue or silver glaser.

This has a test of Magsafe which uses #2 copper plated birdshot.

http://www.firearmstactical.com/tact...article432.htm

Mannlicher · November 28, 2004, 08:16 PM

I have no use for Glaser products. They may be fine, but I just don't trust them. My gut instinct keeps telling me that penetration is NOT a bad thing.

Jeff Gonzales · November 28, 2004, 08:22 PM

Quote:

My gut instinct keeps telling me that penetration is NOT a bad thing

Nicely put, couldn't agree with you more.

45 Fu · November 28, 2004, 08:57 PM

Many good points on the "con" side, of which I will also side with. The dynamic results you are supposed to get with them is aided by velocity. This velocity is aided by the light weight of the bullet. If the bullet does not fragment then the only thing you have going for you is what it will put a hole in as it penetrates. That is where the light weight comes back to bite you on the butt - you now have very expensive and light, shallow penetrating ball ammo which is not a good thing.

Find a JHP that functions 100% in your particular weapon and practice with it. Don't believe the hype. The best bullet design can never compensate for poor shot placement and very few things, excepting dumb luck, will ever trump a well trained and highly motivated individual intent on living.

DT Guy · November 29, 2004, 08:13 AM

Picture a Glaser hitting an intervening arm (Miama/FBI style) and you'll get right off the idea...

Larry

madmurdoc · November 30, 2004, 03:38 PM

Thanks for all the input, everyone. Looks like I'm going to stick with my Federal Hydra-Shoks.

Tom2 · November 30, 2004, 06:10 PM

And who the heck could afford to do any meaningful practice or testing with the Glasers? That is what concerns me. Testing for feeding and reliability with them would put a serious dent in the bank account, if you could find them at any shop in sufficient quantity to do so. Now I am chapped at the ammo makers that want to cut up the old 50 rd. boxes and sell cute little ammo packs with 20-25 rds so they can make more money. Buy a stack of those to practice with and see what it costs. Still some good choices in large boxes for most cal's, though. But not the trendy botique bullets.

sjstill · December 12, 2004, 05:14 PM

Funny, was thinking of Glasers for the P3AT I carry on my vest on duty, but I believe I'll stick with the Winchester STHP's

I love this site!!

DT Guy · December 12, 2004, 11:23 PM

Especially in smaller calibers, I worry about not getting enough penetration.

In fact, when I carried a .25 in my vest as an LEO, I carried a mag with two expanding points backed by FMJs, just to make sure I could eventually reach something vital....

Larry

Ex-MA Hole · December 14, 2004, 08:24 PM

For my HD gun, the 1st 2 rounds are Glasers- the other 3 and all speed loaders, as well as stuff hidden around the house, are Federal Hydra-Shoks.

My rationalle is this- I have a wife and an infant. I figure/ hope that the first shot or two will be upon detection in a hallway/ doorway. I don't want to take a chance if I can have a quick stop. After that, I assume the bad guy is in a room, and I may need to go through a wall to get him/ her.

DarkKnight01 · December 14, 2004, 09:10 PM

these things are the shot shell things right? kinda like a shotgun round? not sure what exactly these things are but from what ive heard about their only use is very close range killing small critters... if your looking to avoid over penetration but yet want to drop the target get yourself a shotgun... even a .410 loaded with a good steel shot will be quite effective and you can avoid over penetration.... there was a post here somewhere that showed a pic of a S&W handgun type weapon that held either 5 or 6 rounds of .410... it was pretty neat looking =) id like to pick one up just for fun.

my .02

madmurdoc · December 14, 2004, 11:26 PM

DK

Glasers Safety Slugs are frangmenting bullets not the CCI Shotshells. They claim to reduce overpenetration and ricochet. There is a thread running in the General Handgun forum about those things. If I want BBs, I'll grab my 12 ga and make sure the job is done.

DarkKnight01 · December 15, 2004, 04:10 PM

ahh ok thx for clearing that up

rkc · December 17, 2004, 08:05 AM

one advantage over magsafe- quality control is so much better with Glaser
lots of flattened primers, etc with magsafe. stick with revolver only with either unless you can afford to do function test

Vanguard.45 · December 17, 2004, 10:59 AM

They do a helluva lot of damage to whatever they hit, be it arm, leg, torso, head, whatever!

Say what you will, the Glaser would not brighten up anyone's day! Some people here make it sound like a criminal having been hit with one would begin rejoicing ("Oh, Thank God this cat's using Glasers!").

No, it may not penetrate 12", but when your stomach or arm looks like a saucy pepperoni pizza, I think you'll probably be wishing you hadn't stepped up on whoever's dishing them out.

Just a thought.

Vanguard.45

Mute · December 17, 2004, 11:27 AM

The guy might not be rejoicing, but he may still be able to fire back at you with his gun or continue to try and stab you with his knife. The Glasers haven't really shown themselves to be any more effective than standard hollowpoints and in some cases have shown themselves to be ineffective altogether. Like Tamara said earlier, the parameters for effectiveness is just too narrow.

SemperFi Wireguy · December 17, 2004, 11:30 AM

Hey, with any luck you'll catch them coming through the front door one behind the other and get a two-fer!

Danindetroit · December 28, 2004, 11:41 PM

The diagram above of Ballistic Gellatin, has a scale in cm not inches. That means it penetrated 120 cm or less than 4.75". That would have to be a paper thin person to get a thru and thru. It most likely will not even reach vitals.

November 27, 2004, 04:37 PM	#1
madmurdoc Member Join Date: November 23, 2004 Location: Southeast Michigan Posts: 94	Glaser Opinions I know what they say about opinions so just let them fly anyway. What do you think about Glaser Saftey Slugs? Are they reliable? Do they actually reduce ricochet and over penetration? I am interested in them as home defense ammo not for carry. I have also heard that there is increased liability in civil suits that involve them. I don't trust where I heard this, but I do wonder if anyone else has heard this and if there is any proof behind it. If it comes down to shelling out cash or protecting my family, I choose to pay the bill.

November 27, 2004, 09:56 PM	#3
camaroman Senior Member Join Date: December 28, 2001 Location: Clear Lake, Texas Posts: 115	my .02$-- The Glaser /Mag Safe type ammo is a great idea for home defense and reduces penetration through walls etc etc. I have had feeding problems with glasers and therefore stick with magsafe for home defense. I have never seen proof of suits involved in this type of ammo. It is for sale to the public as a defense ammo. There will always be someone trying to twist the facts, but that could happen regardless. Whatever you choose, take it to a range and test it in your firearm. __________________ I shoot chickens out of a canon at airplanes

November 27, 2004, 11:03 PM	#4
Tamara Moderator Emeritus Join Date: March 11, 2000 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 16,002	When they work well, they work very well, and when they fail, they fail spectacularly. I'd rather not rely on a round that depends on such narrow parameters to function properly; if you get a lightly-clad opponent and are able to hit him square on in the torso without any intervening obstacles, such as his arms or weapon, getting in the way, they should perform well. Given the slim odds of that happening, I prefer a more general purpose loading. __________________ MOLON LABE! 2% Unobtainium, 98% Hypetanium. The Arms Room: An Online Museum.

November 28, 2004, 08:16 PM	#7
Mannlicher Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2001 Location: North Central Florida & Miami Posts: 3,209	I have no use for Glaser products. They may be fine, but I just don't trust them. My gut instinct keeps telling me that penetration is NOT a bad thing. __________________ Nemo Me Impune Lacesset "The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so.".........Ronald Reagan

November 29, 2004, 08:13 AM	#10
DT Guy Senior Member Join Date: February 4, 2001 Posts: 959	Picture a Glaser hitting an intervening arm (Miama/FBI style) and you'll get right off the idea... Larry __________________ He who fights and runs away had better run pretty damn fast. Government, Anarchy and Chaos

November 28, 2004, 01:19 AM	#6
Danindetroit Senior Member Join Date: October 1, 2004 Location: Detroit Posts: 757	It looks like Glaser penetrates about 5 inches of gelatin. It does not say if it is a blue or silver glaser. This has a test of Magsafe which uses #2 copper plated birdshot. http://www.firearmstactical.com/tact...article432.htm

November 28, 2004, 08:57 PM	#9
45 Fu Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Posts: 422	Many good points on the "con" side, of which I will also side with. The dynamic results you are supposed to get with them is aided by velocity. This velocity is aided by the light weight of the bullet. If the bullet does not fragment then the only thing you have going for you is what it will put a hole in as it penetrates. That is where the light weight comes back to bite you on the butt - you now have very expensive and light, shallow penetrating ball ammo which is not a good thing. Find a JHP that functions 100% in your particular weapon and practice with it. Don't believe the hype. The best bullet design can never compensate for poor shot placement and very few things, excepting dumb luck, will ever trump a well trained and highly motivated individual intent on living.

November 30, 2004, 03:38 PM	#11
madmurdoc Member Join Date: November 23, 2004 Location: Southeast Michigan Posts: 94	Thanks Thanks for all the input, everyone. Looks like I'm going to stick with my Federal Hydra-Shoks. __________________ Always remember: safety first, last, and always. Michigan Constitution, Declaration of Rights, Sec. 5. "Every person has a right to bear arms for the defense of himself and the state."

November 30, 2004, 06:10 PM	#12
Tom2 Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2004 Location: Ohio Posts: 5,676	Moola involved And who the heck could afford to do any meaningful practice or testing with the Glasers? That is what concerns me. Testing for feeding and reliability with them would put a serious dent in the bank account, if you could find them at any shop in sufficient quantity to do so. Now I am chapped at the ammo makers that want to cut up the old 50 rd. boxes and sell cute little ammo packs with 20-25 rds so they can make more money. Buy a stack of those to practice with and see what it costs. Still some good choices in large boxes for most cal's, though. But not the trendy botique bullets.

December 12, 2004, 05:14 PM	#13
sjstill Senior Member Join Date: August 18, 2004 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 108	Funny, was thinking of Glasers for the P3AT I carry on my vest on duty, but I believe I'll stick with the Winchester STHP's I love this site!! __________________ My name is Steve, and I'm a Glockaholic. The primary target is what we call the thoracic triangle. Shots to this area tend to make people FDGB (“fall down go boom”).

December 12, 2004, 11:23 PM	#14
DT Guy Senior Member Join Date: February 4, 2001 Posts: 959	Especially in smaller calibers, I worry about not getting enough penetration. In fact, when I carried a .25 in my vest as an LEO, I carried a mag with two expanding points backed by FMJs, just to make sure I could eventually reach something vital.... Larry __________________ He who fights and runs away had better run pretty damn fast. Government, Anarchy and Chaos

December 14, 2004, 08:24 PM	#15
Ex-MA Hole Member Join Date: September 8, 2004 Location: Concord, New Hampsha' Posts: 26	For my HD gun, the 1st 2 rounds are Glasers- the other 3 and all speed loaders, as well as stuff hidden around the house, are Federal Hydra-Shoks. My rationalle is this- I have a wife and an infant. I figure/ hope that the first shot or two will be upon detection in a hallway/ doorway. I don't want to take a chance if I can have a quick stop. After that, I assume the bad guy is in a room, and I may need to go through a wall to get him/ her. __________________ Ex-MA Hole on APS and THR, too.

December 14, 2004, 09:10 PM	#16
DarkKnight01 Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2004 Posts: 173	these things are the shot shell things right? kinda like a shotgun round? not sure what exactly these things are but from what ive heard about their only use is very close range killing small critters... if your looking to avoid over penetration but yet want to drop the target get yourself a shotgun... even a .410 loaded with a good steel shot will be quite effective and you can avoid over penetration.... there was a post here somewhere that showed a pic of a S&W handgun type weapon that held either 5 or 6 rounds of .410... it was pretty neat looking =) id like to pick one up just for fun. my .02 __________________ MOLON LABE!!

December 14, 2004, 11:26 PM	#17
madmurdoc Member Join Date: November 23, 2004 Location: Southeast Michigan Posts: 94	DK Glasers Safety Slugs are frangmenting bullets not the CCI Shotshells. They claim to reduce overpenetration and ricochet. There is a thread running in the General Handgun forum about those things. If I want BBs, I'll grab my 12 ga and make sure the job is done. __________________ Always remember: safety first, last, and always. Michigan Constitution, Declaration of Rights, Sec. 5. "Every person has a right to bear arms for the defense of himself and the state."

December 15, 2004, 04:10 PM	#18
DarkKnight01 Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2004 Posts: 173	ahh ok thx for clearing that up __________________ MOLON LABE!!

December 17, 2004, 08:05 AM	#19
rkc Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 2001 Location: South Posts: 295	one advantage over magsafe- quality control is so much better with Glaser lots of flattened primers, etc with magsafe. stick with revolver only with either unless you can afford to do function test __________________ rkc

December 17, 2004, 10:59 AM	#20
Vanguard.45 Senior Member Join Date: February 24, 2001 Location: NW Indiana Posts: 277	I wouldn't want to get hit with one! They do a helluva lot of damage to whatever they hit, be it arm, leg, torso, head, whatever! Say what you will, the Glaser would not brighten up anyone's day! Some people here make it sound like a criminal having been hit with one would begin rejoicing ("Oh, Thank God this cat's using Glasers!"). No, it may not penetrate 12", but when your stomach or arm looks like a saucy pepperoni pizza, I think you'll probably be wishing you hadn't stepped up on whoever's dishing them out. Just a thought. Vanguard.45 __________________ "I came into this world with nothin', and I still got most of it."

December 17, 2004, 11:27 AM	#21
Mute Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 1998 Location: Diamond Bar, CA Posts: 852	The guy might not be rejoicing, but he may still be able to fire back at you with his gun or continue to try and stab you with his knife. The Glasers haven't really shown themselves to be any more effective than standard hollowpoints and in some cases have shown themselves to be ineffective altogether. Like Tamara said earlier, the parameters for effectiveness is just too narrow.

December 17, 2004, 11:30 AM	#22
SemperFi Wireguy Member Join Date: October 20, 2004 Location: Land of the Free Posts: 40	Hey, with any luck you'll catch them coming through the front door one behind the other and get a two-fer! __________________ "We're surrounded, that simplifies our problem." Gen. Lewis B. "Chesty" Puller - USMC

December 28, 2004, 11:41 PM	#23
Danindetroit Senior Member Join Date: October 1, 2004 Location: Detroit Posts: 757	The diagram above of Ballistic Gellatin, has a scale in cm not inches. That means it penetrated 120 cm or less than 4.75". That would have to be a paper thin person to get a thru and thru. It most likely will not even reach vitals.