What's wrong with MAC-10?

[AK103K]

Let me look around, I'm sure I've got it here somewhere.

[shaggy]

There is currently no MG34 upper conversion for the MAC type guns. BRP makes an MG34 upper conversion unit for the M16; the XMG-99 - it runs about $4k.

From what I've heard, either Len Savage or Ernie from SOCOM (and quite possibly both working together since Ernie seems to still be having some legal troubles) are re-starting the RPD upper project for the MAC. Again, as I understand it, the price should be around $4k, but I've also heard prices could be as high as $7k.

[AK103K]

There is currently no MG34 upper conversion for the MAC type guns.

This does now seem to be the case. The link I had is now dead, as are the couple I found while doing a search. I do remember seeing one with a M11/9mm lower replacing the trigger group of a MG34. They even had video if I remember correctly.

[Zsnark]

Hi there SMG buffs,

I have both items mentioned earlier. Here I present my opinion, I won't share the other at present.

Seems to me that if you did all the things the MAC needs to make it better you'd have an entirely different piece. Also, it would cost many bucks.

Going back to my original admittedely cursory experience with MAC 10 (in 9mm), Uzi (full size, folder, 9mm), and the MP5. I repeat that the H&K MP5 is a thoroghbred, the Uzi is a workman's tool, and the MAC 10 is a cheapie along the lines of the WW2 Sten gun. It works. I ain't any where near perfect.

You really can't compare the MAC because it was designed for cheap, mass production and I am sure if Ingram, the designer, sat back and conjured up a perfect SMG it would have been better in every way than the one which was produced.

Thought I'd throw my two centys in to keep the conversation going.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/newr...e=1&p=1704085#
Big Grin
AAW

[shaggy]

The MAC type guns can indeed be made competitive with far more expensive guns, and at quite a reasonable cost overall. The results of the national subgun matches at KCR are testament to that - M11 shooters often beat MP5's in the open class. The TASK slow-fire conversion only costs a few hundred bucks, or can be done at home if you've handy with tools. Richard Lage is in the process of developing a slow-fire upper which brings the RoF down to about 600rpm. The crude sights of the M11 can be replaced with an HK type sights. Personally, I've used an almost bone-stock M11 in competition and done better than guys with far more expensive guns (all that was done to mine was a k-grip was added, and the wobbly wire stock was welded to the open position). Practice makes perfect, and while an out of the box M11 is no match for an MP5, some modifications can make it competitive for a shooter who takes the time to practice. All in all, for significantly less than the price of a $14,000 MP5 or a $6500 Uzi, an M11 can be modified to be quite competitive with those weapons.

[Sleuth]

I have had the chance to shoot around 200 different machinguns over the last 20 years (I have some very nice friends with big collections), including most variations of the MAC. In it's original format, straight from the factory, the MAC is (compared to almost all others) bulky, awkward, blocky, crude, and hard to hit with. It is totally lacking any ergonomics, grace or style.

It is inexpensive, reliable (if well maintained), and, as noted, can be modified into something it is not, a controllable, usefull, subgun.

It's a mostly free country, if you like it, by all means buy and enjoy one.

[czc3513]

Have you seen this before?
http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg37-e.htm

[CQBArms]

Problem with that is it's a post sample and not a transferable.

[Sleuth]

I got to shoot one of those as well - the only problem I had with it was because of the design of the stock, it pulled at my beard with ever shot. It made it less than pleasurable.

Is Ruger still making them??