Why are Democrats unwelcome on gun-related forums? - Page 2

Tucker 1371 · June 11, 2009, 11:03 PM

Welcome to TFL, you'll catch no crap from me. While Democrats may confuse the bejeezes out of me I do my best to respect and consider everyone's opinions. It wouldn't be America if you couldn't vote how you wanted.

Any .45 · June 11, 2009, 11:03 PM

Succeeded at what, welcoming him? I believe I did, I told him ask questions, share your knowledge and a quick basic tfl rule, don't be sensitive. Which I don't think he has been, he's just standing up for himself as we all do, from time to time here on TFL.

.......

THEZACHARIAS · June 11, 2009, 11:06 PM

Actually I meant succeed at talking the wife into being ok with guns (doesnt count if she already was when you married her).

OuTcAsT · June 11, 2009, 11:13 PM

Welcome,

While we may not share our vision of gubbermint, we do share a common interest in firearms. You will find most here are jovial and helpful, as long as we stay on that topic we be cool

Swampghost · June 11, 2009, 11:21 PM

I like this site so I'm trying to visit it nightly. I'm also partial to a few other sites and happen to be a Mod. on a couple of them (duties).

Compared to other sites, these folks do tend to be pretty short when it come to politics. It's not all that bad, we tried it a few times on one site and it just tends to denigrate.

bbqbob51 · June 11, 2009, 11:22 PM

Hey (Improbable) Joe, Where you goin' with that gun in your hand?

Sorry, I had to do that!
Welcome fellow Dem gun enthusiast to the forum. I think your stand on guns has more to do with where you live as opposed to party affliation. Up here in Maine the crowd I hang with is a mix of Democrat, Independent, and Republican with around 40-50% being Democrat and the rest split between the other two. What we seem to have in commen is almost all of us are gun owners.
One of my buddies is a raging GW Bush hater with the bumper stickers and everything but he has an arsenal in his house and all he talks about is guns, music and politics.

levrluvr · June 11, 2009, 11:24 PM

Quote:

He might be lying, but it isn't like he took a stand AGAINST gun ownership

He might be lying? Like any politician, if the lips are moving.....

I've lived half of my life in the state of Illinausea, and have had to live with the anti-gun mentality in the political arena here. Obama's stance on guns during his time in this state always leaned towards firearm bans, not control. His Chief of Staff had the same opinions while here, as do all of the Daley clones.
I have absolutely no reason to believe that a move from Springfield to DC made either of them change their position on firearms.

comn-cents · June 11, 2009, 11:46 PM

Welcome Gun Guy...

Kishido · June 11, 2009, 11:49 PM

Improbable Joe,

The problem is that there aren't as many good critical thinkers out there as one would hope. I know lots of Conservatives and Liberals that are pretty much in the center. The farther out to the edges you go the more insane people tend to be.
Funny thing though, the more "fringe" a person is the louder they talk...

So far on this forum I see lot's of great people!

ImprobableJoe · June 11, 2009, 11:51 PM

I feel welcome here... thanks guys!!!

maestro pistolero · June 12, 2009, 12:11 AM

Without attempting to be partisan, allow me to point out that everything Obama has said since the beginning of the campaign is at odds with everything he said and did prior to it. His hand was somewhat forced as to the credit card/national parks bill.

The President may well have had a change of position on the matter,

but people shouldn't be faulted for paying more attention to what he has done and said during is entire career, than to what he has said since the onset of the campaign. To NOT be suspicious of such a drastic turn around, one would have to check his or her brain at the door.

I hope that helps to understand the skepticism. We are glad you're here.

Micahweeks · June 12, 2009, 01:04 AM

Welcome, Improbablejoe! I, like you, decide issues on a case by case basis and don't really care about party lines. I believe in the Second Amendment and believe it needs to be protected. You are right about how we should really shut down the anti-gun movement with a strong, bipartisan effort. The vast majority of us here are happy to have people who enjoy shooting and believe in the Second Amendment. I simply don't care what party you're from. Glad to have you with us!

Zilmo · June 12, 2009, 01:11 AM

I don't subscribe to the extremist crap on either side of the political spectrum. Most folks l know, seem to ride the middle, just like me. But I do like the hell out of guns!

**Tom Servo** · June 12, 2009, 01:17 AM

Welcome, Joe.

There's a knee-jerk phenomenon which assumes that:

Republican=Conservative Stalwart of Strict Constructionism, and

Democrat=Moonbat Liberal Communist.

Neither is true all of the time. Lately, neither seems true most of the time. There are several Republicans who are hostile to the 2nd Amendment, and even more who just don't care one way or another about it.

It's become obvious to anyone who pays attention that the current generation of Democrats are largely pro-gun. When our Attorney General decided it would be a good idea to pontificate on renewing the Assault Weapons Ban, "conservatives" ran around screaming, and nobody seemed to notice the fact that 65 Democrats sent him a letter warning him against doing so.

H.R. 1399, also known as the District of Columbia Personal Protection Act, recieved the blessing of 85 Democrats.

I've seen the hostility towards anyone who admits to voting for Obama in the last election on several different boards, and frankly, it's immature and uncivilized. While I do regret your choice, it's still a free country, and you had a right to make it as you saw fit. If you support the 2nd Amendment, there is no reason you should not be made to feel welcome.

The preservation of our 2nd Amendment rights lies with gaining the sympathies of those in the middle, and that includes people who identify themselves as Democrats. Calling them "trolls" and running them off doesn't do anyone any good. We should be working to convince and convert people, not insulate ourselves.

Lord knows, I've been teaching alot more Democrats to shoot since last November than I have Republicans. These are the folks who go home to their families and friends and say, "hey, this is actually a fun hobby, and those gun guys aren't the bunch of loons we've been led to believe they are."

Oh, and to answer your original question, the best way is to enroll her in a class. Heck, go with her. It never hurts to have a refresher. Education goes a long way towards making someone comfortable with the unfamiliar.

Bartholomew Roberts · June 12, 2009, 07:19 AM

Democrats generally receive a hostile response on gun boards because the Democratic party has played a key role in destroying the Second Amendment rights of Americans. The Democratic party was in control of Congress when the following legislation was passed for example:

1. 1934 National Firearms Act
2. 1968 Gun Control Act
3. 1994 Brady Bill
4. 1994 Lautenberg Act
5. 1994 Assault Weapons Ban

In addition, it was the Democratic leadership in the House who added 922(o) to the 1986 Firearm Owners Protection Act in hopes of killing the entire bill. The last three Democratic Presidential candidates had a long history of pro-gun control votes, with each candidate worse than the one that preceded him.

So when someone says that are against gun control; but in favor of voting for people working to destroy that right, you can guess it will generate a little bit of controversy on a gun board.

Personally, I would love to see the Democratic party get on board with 21st century civil rights and drop their animus towards gun owners. I won't even go in to the subject of how many votes the Democrats lose from their traditional power bases (and in key swing states no less) by playing to a small minority of anti-gun Americans on this issue. Unfortunately, I have not yet seen evidence that this has happened yet.

ZeSpectre · June 12, 2009, 07:56 AM

I've generally never given a damn what "political party" people lay claim to. For me it's more along the lines of "deeds not words". Show me you support rights and liberty and I'll go to the mat for you. Show me you talk out of both sides of your face and you can go flap in the breeze for all I care.

1Badshot · June 12, 2009, 07:57 AM

I was a Democrat but I live in Chicago and like guns!

CortJestir · June 12, 2009, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Hey guys and gals...

I'm a gun enthusiast, a USMC vet [snip]

That's all I need to know. Welcome aboard!

Quote:

Earlier today, I joined and was swiftly run off of another website for daring to admit that I exercised my right to vote in a manner different from the majority of that other site.

This is just sad. Folks shouldn't be chasing off anyone who supports the 2A, especially if they are affiliated with the Democratic party. As stated earlier, we need more Democrats on our side. It may be pie-in-the-sky, but the sooner our 2A right becomes a non-platform issue, the better.

Quote:

Is there a place for pro-shooting Democrats here, or will I be accused of faking my military service if I admit to voting for Obama?

I would hope there is. Otherwise, this place isn't what I think it is.

buzz_knox · June 12, 2009, 08:26 AM

Quote:

We on the left gave up on gun control as a general issue well over a decade ago.

The "official" Democratic move away from gun control only began in 2005, as part of Schumer's plan to retake the House and Senate. It was preceeded by continuous gun control efforts by the left since 1994, including Kerry's very proud moment in 2004 when he left the campaign trail to cast one of his few votes during that period and in favor of the AWB renewal.

Since the 2008 election, Obama's transition team head (Valerie Jarrett) said that the AWB was on the top of his list of things to accomplish, Holder has called for an AWB, and Feinstein has said she will move to ban all "assault weapons" when the time is right. So, the idea that gun control is a dead issue is utterly false. It's dormant at the moment, but only because 1) so many raised a fuss when Obama (acting through Jarrett and Holder) tried to raise it and 2) the nation as a whole has been on a gun buying binge since the election.

It's worth noting that said gun buying binge includes large numbers of Democrats. I guess that demonstrates what grass roots Democrats believe about the intentions and credibility of the leadership on the point.

Quote:

As stated earlier, we need more Democrats on our side. It may be pie-in-the-sky, but the sooner our 2A right becomes a non-platform issue, the better.

Agreed. Recent efforts indicate that we may be achieving that goal. Schumer took gun control off the table to win elections. He may find it impossible to put it back on the table without losing a good portion of his support base.

johnwilliamson062 · June 12, 2009, 08:38 AM

In '94 the DNC forced their reps to vote for the AWB by threatening their committee positions etc., and the Democratic representatives went a long with it. Lame.

Just be ready to write your reps a letter if a new AWB comes up and I don't think anyone will mind having you around.

I agree entirely on the 2A not being a platform issue being very important.

guy sajer · June 12, 2009, 08:57 AM

Welcome Marine !

Quote:

Why are Democrats unwelcome on gun-related forums?

Quote:

I'm a gun enthusiast, a USMC vet, and a registered Democrat.

If not to draw attention/controversy as this thread has shown , why loudly announce your party affiliation knowing that it most likely cause a ruckuss as it has previously proven to do on the other forum .

Why not just discuss the handgun you're planning to purchase ?

Al Norris · June 12, 2009, 09:04 AM

ImprobableJoe, Welcome to the Firing Line.

I do hope you stick around long enough to see what we are all about.

This particular section of TFL has a long history. You will note that there is a sub-forum off of this one called, Legal & Political. That was the precursor forum to this one.

The short history is that folks decided that the L&P forum was the place where all their political rants and fantasies could be made public. sigh. The staff of TFL finally had enough and closed that forum, in Sept. of 2008.

After careful consideration, this forum was opened to a select few members, for a trial period. In early Jan. of this year, we opened the forum to the general membership.

The rules for participation in this forum are strict and generally, political topics are off topic. If you trouble yourself to read the rules, for this forum, and follow the links, you will more understand the history and why we do things the way they are now laid out.

Having said all of this, there is a sticky thread in the General Discussion area, for new member introductions. This thread is off topic and closed.

June 11, 2009, 11:03 PM	#26
Tucker 1371 Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2008 Location: East TN Posts: 2,649	Welcome to TFL, you'll catch no crap from me. While Democrats may confuse the bejeezes out of me I do my best to respect and consider everyone's opinions. It wouldn't be America if you couldn't vote how you wanted. __________________ Sgt. of Marines, 5th Award Expert Rifle, 237/250 Expert Pistol, 382/400. D Co, 4th CEB, Engineers UP!! If you start a thread, be active in it. Don't leave us hanging. OEF 2011 Sangin, Afg. Molon Labe

June 11, 2009, 11:03 PM	#27
Any .45 Senior Member Join Date: June 21, 2004 Location: SW FLORIDA, USA Posts: 604	Succeeded at what, welcoming him? I believe I did, I told him ask questions, share your knowledge and a quick basic tfl rule, don't be sensitive. Which I don't think he has been, he's just standing up for himself as we all do, from time to time here on TFL. ....... __________________ Foster and polish The warior spirit While serving in the world; Illuminate the path According to your inner light" "Spring forth from the Great Earth; Billow like Great Waves; Stand like a tree, sit like a rock; Use One to strike All. Learn and forget! " "At the instant A warrior Confronts a foe, All things Come into focus" Morihei Ueshiba (1883-1969) Founder of Aikido

June 11, 2009, 11:13 PM	#29
OuTcAsT Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2006 Location: Eastern, TN Posts: 1,236	Welcome, While we may not share our vision of gubbermint, we do share a common interest in firearms. You will find most here are jovial and helpful, as long as we stay on that topic we be cool __________________ WITHOUT Freedom of Thought, there can be no such Thing as Wisdom; and no such Thing as public Liberty, without Freedom of Speech. Silence Dogood *Does not morality imply the last clear chance?* - WildAlaska -

June 11, 2009, 11:21 PM	#30
Swampghost Senior Member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: Florida, east coast Posts: 2,106	I like this site so I'm trying to visit it nightly. I'm also partial to a few other sites and happen to be a Mod. on a couple of them (duties). Compared to other sites, these folks do tend to be pretty short when it come to politics. It's not all that bad, we tried it a few times on one site and it just tends to denigrate. __________________ NRA Patron Member

June 11, 2009, 11:46 PM	#33
comn-cents Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2008 Location: Pac.N.W. Posts: 1,804	Welcome Gun Guy... __________________ Be Smarter Than A Bore-Snake!

June 11, 2009, 11:06 PM	#28
THEZACHARIAS Senior Member Join Date: January 26, 2009 Location: Louisiana Posts: 537	Actually I meant succeed at talking the wife into being ok with guns (doesnt count if she already was when you married her).

June 11, 2009, 11:22 PM	#31
bbqbob51 Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2005 Posts: 775	Hey (Improbable) Joe, Where you goin' with that gun in your hand? Sorry, I had to do that! Welcome fellow Dem gun enthusiast to the forum. I think your stand on guns has more to do with where you live as opposed to party affliation. Up here in Maine the crowd I hang with is a mix of Democrat, Independent, and Republican with around 40-50% being Democrat and the rest split between the other two. What we seem to have in commen is almost all of us are gun owners. One of my buddies is a raging GW Bush hater with the bumper stickers and everything but he has an arsenal in his house and all he talks about is guns, music and politics.

June 11, 2009, 11:49 PM	#34
Kishido Junior Member Join Date: June 10, 2009 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 12	Improbable Joe, The problem is that there aren't as many good critical thinkers out there as one would hope. I know lots of Conservatives and Liberals that are pretty much in the center. The farther out to the edges you go the more insane people tend to be. Funny thing though, the more "fringe" a person is the louder they talk... So far on this forum I see lot's of great people!

June 11, 2009, 11:51 PM	#35
ImprobableJoe Junior member Join Date: June 11, 2009 Posts: 87	I feel welcome here... thanks guys!!!

June 12, 2009, 12:11 AM	#36
maestro pistolero Senior Member Join Date: August 16, 2007 Posts: 2,153	Without attempting to be partisan, allow me to point out that everything Obama has said since the beginning of the campaign is at odds with everything he said and did prior to it. His hand was somewhat forced as to the credit card/national parks bill. The President may well have had a change of position on the matter, but people shouldn't be faulted for paying more attention to what he has done and said during is entire career, than to what he has said since the onset of the campaign. To NOT be suspicious of such a drastic turn around, one would have to check his or her brain at the door. I hope that helps to understand the skepticism. We are glad you're here.

June 12, 2009, 01:04 AM	#37
Micahweeks Senior Member Join Date: February 21, 2009 Location: North Mississippi Posts: 854	Welcome, Improbablejoe! I, like you, decide issues on a case by case basis and don't really care about party lines. I believe in the Second Amendment and believe it needs to be protected. You are right about how we should really shut down the anti-gun movement with a strong, bipartisan effort. The vast majority of us here are happy to have people who enjoy shooting and believe in the Second Amendment. I simply don't care what party you're from. Glad to have you with us!

June 12, 2009, 01:11 AM	#38
Zilmo Senior Member Join Date: May 30, 2009 Location: At home. Posts: 369	I don't subscribe to the extremist crap on either side of the political spectrum. Most folks l know, seem to ride the middle, just like me. But I do like the hell out of guns!

June 12, 2009, 01:17 AM	#39
Tom Servo Staff Join Date: September 27, 2008 Location: Foothills of the Appalachians Posts: 13,059	Welcome, Joe. There's a knee-jerk phenomenon which assumes that: Republican=Conservative Stalwart of Strict Constructionism, and Democrat=Moonbat Liberal Communist. Neither is true all of the time. Lately, neither seems true most of the time. There are several Republicans who are hostile to the 2nd Amendment, and even more who just don't care one way or another about it. It's become obvious to anyone who pays attention that the current generation of Democrats are largely pro-gun. When our Attorney General decided it would be a good idea to pontificate on renewing the Assault Weapons Ban, "conservatives" ran around screaming, and nobody seemed to notice the fact that 65 Democrats sent him a letter warning him against doing so. H.R. 1399, also known as the District of Columbia Personal Protection Act, recieved the blessing of 85 Democrats. I've seen the hostility towards anyone who admits to voting for Obama in the last election on several different boards, and frankly, it's immature and uncivilized. While I do regret your choice, it's still a free country, and you had a right to make it as you saw fit. If you support the 2nd Amendment, there is no reason you should not be made to feel welcome. The preservation of our 2nd Amendment rights lies with gaining the sympathies of those in the middle, and that includes people who identify themselves as Democrats. Calling them "trolls" and running them off doesn't do anyone any good. We should be working to convince and convert people, not insulate ourselves. Lord knows, I've been teaching alot more Democrats to shoot since last November than I have Republicans. These are the folks who go home to their families and friends and say, "hey, this is actually a fun hobby, and those gun guys aren't the bunch of loons we've been led to believe they are." Oh, and to answer your original question, the best way is to enroll her in a class. Heck, go with her. It never hurts to have a refresher. Education goes a long way towards making someone comfortable with the unfamiliar. __________________ Sometimes it’s nice not to destroy the world for a change. --Randall Munroe

June 12, 2009, 07:19 AM	#40
Bartholomew Roberts member Join Date: June 12, 2000 Location: Texas and Oklahoma area Posts: 8,462	Democrats generally receive a hostile response on gun boards because the Democratic party has played a key role in destroying the Second Amendment rights of Americans. The Democratic party was in control of Congress when the following legislation was passed for example: 1. 1934 National Firearms Act 2. 1968 Gun Control Act 3. 1994 Brady Bill 4. 1994 Lautenberg Act 5. 1994 Assault Weapons Ban In addition, it was the Democratic leadership in the House who added 922(o) to the 1986 Firearm Owners Protection Act in hopes of killing the entire bill. The last three Democratic Presidential candidates had a long history of pro-gun control votes, with each candidate worse than the one that preceded him. So when someone says that are against gun control; but in favor of voting for people working to destroy that right, you can guess it will generate a little bit of controversy on a gun board. Personally, I would love to see the Democratic party get on board with 21st century civil rights and drop their animus towards gun owners. I won't even go in to the subject of how many votes the Democrats lose from their traditional power bases (and in key swing states no less) by playing to a small minority of anti-gun Americans on this issue. Unfortunately, I have not yet seen evidence that this has happened yet.

June 12, 2009, 07:56 AM	#41
ZeSpectre Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2007 Location: Shenandoah Valley Posts: 3,276	I've generally never given a damn what "political party" people lay claim to. For me it's more along the lines of "deeds not words". Show me you support rights and liberty and I'll go to the mat for you. Show me you talk out of both sides of your face and you can go flap in the breeze for all I care. __________________ "The dogs may bark but the caravan moves on"

June 12, 2009, 07:57 AM	#42
1Badshot Member Join Date: February 13, 2008 Location: Chicago Il Posts: 18	I was a Democrat but I live in Chicago and like guns!

June 12, 2009, 08:38 AM	#45
johnwilliamson062 Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 9,995	In '94 the DNC forced their reps to vote for the AWB by threatening their committee positions etc., and the Democratic representatives went a long with it. Lame. Just be ready to write your reps a letter if a new AWB comes up and I don't think anyone will mind having you around. I agree entirely on the 2A not being a platform issue being very important.

June 12, 2009, 09:04 AM	#47
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	ImprobableJoe, Welcome to the Firing Line. I do hope you stick around long enough to see what we are all about. This particular section of TFL has a long history. You will note that there is a sub-forum off of this one called, Legal & Political. That was the precursor forum to this one. The short history is that folks decided that the L&P forum was the place where all their political rants and fantasies could be made public. sigh. The staff of TFL finally had enough and closed that forum, in Sept. of 2008. After careful consideration, this forum was opened to a select few members, for a trial period. In early Jan. of this year, we opened the forum to the general membership. The rules for participation in this forum are strict and generally, political topics are off topic. If you trouble yourself to read the rules, for this forum, and follow the links, you will more understand the history and why we do things the way they are now laid out. Having said all of this, there is a sticky thread in the General Discussion area, for new member introductions. This thread is off topic and closed.