40 cal with hodgdon tightgroup

[mp40]

I have loaded 44 before not with Hodgson tight group. Was wondering if anyone has experience with the tight group powder with a 40? I have a m&p
40 pro series 5 inch loading 165 extreme bullets

[kerreckt]

I have loaded .40S&W using Titegroup. I was using 165gr. Berry's hollow base bullets with 4.8gr of TG. As, listed on their website the starting load is 4.5gr and max is 5.1. As you can see that is a very small range. This load chrono'd right at 1000fps. Many people are going to tell you not to use TG with the .40S&W round but I have found my loads to be accurate, dependable, consistent and clean. You must must careful not to double charge. I am certain that the problems people have had with TG and the .40S&W are a result of careless (double) charges. These loads worked nicely in all three of my .40S&W pistols none of which is a S&W M&P model. Best wishes.

[bt380]

A bit off topic here, but check out the December/January 2014 magazine page 38-44. They have a nice article on the 44 caliber 429421 Keith Bullet. They list several powders and charges.

[kerreckt]

What magazine are you referring to? There are many out there to choose from and it would take a long while to find that article. BTW I have a mold for that bullet and it is an excellent one with my .44spl.

[mp40]

I need to know about 40 cal loads not 44

[Idaho Spud]

I have 3 or 4 hundred or so loaded with it, under the 180 gr. Berry RS. Shoot 'em in an SR40 and a Glock 23. What do you want to know?

[oldpapps]

I don't load your bullet weights but:

XTP 155 TightGroup 5.8 1069 SPFD XD

L 155 TightGroup 4.7 940 SPFD XD
L 155 TightGroup 4.9 1011 SPFD XD
L 155 TightGroup 5 1002.5 SPFD XD
L 155 TightGroup 5.1 1016.6 SPFD XD

Excel spread sheets just don't copy/paste well.
I in-put all test/chronograph shot of the same load into a running calculation. If the count reaches 15 samples, the average velocity will display with 1 decimal place. Yes, there is a surge or dip at 4.9 grains. No, I don't know why but 4.8 (not listed, didn't make the count criteria) is consistent with the 1011 FPS reading. [For what it's worth, I use the 4.9 grain loading and there are over 45 samples to date.] The barrel length of the listed/tested weapon is 3 inches and the velocities are at 10 feet (the length of the cable).

Standard caution statement. Safe in my weapon with my components, as I put them together. May not be safe with your components, as you put them together in your weapon/s. Use as reference information only. ALL WAYS DEFER TO PUBLISHED DATA from a know and trusted source. You don't know me, why should you trust me?

Load with care,

OSOK

[57K]

I'm not a fan of TiteGroup in high pressure cartridges and particularly the .40 S&W. The reason being that with its small powder capacity coupled with heavier bullets it causes loads to pressure peak faster. Using faster burning powders only exascerbate the problem. Might be okay for lighht loads, but personally, I wouldn't use powders that burn faster than ZIP, W231 or AA#2 for light loads.

For factory level performance, I recommend spherical (ball type) powders just slower than Unique down to AA#7 and LongShot on the Hodgdon burn rate chart. Sphericals tend to be more pressure stable than flake powders and flash less. Some sphericals have noticeably lower flash and while their burn rates are medium/medium slow, the faster pressure peaking nature of the .40 S&W will cause them to burn and pressure peak faster than what their burn rate would indicate. From N330 down to LongShot that are a number of excellent powders. I've burned a lot of V-V 3N37 but my favorites today are Silhouette that's treated for low flash while giving very good performance along with True Blue that may be the most accurate powder available for the .40 S&W and can be used with cast, plated or jacketed bullets for great accuracy. For defense loads with very low flash, it's hard to beat Silhouette. Both of these powders meter well, True Blue exceptionally so, while they give good load density and an accidental double-charge would easily overflow the case. I recommend particularly to new reloaders to never use any powder that doesn't give over 50% load density to help them prevent double-charges.

Another negative regarding TiteGroup is that it is a very hot burning powder which makes it a poor choice for loading cast lead bullets. About the coolest burning opowder you can use is True Blue.

[mp40]

looks like you shot 155 gr with tght group how about 165? how did you like it ?

[oldpapps]

"looks like you shot 155 gr with tght group how about 165? how did you like it ?"

If this was directed to me, I am an obstinate type person. Before I retired, I had forced on me glocks (had two fall apart in my hands in a week) and 180 grain FMJ rounds.
I had never considered the round before, I love .45s. But after shooting them 22 to 25 thousand times, they grew on me. I bought a SPFD Armory XD Sub Compact as a carry weapon, much smaller than a 1911A1.
I have loaded 140 grain lead, 155 grain lead and 155 grain XTP (nice JHPs). I still prefer my 45s but carry the 155 grain XTPs in my XD, daily.

So, no 165 grainers or heavyer.

As far as the use of TiteGroup, I had some and used it. When it was gone, I haven't replaced it. I now use 231/HP38. 5.4 grains of 231 gives me 915.9 FPS with the XTPs and 5.3 grains gives me 912.0 FPS with lead. I like the way they shoot.

I don't have any problem with TiteGroup, I just have and buy 231 by the 8 pound jug.

Load with care,

OSOK

[mp40]

Cool thanks are you still shooting the 45 with 155 gr?

[oldpapps]

"shooting the 45 with 155 gr?"

Misunderstanding here.

.40 S&W are 155 grain.
.45 ACPs, I load 200 grain SWC.

Load with care,

OSOK

[mp40]

no shooting 40 cal with 165

[myg30]

You might want to check several of the powder makers web sites for load data with the 165's. Look at the "choice" powders.
Everyone's firearms shoot different with same loads/bullet weights. Your OAL, crimp or other loading habits might produce unsafe loads.
Its safer for you to WORK UP your own load in your firearm.
Start at the min load and work up from there. You may find that your best load is well under max in "your" firearm, with your brand bullets.

Lots to read. ABC's of reloading is a good one to start with. Im guessing your new to loading. I didn't see anything in your 6 posts to say you load any other caliber.
As stated above, be cautious with titegroup. It spikes fast!

BE SAFE. Mike

[Gster]

I've loaded a bunch of Sierra 165 gr. jhp with 4.6 grns. of Titegroup with an oal of 1.125 and they shot great out of my SR40.

[BigJimP]

I've loaded quite a bit of .40 S&W with 155gr, 165gr and 180gr bullets - all FMJ - from Montana Gold...with Hogdon TiteGroup ( and on average in .40 S&W, because I don't shoot that caliber a lot )...is about 50 boxes a year....for each of the last 10 yrs or so...

I've shot my .40 S&W reloads mostly in a Sig X-Five L1 model ( a big heavy
5" SAO Sig ), a Sig 226 , a Sig 239 ....

I like all 3 bullets ...and I like TiteGroup a lot ...the recipe's on TiteGroup call for some precision because the Min and Max are not far apart...but its a good clean powder. If I can't get TiteGroup ...I did switch some of my loads to Hodgdon Universal as well..../ I tend to favor the 165gr or 180 gr bullets in .40 S&W .../ but these days I just shoot a lot more boxes of 9mm, .357 Mag and .45 acp..../ but once in a while, I just make it a Sig day...and take some of my Sigs to the range....vs always shooting my S&W revolvers or some of my other 1911's....

But I like TiteGroup - I just haven't been able to get an 8 lb keg of it in awhile....where 8 lb kegs of Universal are still reasonably available.

I have loaded a few plated bullets in .40S&W from Rainier and Berry's...but because of the pressures in .40 S&W, I'm a little wary of any non-jacketed bullets in .40 S&W. I've only loaded a few thousand Xtreme plated bullets...and I wasn't that impressed with them / but their quality might vary by caliber too ....( take a handful out of a box ..and weigh each one ...and see how much variation you get ...)...and keep the velocity and pressure on plated bullets down toward the minimum vs maximum would be my recommendation.

[bt380]

re #3 comment: Sorry, got a chest cold and oars aren't stroking too well yet. The magazine for the Keith Bullet is handloader.

[mp40]

Yes I have loaded a lot of 44 cal and 30 06. But know 40. I bought 500 xtreme
165 fmj and tight group powder trying to see how everyone likes they bullets and powder

[Real Gun]

Hodgdon's own site data (copy/paste), using Sierra JHP:
.40 S&W
165 GR. SIE JHP Hodgdon Titegroup .400" 1.125"
4.6g, 961fps, 27,000 PSI ---- 5.1g, 1047fps, 33,600 PSI

data for plated Berry's (more comparable to Extreme?):

165 GR. BERB FP
Hodgdon Titegroup .400" 1.125"
4.5g, 960fps, 24,300 PSI --- 5.1g, 1060fps, 31,800 PSI

[Don P]

4.7 or 4.8 grains will work rather nicely

[mp40]

Loaded some with 4.7. 20 rounds. And 20 rounds with 4.6 what is the most popular powder on here people are loading 40cal with ?

[57K]

Another thing you guys may not know, is that not only is TiteGroup susceptible to pressure spikes in higher pressure loads, it's also one of the hottest burning powders you can use. The coolest burning in .40 S&W that also produces some of the best accuracy the .40's capable of is Ramshot True Blue.

[bluetopper]

Read & heed both posts by 57K and you'll be much better off.

My sentiments exactly.

[mp40]

thanks guys one other question can u guys tell a difference in point of impact using a mixed bag of brass or using all the same help a lot with that?
all brass are at the .845-.850 length spec but getting flyers in groups

and were can I order some of the ramshot true blue? cant find it anywhere