IPSC 'Box'

Mike Davies · June 23, 2000, 11:09 AM

As all IPSC shooters know, when shooting Standard Division, the gun must fit into the IPSC 'box'with magazine installed, or you will be 'kicked up' to shooting Open Division. I had an incident at the last Qualifier where I had (stupidly) installed new plastic magazine bumper pads on my Chip McCormick 8rnd magazines for my Norinco 1911, just the day before the Match. The Chip McCormick 8rnd magazines are identical in size to the standard 7rnd magazines. When I got to the Chrono stage, my gun wouldn't fit in the box without a bit of 'squeezing' which involved depressing the adjustable Bomar sights. The RO decided that the gun didn't fit the box, even though I *did* get it in..the RO said it should 'drop' into the box...so I had to shoot the competition in the Open Division. Not a big deal, as this is my first year in IPSC, and I was still Unclassified.
Now..my question is: I have checked the rules and it does allow a tolerance of plus or minus 1mm for the box. Was the RO correct to move me from Standard to Open?
Any thoughts on this are appreciated.
Mike

WESHOOT2 · June 29, 2000, 07:24 PM

Maybe..........but it's too late now. Always ask for a higher authority to check any important decision; if need be make them show you the rule. Never give up, never surrender.

DVC

TaxPhd · June 29, 2000, 10:40 PM

From the 14th Edition, USPSA Rule Book:

"Any unloaded handgun in its ready condition but with the magazine inserted must fit within the confines of a box with the dimensions of 225 mm x 150 mm x 45 mm."

There is no requirement for the gun to "drop in."

However, depressing the rear sight makes the gun not "in its ready condition."

In the future, contact your local match arbitration attorney. He'll keep you out of trouble!!

Mike Davies · June 29, 2000, 11:06 PM

Thanks for the replies...point well taken. While I don't want to be labelled a 'whiner', I will certainly not give up so easily if I ever am in a similar situation again. I saw a whole match brought to a standstill by one Open Division shooter (a former Canadian National Champion) who insisted that he had two rounds through the same hole in one Virginia Count stage...I was 'pasting targets' on that stage, and I knew he had quite simply missed...but they had to send for the Senior arbitrator, and he had to produce the guages and make a ruling...he ruled that it was a miss. The shooter wasn't that upset..he knew he had missed as well...
Mike/BC

June 23, 2000, 11:09 AM	#1
Mike Davies Senior Member Join Date: April 8, 2000 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 376	As all IPSC shooters know, when shooting Standard Division, the gun must fit into the IPSC 'box'with magazine installed, or you will be 'kicked up' to shooting Open Division. I had an incident at the last Qualifier where I had (stupidly) installed new plastic magazine bumper pads on my Chip McCormick 8rnd magazines for my Norinco 1911, just the day before the Match. The Chip McCormick 8rnd magazines are identical in size to the standard 7rnd magazines. When I got to the Chrono stage, my gun wouldn't fit in the box without a bit of 'squeezing' which involved depressing the adjustable Bomar sights. The RO decided that the gun didn't fit the box, even though I did get it in..the RO said it should 'drop' into the box...so I had to shoot the competition in the Open Division. Not a big deal, as this is my first year in IPSC, and I was still Unclassified. Now..my question is: I have checked the rules and it does allow a tolerance of plus or minus 1mm for the box. Was the RO correct to move me from Standard to Open? Any thoughts on this are appreciated. Mike

June 29, 2000, 07:24 PM	#2
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	Maybe..........but it's too late now. Always ask for a higher authority to check any important decision; if need be make them show you the rule. Never give up, never surrender. DVC

June 29, 2000, 10:40 PM	#3
TaxPhd Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 534	From the 14th Edition, USPSA Rule Book: "Any unloaded handgun in its ready condition but with the magazine inserted must fit within the confines of a box with the dimensions of 225 mm x 150 mm x 45 mm." There is no requirement for the gun to "drop in." However, depressing the rear sight makes the gun not "in its ready condition." In the future, contact your local match arbitration attorney. He'll keep you out of trouble!!

June 29, 2000, 11:06 PM	#4
Mike Davies Senior Member Join Date: April 8, 2000 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 376	Thanks for the replies...point well taken. While I don't want to be labelled a 'whiner', I will certainly not give up so easily if I ever am in a similar situation again. I saw a whole match brought to a standstill by one Open Division shooter (a former Canadian National Champion) who insisted that he had two rounds through the same hole in one Virginia Count stage...I was 'pasting targets' on that stage, and I knew he had quite simply missed...but they had to send for the Senior arbitrator, and he had to produce the guages and make a ruling...he ruled that it was a miss. The shooter wasn't that upset..he knew he had missed as well... Mike/BC