9 mm reloading cost

Reloader2 · April 2, 2014, 01:52 PM

I'm currently loading 9 mm ammo at the approximate cost of $.23 per round. Bullet= .09. Brass =.08 Primer=.04 and Powder=.02.
Comes to about $11.50 per box. If I reuse the brass the cost is down to about $7.50 a box.
I'm just wondering if this is in line with what the rest of you are paying for the supplies to make up your 9mm ammo?

BigJimP · April 2, 2014, 02:06 PM

Reusing brass...is always the case / I never pay for brass...and in 9mm, I probably load one case 15 or more times ( and I don't really keep track / you'll lose them long before you can keep track).

Powder is about $ 0.01 ( Hodgdon TiteGroup ) I buy in 8 lb kegs
Primers are about $ 0.027 ( CCI small pistol primers ) ...a case is 5,000
Bullets are about $ 0.09 ( 115 gr FMJ, Montana Gold ) ...a case is 4,000
( buying in case lots will save you some money )

so I'm at about $ 0.13 each or $6.50 for a box of 50 rounds.

What are you using for bullets ? that's your biggest expense..

carguychris · April 2, 2014, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigJimP

Reusing brass...is always the case / I never pay for brass...and in 9mm, I probably load one case 15 or more times ( and I don't really keep track / you'll lose them long before you can keep track).

+1, or the cases accumulate enough gouges on the rim that I preemptively toss them before I get a FTE. (My M&P9's extractor seems to be hard on cases.)

FWIW I've found that most ranges are very forgiving about collecting 9mm cases off the ground, assuming that you don't disrupt other shooters in the process, you're friendly and cooperative with the RO's, and you aren't blatantly collecting a whole lot more than what you just shot. Since so many people shoot 9mm and most of them don't handload, most ranges collect FAR more 9mm brass than they could possibly resell, so you can safely assume that most of the cases you don't pick up are going to scrap. Since the range doesn't get much back from selling scrap, they usually won't miss a few of them.

I like to say that I normally return from most range trips with about the same number of 9mm cases I had when I left- they just aren't necessarily the same cases I arrived with.

BigJimP · April 2, 2014, 02:51 PM

As a footnote....

I shoot mostly at indoor ranges....and I always sweep up cases in my area...and take most of a "quart sized" bag home ...or more.../ probably half of the rounds I shoot bounce off the stall walls and into someone else's area...or in front of firing line..and I let all those go. At my local ranges...we are allowed to sweep up our shooting lane only / not forward of the line...but I always have a couple of 10 gallon storage bins full of 9mm brass that has been cleaned and sorted and ready for the case feeder on my press.

I sort and clean all my cases / then I inspect them again after they're clean -- and I toss out anything that doesn't look pretty good / or if they're just getting nasty and burnt looking / and marks on rims, etc...

After I load a round ....I dump 200 rounds on my bench / wipe them down with a terry cloth towel....and I case gague every round...and if it doesn't drop in and out of case gague / I reject them ...small nicks on base, etc..( and pull the bullet and reclaim powder - and dump the case).

bedbugbilly · April 2, 2014, 07:09 PM

To be honest - at .08 / casing - I think you are overpaying for your brass. I have purchased several K of 9mm range brass - never paid more than between .03 - .04 per casing - usually it has worked out to .04 / casing when shipping is figured in. What I have been buying is "range brass" - different head stamps but all good usable casings for reloads.

Like anyone who shoots semi-auto and who reloads, I try to collect my spent casings to reload but we all know you never get 'em all.

But, at .04 / casing, it doesn't hurt that bad if you miss a few.

I cast my own bullets. I reload other pistol calibers as well. For my 9mm, I'm using the Lee 356-120-TC mold. It throws them at .358 cast out of "range lead" so I also use some for my 38 special reloads just as they drop from the mold. For my 9mm, I size 'em to .357 and tumble lube them in Alox/Paste Wax - works great and no leading problems at all. I'm loading them over 3.5 gr of Bulls Eye and they shoot great out of my SR9.

My primer / power cost is the same as yours - primer .04 and powder .02. I have lots of lead to cast with that I have nothing in so my per cartridge cost is running at .08 / ea. (primer, casing, powder and bullet) or in other words, around $4.00/box of 50 - pretty cheap shooting and if I'm lucky and get my brass off the found - that price drops.

You might want to consider casting your own bullets - not that hard. I use a single LP tank fueled "hot plate" - a small Lymon pot and dipper and flux with beeswax - been doing it that way for close to 50 years. In theory (i.e. if you have absolutely no waste) you can get 58 120 gr. bullets out of a pound of lead.

Try googling "9mm range brass" and see if you can't find a cheaper source - plus, you may be able to collect some from the range you shoot at. I know its pennies - but as they say - "a penny saved . . . ". It all adds up over time.

I use only lead bullets I cast - I'm not a competitive shooter and have never loaded a jacketed bullet - use lead in all of my pistol reloads. For the type of plinking and range shooting I do - they work just fine.

tahunua001 · April 2, 2014, 07:54 PM

reloading used to be a heckuva lot cheaper than preloaded ammo but when all the 9mm sold out in obama gun grab 2013 all the reloading components went next so now reloading is essentially the same cost as loaded ammo. frankly I'm impressed that you can keep it under $9 a box.

TunnelRat · April 2, 2014, 08:02 PM

Quote:

reloading used to be a heckuva lot cheaper than preloaded ammo but when all the 9mm sold out in obama gun grab 2013 all the reloading components went next so now reloading is essentially the same cost as loaded ammo. frankly I'm impressed that you can keep it under $9 a box.

Near me 9mm target ammo (WWB, Federal Champion, UMC) is right around $13 a box at Wally World that just last month finally got some good quantities, at the local gunshop it's $15 a box. That's still a heck of a lot more than the figures I am seeing quoted here.

tahunua001 · April 2, 2014, 08:22 PM

even though it's steel cased, you can buy brown bear right now for $11 a box.

BillM · April 2, 2014, 08:30 PM

Cases (range brass) 2¢, Bullet (147 Bayou polycoat) 8.2¢
Powder (VV N320) 1.5¢ Primer (WSP) 2.5¢

14.2¢ per, $14.20 a hundred. Cheapest factory
around here is about $12 for 50---or $24 per hundred.

Between the wife and I, practice and USPSA competition,
we will probably burn through around 15,000 rds this year.

I am NOT going to do the math on that!

Kev · April 2, 2014, 09:30 PM

^^so you are at $2,130 for 15,000 rounds?^^
If I am not sleep deprived and brain dead

Mike38 · April 2, 2014, 09:53 PM

Quote:

even though it's steel cased, you can buy brown bear right now for $11 a box.

That’s what I do. Even though I enjoy reloading as much as shooting, I figure my time is worth something. I can buy loaded 9mm for the same as reloads if I include a bit for my time. If your pistol will not shoot steel cased stuff, it’s another story. But my 92FS shoots it great, and is accurate enough for me to make Master at Combat Pistol competition.

Wreck-n-Crew · April 2, 2014, 09:54 PM

I averaged less than $14.30 per hundred on my last batch of 9mm bullets using 115gr Plated bullets from wwwthebulletworks.net. That is $7.65 per 100. So how much did I save by reloading? Not a darn thing, I just shot more as the saying goes.

The 40's ran a little more @ $16.80 per 100. Easier to figure off the top of my head since I get about 1100 .40 calibers per pound using the powder I used. I shoot the 180gr RNFP for plinking and the heavier round cost a little more than a 165gr.

AK103K · April 2, 2014, 09:54 PM

Brass being a given, it costs me $6-$6.50 for 50 rounds, depending on the market. Not to long ago, it was only about half that.

I load 124 grain FMJ's bought in bulk, usually from Precision Delta, over 4.5 grains of 231.

Primers and powder bought in bulk as well, 8# jugs/5000 primers at a shot.

Realistically, you really dont save a lot of money reloading, you just shoot a LOT more. On average, I usually shoot 15000+ rounds of 9mm a year these days. About 300 rounds a week, sometimes more. I shoot a good bit of .38, .357MAG, and .45acp, a couple of cases of each, as well over the year.

Boy, I sure do miss those days of cheap military surplus and 2000 round cases of China Sports/Norinco 9mm. It was cheaper to buy that stuff back then, than it was to buy the components to load the brass.

chris in va · April 2, 2014, 10:19 PM

My self cast LRN reloads come out to around $6/100. That's cheaper than 22lr and I have plenty.

pelo801 · April 2, 2014, 10:38 PM

Yes, casting your own brings the cost down even more.

bitttorrrent · April 2, 2014, 10:53 PM

Wow, 15k rounds a year. That is a lot.

I collect brass and have buckets of .38 9mm & .45-.45 lc. During the shortage it did not even affect me cause had 1000's i was and could reload. I think that is more important than saving .02 per round.

I just make sure I have good stock of bullet making supplies.

Of course I still cant find any .22 last time I looked. Still have 1500 or so stocked but how much would you guys keep on hand? I hate not being able to pick up a brick or two when I'm at Cabelas etc.

Wreck-n-Crew · April 3, 2014, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Wow, 15k rounds a year. That is a lot.

That's only 300 per week. There are people that shoot 1000+ a week.

armoredman · April 3, 2014, 12:29 AM

I bought components in bulk when I had cash and nobody else was buying. Even using certified bullet metal, (not wheel weight lead), I can load up a box of 9mm for less than $5 spent, and that was $5 worth of buying power a few years ago. I don't care about the time I use doing it - I could waste it surfing the internet, after all.

Wreck-n-Crew · April 3, 2014, 02:23 AM

Quote:

I don't care about the time I use doing it - I could waste it surfing the internet, after all.

That was my approach. Need My time a little more during the busy season so I am ready to move on a progressive press. Crank 500 pistol rounds per hour would not even be a stretch. Would have already done so if I hadn't been spending so much on guns!

lapetrarca53 · April 3, 2014, 07:35 AM

For 9mm, it costs me between $6.00 and $7.00 per box of 50. Depends mostly on projectile price.

AK103K · April 3, 2014, 08:13 AM

Quote:

I bought components in bulk when I had cash and nobody else was buying.

I buy all the time, whether I need it or dont. Its really the only way to do it. If you wait until youre out, youre likely going to come up short.

99% of this shortage stuff, guns, ammo, components, what ever, hasnt been caused by those who think ahead.

Some places, like Precision Delta, tell you right out, roughly what their delay is, and will let you place your order, so you can get in the queue, and they dont charge your credit card until it ships. Ive had 9mm bullets coming every other month or so all along since Sandy Hook. Their prices have crept up too, but not as bad as a lot of the others.

Its amazing how some of the local shops are really starting to gouge on stuff too. My buddy and I were in a local shop the other day, and they were charging $30 a pound for Unique, and $40 a pound for Reloader 7! Primers were $40 per 1000. He found the 7 at another shop for $24 a pound. It really pays to shop around.

On average, Ive been paying about $20 a pound for single pounds of anything, all along, and that drops even more when you buy by the 4# and 8# jugs.

If youve been buying all along, youre not as much at the mercy of those places that are taking advantage.

You also have to be willing to work a little and buy from those little places on the web and on the ground, youve never heard of or patronized before. Thats often where the real deals are, and the stuff you cant find is. Click on all those "email me when its in" boxes as well.

kraigwy · April 3, 2014, 08:59 AM

At the extreme side, that being primers at $40 per 1000 and powder $30 per lb. it rounds up to $.06 per round.

I cast bullet and I have tons of brass from an earlier life. I use range lead from my clubs indoor range.

I did buy a can (500 rounds) of USGI Military Ball ammo for $130 at the last gun show to shoot in EIC matches were ball ammo is required.

Vermonter · April 3, 2014, 10:01 AM

For Christmas this year I was given an RCBS rock chucker setup along with some primers and a mess of dies. I essentially had zero start up cost other than components. Better than that I had been saving all of my brass over the years so my components were really only primers, bullets, and powder.

I can make 100 rounds of 9mm with titegroup, cci500 primer, and cast lead bullets purchased from midway for around $3.50 per box because I haven't paid for a case yet.

From start to finish I can make up a batch of $100 within an hour. I could drive an hour round trip and pay $30 bucks plus gas etc or I could spend an hour and pay $7.

So it is paying in my case and I am shooting more.

YMMV, Vermonter

Martowski · April 3, 2014, 10:46 AM

I can reload 9mm for about $6/box of 50 using plated Berry's bullets, W231, and CCI primers.

I have always used single stage equipment, but a couple years ago got a Lee Classic Turret set-up and LOVE it! Only takes me 15 min to reload a box of handgun cartridges, regardless of caliber. Here's a little write-up I did of it when I first got it set up and running:

http://martowski.wordpress.com/2012/...rret-delivers/

AK103K · April 3, 2014, 12:12 PM

Midway had a good deal on CCI small pistol primers a little while back, $26/1000, and even with the hazmat and their outrageous shipping, it was still a pretty good deal.

Natchez had a similar deal a week or so ago. I think it was $28/1000.

While I never got into casting, I do use a good bit of hard cast lead with my .38's and .45's. Lead is usually the most economical, but not always, and I actually get FMJ 9mm cheaper than what the couple of places I get HCL bullets from, sell their 125 grain 9mm bullets for.

The other issue with the .357's and 9mm's is, I drive them faster than the usual 850-950 fps cutoff and just hate dealing with the leading/cleaning issues. For some reason, even my 158 grain .38 LSWC's lead in my 357's, yet they dont in my .38's. Go figure.

That said, I have shot with a couple of people who do cast, and for things I never would have considered, and claim they never have a leading issue. Something about "tempering" the bullets as the come out of the mold. One boy was shooting cast lead out of a 30/06 at over 2000fps. Now if they can do it, why not the commercial casters?

April 2, 2014, 01:52 PM	#1
Reloader2 Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2013 Posts: 263	9 mm reloading cost I'm currently loading 9 mm ammo at the approximate cost of $.23 per round. Bullet= .09. Brass =.08 Primer=.04 and Powder=.02. Comes to about $11.50 per box. If I reuse the brass the cost is down to about $7.50 a box. I'm just wondering if this is in line with what the rest of you are paying for the supplies to make up your 9mm ammo?

April 2, 2014, 07:09 PM	#5
bedbugbilly Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2009 Posts: 3,287	To be honest - at .08 / casing - I think you are overpaying for your brass. I have purchased several K of 9mm range brass - never paid more than between .03 - .04 per casing - usually it has worked out to .04 / casing when shipping is figured in. What I have been buying is "range brass" - different head stamps but all good usable casings for reloads. Like anyone who shoots semi-auto and who reloads, I try to collect my spent casings to reload but we all know you never get 'em all. But, at .04 / casing, it doesn't hurt that bad if you miss a few. I cast my own bullets. I reload other pistol calibers as well. For my 9mm, I'm using the Lee 356-120-TC mold. It throws them at .358 cast out of "range lead" so I also use some for my 38 special reloads just as they drop from the mold. For my 9mm, I size 'em to .357 and tumble lube them in Alox/Paste Wax - works great and no leading problems at all. I'm loading them over 3.5 gr of Bulls Eye and they shoot great out of my SR9. My primer / power cost is the same as yours - primer .04 and powder .02. I have lots of lead to cast with that I have nothing in so my per cartridge cost is running at .08 / ea. (primer, casing, powder and bullet) or in other words, around $4.00/box of 50 - pretty cheap shooting and if I'm lucky and get my brass off the found - that price drops. You might want to consider casting your own bullets - not that hard. I use a single LP tank fueled "hot plate" - a small Lymon pot and dipper and flux with beeswax - been doing it that way for close to 50 years. In theory (i.e. if you have absolutely no waste) you can get 58 120 gr. bullets out of a pound of lead. Try googling "9mm range brass" and see if you can't find a cheaper source - plus, you may be able to collect some from the range you shoot at. I know its pennies - but as they say - "a penny saved . . . ". It all adds up over time. I use only lead bullets I cast - I'm not a competitive shooter and have never loaded a jacketed bullet - use lead in all of my pistol reloads. For the type of plinking and range shooting I do - they work just fine. __________________ If a pair of '51 Navies were good enough for Billy Hickok, then a single Navy on my right hip is good enough for me . . . besides . . . I'm probably only half as good as he was anyways. Hiram's Rangers Badge #63

April 2, 2014, 07:54 PM	#6
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	reloading used to be a heckuva lot cheaper than preloaded ammo but when all the 9mm sold out in obama gun grab 2013 all the reloading components went next so now reloading is essentially the same cost as loaded ammo. frankly I'm impressed that you can keep it under $9 a box. __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

April 2, 2014, 08:22 PM	#8
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	even though it's steel cased, you can buy brown bear right now for $11 a box. __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

April 2, 2014, 09:30 PM	#10
Kev Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2013 Posts: 661	^^so you are at $2,130 for 15,000 rounds?^^ If I am not sleep deprived and brain dead __________________ "Classic over Plastic"

April 2, 2014, 02:06 PM	#2
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	Reusing brass...is always the case / I never pay for brass...and in 9mm, I probably load one case 15 or more times ( and I don't really keep track / you'll lose them long before you can keep track). Powder is about $ 0.01 ( Hodgdon TiteGroup ) I buy in 8 lb kegs Primers are about $ 0.027 ( CCI small pistol primers ) ...a case is 5,000 Bullets are about $ 0.09 ( 115 gr FMJ, Montana Gold ) ...a case is 4,000 ( buying in case lots will save you some money ) so I'm at about $ 0.13 each or $6.50 for a box of 50 rounds. What are you using for bullets ? that's your biggest expense..

April 2, 2014, 02:51 PM	#4
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	As a footnote.... I shoot mostly at indoor ranges....and I always sweep up cases in my area...and take most of a "quart sized" bag home ...or more.../ probably half of the rounds I shoot bounce off the stall walls and into someone else's area...or in front of firing line..and I let all those go. At my local ranges...we are allowed to sweep up our shooting lane only / not forward of the line...but I always have a couple of 10 gallon storage bins full of 9mm brass that has been cleaned and sorted and ready for the case feeder on my press. I sort and clean all my cases / then I inspect them again after they're clean -- and I toss out anything that doesn't look pretty good / or if they're just getting nasty and burnt looking / and marks on rims, etc... After I load a round ....I dump 200 rounds on my bench / wipe them down with a terry cloth towel....and I case gague every round...and if it doesn't drop in and out of case gague / I reject them ...small nicks on base, etc..( and pull the bullet and reclaim powder - and dump the case).

April 2, 2014, 08:30 PM	#9
BillM Senior Member Join Date: January 20, 2009 Location: Amity Oregon Posts: 791	Cases (range brass) 2¢, Bullet (147 Bayou polycoat) 8.2¢ Powder (VV N320) 1.5¢ Primer (WSP) 2.5¢ 14.2¢ per, $14.20 a hundred. Cheapest factory around here is about $12 for 50---or $24 per hundred. Between the wife and I, practice and USPSA competition, we will probably burn through around 15,000 rds this year. I am NOT going to do the math on that!

April 2, 2014, 09:54 PM	#12
Wreck-n-Crew Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,820	I averaged less than $14.30 per hundred on my last batch of 9mm bullets using 115gr Plated bullets from wwwthebulletworks.net. That is $7.65 per 100. So how much did I save by reloading? Not a darn thing, I just shot more as the saying goes. The 40's ran a little more @ $16.80 per 100. Easier to figure off the top of my head since I get about 1100 .40 calibers per pound using the powder I used. I shoot the 180gr RNFP for plinking and the heavier round cost a little more than a 165gr. __________________ If you ever have to use a firearm, *you don't get to pick the scenario!*

April 2, 2014, 09:54 PM	#13
AK103K Senior Member Join Date: May 1, 2001 Posts: 10,223	Brass being a given, it costs me $6-$6.50 for 50 rounds, depending on the market. Not to long ago, it was only about half that. I load 124 grain FMJ's bought in bulk, usually from Precision Delta, over 4.5 grains of 231. Primers and powder bought in bulk as well, 8# jugs/5000 primers at a shot. Realistically, you really dont save a lot of money reloading, you just shoot a LOT more. On average, I usually shoot 15000+ rounds of 9mm a year these days. About 300 rounds a week, sometimes more. I shoot a good bit of .38, .357MAG, and .45acp, a couple of cases of each, as well over the year. Boy, I sure do miss those days of cheap military surplus and 2000 round cases of China Sports/Norinco 9mm. It was cheaper to buy that stuff back then, than it was to buy the components to load the brass.

April 2, 2014, 10:19 PM	#14
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	My self cast LRN reloads come out to around $6/100. That's cheaper than 22lr and I have plenty.

April 2, 2014, 10:38 PM	#15
pelo801 Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2009 Posts: 718	Yes, casting your own brings the cost down even more.

April 2, 2014, 10:53 PM	#16
bitttorrrent Senior Member Join Date: April 21, 2011 Location: Chicago Posts: 703	Wow, 15k rounds a year. That is a lot. I collect brass and have buckets of .38 9mm & .45-.45 lc. During the shortage it did not even affect me cause had 1000's i was and could reload. I think that is more important than saving .02 per round. I just make sure I have good stock of bullet making supplies. Of course I still cant find any .22 last time I looked. Still have 1500 or so stocked but how much would you guys keep on hand? I hate not being able to pick up a brick or two when I'm at Cabelas etc.

April 3, 2014, 12:29 AM	#18
armoredman Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2007 Location: Arizona Posts: 5,299	I bought components in bulk when I had cash and nobody else was buying. Even using certified bullet metal, (not wheel weight lead), I can load up a box of 9mm for less than $5 spent, and that was $5 worth of buying power a few years ago. I don't care about the time I use doing it - I could waste it surfing the internet, after all.

April 3, 2014, 07:35 AM	#20
lapetrarca53 Senior Member Join Date: September 10, 2012 Posts: 108	For 9mm, it costs me between $6.00 and $7.00 per box of 50. Depends mostly on projectile price.

April 3, 2014, 08:59 AM	#22
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	At the extreme side, that being primers at $40 per 1000 and powder $30 per lb. it rounds up to $.06 per round. I cast bullet and I have tons of brass from an earlier life. I use range lead from my clubs indoor range. I did buy a can (500 rounds) of USGI Military Ball ammo for $130 at the last gun show to shoot in EIC matches were ball ammo is required. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

April 3, 2014, 10:01 AM	#23
Vermonter Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2010 Posts: 962	A Gift For Christmas this year I was given an RCBS rock chucker setup along with some primers and a mess of dies. I essentially had zero start up cost other than components. Better than that I had been saving all of my brass over the years so my components were really only primers, bullets, and powder. I can make 100 rounds of 9mm with titegroup, cci500 primer, and cast lead bullets purchased from midway for around $3.50 per box because I haven't paid for a case yet. From start to finish I can make up a batch of $100 within an hour. I could drive an hour round trip and pay $30 bucks plus gas etc or I could spend an hour and pay $7. So it is paying in my case and I am shooting more. YMMV, Vermonter

April 3, 2014, 10:46 AM	#24
Martowski Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 2000 Location: Texas (By Way of Illinois) Posts: 1,376	I can reload 9mm for about $6/box of 50 using plated Berry's bullets, W231, and CCI primers. I have always used single stage equipment, but a couple years ago got a Lee Classic Turret set-up and LOVE it! Only takes me 15 min to reload a box of handgun cartridges, regardless of caliber. Here's a little write-up I did of it when I first got it set up and running: http://martowski.wordpress.com/2012/...rret-delivers/ __________________ Midwestern Ramblings (my amateur firearms blog): http://martowski.wordpress.com/

April 3, 2014, 12:12 PM	#25
AK103K Senior Member Join Date: May 1, 2001 Posts: 10,223	Midway had a good deal on CCI small pistol primers a little while back, $26/1000, and even with the hazmat and their outrageous shipping, it was still a pretty good deal. Natchez had a similar deal a week or so ago. I think it was $28/1000. While I never got into casting, I do use a good bit of hard cast lead with my .38's and .45's. Lead is usually the most economical, but not always, and I actually get FMJ 9mm cheaper than what the couple of places I get HCL bullets from, sell their 125 grain 9mm bullets for. The other issue with the .357's and 9mm's is, I drive them faster than the usual 850-950 fps cutoff and just hate dealing with the leading/cleaning issues. For some reason, even my 158 grain .38 LSWC's lead in my 357's, yet they dont in my .38's. Go figure. That said, I have shot with a couple of people who do cast, and for things I never would have considered, and claim they never have a leading issue. Something about "tempering" the bullets as the come out of the mold. One boy was shooting cast lead out of a 30/06 at over 2000fps. Now if they can do it, why not the commercial casters?