Some when to draw and shoot scenerios

CMichael · January 1, 2012, 03:11 PM

You are outside your wife in the street. You have a CPL and you are carrying.

1) Two muggers pop up. One draws a gun and demands your money.

What do you do?

2) Two muggers pop up. One draws a knife and demands your money.

What do you do?

3) Two muggers pop up. They demand your money.

What do you do?

Alaska444 · January 1, 2012, 03:26 PM

You give them the money and hope that ends the situation since your wife is there and they have two against one and they are already drawn on you. Same with the knife issue.

Two without guns, draw and shoot if you feel your life is in grave and imminent threat of death or grave bodily injury. It all depends on the threat. Give me your wallet sort of thing, or give me your wallet or I will kill you sort of approach. You could throw them your wallet as a distraction, and then draw while they go for the wallet.

In any case, if it is a low probability survival as in the drawn gun or knife scenario, give them the wallet and purse and call 911. In the other situation, it depends on how aggressive the creeps are and what your instinct says about whether they will inflict bodily harm. You could still be overpowered by the two who then take your gun away from you and use it against you. CCW only gives you a modicum of protection and if the creeps are only there for the wallet, give it to them, be a good witness and don't put yourself in that sort of situation in the future.

SHNOMIDO · January 1, 2012, 03:29 PM

1- draw and fire

2-draw and point, back up putting space in between us. yell something insane like
YOU $%^&*&$%^ YOU BETTER GET OUT OF HERE OR ILL BLOW YOUR BRAINS OUT!

try to scare him off to remove the danger and call the cops. if he advances fire.

3- hand on gun, maybe draw and keep pointed low or out of sight. back up and put more space in between us. Say you better not do this im armed, get out of here im calling the cops.

If they present a weapon, proceed to 1 or 2, if not, you should really have no trouble just walking away while controlling the situation and calling the police.

If they for some reason try to use their bare hands to rough up a guy with a pistol, i dont really know. Personally, both legally and ethically, i dont know how i feel about shooting. Its a tough situation, i guess learn some kung-fu.

This is all IMHO, and living in IL i have no personal experience, just my humble desk chair analysis.

hangglider · January 1, 2012, 03:30 PM

Good questions in theory--but a little over-simplified in terms of situational response for my strictly novice way of thinking. numbers 1 & 2 rise to the level of justifying drawing and shooting both--if that's what you're looking for. Number 3 depends.

I'm going to enroll in additional training at some point--it's entirely possible that I'd freeze up scared ****less--I have been held at gunpoint before looking down the barrel of a 45 acp at point-blank range pointed directly between my eyes. It was one of those enhanced perception things that accompanies an about-to-die moment, I think. It was like looking down a manhole of destiny and I was acutely aware of the twitching of the trigger finger on the trigger.

Alaska444 · January 1, 2012, 05:58 PM

If this was WITHOUT wife, all alone, draw and fire is more reasonable. With wife, too much opportunity to get her killed in a gun fight.

If there is only one, and I am alone, I pocket carry right front pocket. I can reach for the gun telling him let me get my wallet, don't shoot, acting like a real wimp and come out with a block to the gun with my left arm and right arm plants in his solar plexus and shoots. That is actually what our CCW instructor taught us and he is about 6'2, 240 and 20 years as an MP in the Army with combat experience. That was his last resort ploy to deploy his handgun and gain a tactical surprise.

However, two shooters, I assume both armed, you are crazy to not just give your wallet and let the creeps go away. My pastors wife was robbed recently at gun point. She gave her purse, he ran away. That is what will happen the majority of time.

Looking for the opportunity to just open up firing is not always the best survival method. We should be ready to just give the wallet and de-escalate if possible. However, if you know that the muggers MO is to shoot and kill the victim perhaps by a recent spate of crimes, then that is different. Feign the wallet trick and shove the snubbie in the belly pointed slightly up and fight for your life. Most muggings don't end in death of the victim. All depends on how you read the situation. If the impression you have is that it is going to be more than a robbery, protect yourself anyway you can.

Otherwise, if all the creep wants is your money, just give it to him and both of you have the opportunity to get right with the Lord one more day.

January 1, 2012, 03:11 PM	#1
CMichael Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 2001 Location: MI Posts: 1,516	Some when to draw and shoot scenerios You are outside your wife in the street. You have a CPL and you are carrying. 1) Two muggers pop up. One draws a gun and demands your money. What do you do? 2) Two muggers pop up. One draws a knife and demands your money. What do you do? 3) Two muggers pop up. They demand your money. What do you do? __________________ "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk" - Tuco, The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly

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January 1, 2012, 03:26 PM	#2
Alaska444 Junior member Join Date: April 3, 2010 Posts: 1,231	You give them the money and hope that ends the situation since your wife is there and they have two against one and they are already drawn on you. Same with the knife issue. Two without guns, draw and shoot if you feel your life is in grave and imminent threat of death or grave bodily injury. It all depends on the threat. Give me your wallet sort of thing, or give me your wallet or I will kill you sort of approach. You could throw them your wallet as a distraction, and then draw while they go for the wallet. In any case, if it is a low probability survival as in the drawn gun or knife scenario, give them the wallet and purse and call 911. In the other situation, it depends on how aggressive the creeps are and what your instinct says about whether they will inflict bodily harm. You could still be overpowered by the two who then take your gun away from you and use it against you. CCW only gives you a modicum of protection and if the creeps are only there for the wallet, give it to them, be a good witness and don't put yourself in that sort of situation in the future.

January 1, 2012, 03:29 PM	#3
SHNOMIDO Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2011 Location: Illinois Posts: 423	1- draw and fire 2-draw and point, back up putting space in between us. yell something insane like YOU $%^&*&$%^ YOU BETTER GET OUT OF HERE OR ILL BLOW YOUR BRAINS OUT! try to scare him off to remove the danger and call the cops. if he advances fire. 3- hand on gun, maybe draw and keep pointed low or out of sight. back up and put more space in between us. Say you better not do this im armed, get out of here im calling the cops. If they present a weapon, proceed to 1 or 2, if not, you should really have no trouble just walking away while controlling the situation and calling the police. If they for some reason try to use their bare hands to rough up a guy with a pistol, i dont really know. Personally, both legally and ethically, i dont know how i feel about shooting. Its a tough situation, i guess learn some kung-fu. This is all IMHO, and living in IL i have no personal experience, just my humble desk chair analysis.

January 1, 2012, 03:30 PM	#4
hangglider Junior member Join Date: December 24, 2011 Posts: 212	Good questions in theory--but a little over-simplified in terms of situational response for my strictly novice way of thinking. numbers 1 & 2 rise to the level of justifying drawing and shooting both--if that's what you're looking for. Number 3 depends. I'm going to enroll in additional training at some point--it's entirely possible that I'd freeze up scared ****less--I have been held at gunpoint before looking down the barrel of a 45 acp at point-blank range pointed directly between my eyes. It was one of those enhanced perception things that accompanies an about-to-die moment, I think. It was like looking down a manhole of destiny and I was acutely aware of the twitching of the trigger finger on the trigger.

January 1, 2012, 05:58 PM	#5
Alaska444 Junior member Join Date: April 3, 2010 Posts: 1,231	If this was WITHOUT wife, all alone, draw and fire is more reasonable. With wife, too much opportunity to get her killed in a gun fight. If there is only one, and I am alone, I pocket carry right front pocket. I can reach for the gun telling him let me get my wallet, don't shoot, acting like a real wimp and come out with a block to the gun with my left arm and right arm plants in his solar plexus and shoots. That is actually what our CCW instructor taught us and he is about 6'2, 240 and 20 years as an MP in the Army with combat experience. That was his last resort ploy to deploy his handgun and gain a tactical surprise. However, two shooters, I assume both armed, you are crazy to not just give your wallet and let the creeps go away. My pastors wife was robbed recently at gun point. She gave her purse, he ran away. That is what will happen the majority of time. Looking for the opportunity to just open up firing is not always the best survival method. We should be ready to just give the wallet and de-escalate if possible. However, if you know that the muggers MO is to shoot and kill the victim perhaps by a recent spate of crimes, then that is different. Feign the wallet trick and shove the snubbie in the belly pointed slightly up and fight for your life. Most muggings don't end in death of the victim. All depends on how you read the situation. If the impression you have is that it is going to be more than a robbery, protect yourself anyway you can. Otherwise, if all the creep wants is your money, just give it to him and both of you have the opportunity to get right with the Lord one more day.