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Old July 31, 2013, 11:13 PM   #76
zxcvbob
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HiBC: that's right, or at least pretty close.
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Old August 1, 2013, 06:26 AM   #77
Spats McGee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 57K
LOL Spats! My background is in design and engineering and I would feel comfortable on the stand countering any expert witness or any prosecutor who might decide to make it an issue procedurally or otherwise. Obviously, I'm not an attorney. Here's hoping that you aren't either!
Actually, I am. I've got ~10 years of litigation experience. You may "feel comfortable" about what you think you could do on the stand, but you have entirely missed the boat on the legal issues.
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Old August 1, 2013, 09:11 AM   #78
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57K,

I take you at your word that you are more than capable of debating an attorney or an expert witness head-to-head in an open forum in your field of expertise, but the rules of the courtroom will never allow you that opportunity.

Even if you do succeed in getting your points across your arguments will be heard by a jury with no experience in your field and in the business of swaying a lay audience the prosecuting attorney will have far more practice than you do. The dangers of testifying in your own behalf are so great that your own attorney will almost always strongly recommend against it unless you're losing badly and he places you on the stand as a last ditch effort.

I see in your posts the belief that if you act honorably that you will be exonerated in the end. You should be right. I wish your were right, but your belief adds to your risk.
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Old August 1, 2013, 05:07 PM   #79
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Well, Spats, you, yourself posted the Texas statute that clearly states that a Texan required to use force or deadly force in self defense, and when that act is deemed justifiable, they can not be sued in civil court. There is no precedent to counter that and NO one has ever been prosecuted in Texas, nor to my knowledge, any self defense shooting where a handload was used even before the statute existed.

40-82, as I said before, I am only speaking for Texas residents and NO other state. Look at what happened to George Zimmerman. Initially, he wasn't even charged. Direct pressure from the white-house and our so-called attorney general, along with profiteering (media money) "civil rights" spokesmen like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are responsible for him being tried in kangaroo court, by the liberal news networks and the court of public opinion, mostly Obama supporters. The MSM didn't hesitate to report that Zimmerman probably overstepped his bounds by pursuing Martin after their first confrontation and was advised not to pursue by the 911 operator Zimmerman spoke to. How many times did you see them report that Martin was a synthetic drug abuser to the point of having liver damage caused from that synthetic narcotic, or his prior record of burglaries.

Before I logged on to the forum today, I sent emails to both my state congressman and senator because the Texas legislature has been called into another special session. One of the bills before them that they have yet to act on is the "Second Amendment Protection Act" that essentially protects Texas residents from any new national anti-gun legislation that is counter to Texas law and the second amendment as it exists today. I urge all Texans to do the same. As far as hypothesis, it might well be challenged by SCOTUS. Then again, that might fuel the fire for the secessionist movement in Texas.
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Old August 1, 2013, 06:30 PM   #80
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This has all been an interesting read.

The facts of the matter however are, if I am ever faced with having to use deadly force in defense of myself, my family, or someone else should that be the case, and believe me this is something I would truly very much so hate to have to be faced with. Still in all, I will be using what ever is in, whatever firearm I have with me at the time. I do not have an abundance of factory loads to start with. I never have, and don't plan to stock up just in case. I'm certainly not going to run out and pick some up just to have around. I'm knocking hard on 50yrs old and have loaded my own ammo since I was a youth with my pop. I'm not going to change my ways simply because I "MIGHT" have something happen. IF it happens I will have plenty of other issues to think about and whether or not I should have had factory ammo or not isn't even going to be on the list. The fact is if the SHTF, I can only hope that I, my family, or whom ever I stepped up for can all walk away.

I will simply have to hope for the best, and that I can at least be present to give my side of the story.

As for the rest of this argument, I believe it has been about beaten to death. There will always be both sides of the point, and it will never become satisfactory for all.
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Old August 1, 2013, 07:46 PM   #81
Spats McGee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 57K
Well, Spats, you, yourself posted the Texas statute that clearly states that a Texan required to use force or deadly force in self defense, and when that act is deemed justifiable, they can not be sued in civil court. There is no precedent to counter that and NO one has ever been prosecuted in Texas, nor to my knowledge, any self defense shooting where a handload was used even before the statute existed.
I posted a Texas statute, but it doesn't say what you have claimed. Let's look at it again. You initially claimed that:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 57K
Old Stony, living in Texas you should know that in a shooting deemed justifiable by LE, you can't be tried in a civil court for "damages".
How do you know that it's LE (as in police) that make the determination that a shooting is justified? How do you know that a court determination of "justified" isn't required? I don't think you do. You certainly don't have any precedent to back up that claim. I, on the other hand, presented you with a citation to a case (out of the District Court of Beaumont, if memory serves) that indicates that the statute is a defense to liability, not a defense to suit.

The next claim that you made was:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 57K
. . . .You seem to be trying to make a case for a civil liability lawsuit before a criminal court has even tried a defendant which can't even occur without said person being charged with homicide.
What is your basis for the claim that a defendant must be charged with homicide as a prerequisite to a civil suit?
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Old August 1, 2013, 07:58 PM   #82
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We have a thread turned all catty-whompus... Where we are now is so far removed from the OP and is devolved into a roundy round game of whap the stinkin' sleepin' pony....

Closed...

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