Raven5 vs. billdeserthills

raven5 · July 22, 2007, 12:06 PM

He purchased two Beretta .25s from me recently. Payment was prompt. He had asked for a shipping quote and I gave him one via USPS.

After attempting to ship the firearms to him (more on this later) I assumed they had arrived after three weeks. I didn't hear anything in the mean time so I assumed he had received them ok. He contacted me and asked where they were. Concerned I checked with my shipping FFL and he gave me the receipt where he had shipped them THREE WEEKS! previous. Well, the package was returned as undeliverable, finally.

BilldesertHills then said that only UPS/FEDEX packages can be delivered to his premises and nothing by the US Mail. Well now, I've never heard of an address that can be delivered to by private carriers that the US Mail can't. He said to ship them to his PO Box as everyone else does. Well, attempting this through three different local PO branches none of them would ship to a PO Box; not a handgun.

In the meantime, he kept sending me extremely vulgar emails that were very threatening with extensive foul language towards myself and my FFL, saying that "we should have read the FFL" and so on. I was nothing but nice in the meantime trying to resolve this matter for him.

Eventually, I had to re-ship them overnight by UPS at my own expense which at this point wasn't worth it for two inexpensive .25 autos.

I believe he's just one of those guys that gets a FFL so he can deal out of his home and avoid fees.

Who has an address that the ATF will recognize but the US Mail won't?

This guy is bad news. I know he hangs here so fair warning to all. Don't get burned. He'll leave you bad feedback on another site (Gunbroker) while the items are still in transit.

billdeserthills · July 23, 2007, 11:42 PM

I bought and paid for the guns in full back on June 13- still have not received my package!
Why is he whining, I'm the one who lost my money! By The Way, I'd Like My Money Returned or MY GUNS!

I even posted my ship to and US Mail addresses in advance along with instructions on the neccessary delivery short story, I've been waiting over 5 weeks, still no guns.

Why don't you (Raven5) enlighten us all on whatever you think I threatened to do to you after waiting over 5 WEEKS for my property. The only "threat" I have ever made was that I would file a US Mail Fraud Report, and I will if I have not received my money back or my guns inside of 60 days. Unfortunately the US Mail requires me to wait for a full 60 days. I am a Locksmith& Gun Dealer Raven5 and everything I e-mailed to you is a true fact.

billdeserthills · July 23, 2007, 11:46 PM

If you sent my package overnight How come I haven't seen it? Sorry to inform you, but they call it "overnight" because it is delivered the next day. Never have received it. Why don't you e-mail me a tracking number?

billdeserthills · July 24, 2007, 12:09 AM

of my home, well you are wrong I have a storefront. In fact just because you never heard of The US Mail not delivering to a rural store, doesn't make it a lie, Obviously after your so-called Gun Dealer ignored the very careful instructions that say"US Mail must use P.O. Box ONLY" he still tries to send the package US Mail to the address that said "UPS or FedEx ONLY"
Besides I only have your word that the package was ever even sent. After sending your payment (US Postal M/o) sent on June 13th, and now you're whining cause I gave you a bad mark on Gunbroker! What was I supposed to do? I have been very patient for FIVE WEEKS. Now give me back my money OR Give me the item I BOUGHT.
I can't even figure out why you are complaining? About What-The Fact That You Have MY MONEY? Or Are You Unhappy Cause I never received the guns I paid you for?

**JohnKSa** · July 24, 2007, 01:26 AM

The Firing Line Forum Rules apply here.

State your case but do it WITHOUT namecalling or insults.

I'm going to merge these two threads and rename the result.

billdeserthills · July 24, 2007, 11:36 PM

JohnKSa, I wish you hadn't edited the remark made by wildalaska, for some reason I did find it reassuring.

billdeserthills · July 24, 2007, 11:47 PM

Raven5 Do you really think I should have waited more than 5 weeks to leave you bad feedback? I have only left bad feedback twice in the years I have used Gunbroker once was yours, you cannot tell anyone that I was not patient enough. The other time I bought a gun, had a problem&was invited to send it back for a refund on the gun only-I waited and waited, never got my money back from those people. Even Gunbroker thought I waited too long to post a problem. I e-mailed you my two addresses and the ship to/mail to instructions before I ever even got the US Postal M/O mailed to you.
The way I see it, you just found out something you did not want to believe, just like your "gun dealer"did. I hope the next time you receive instructions for anything,you find a way to take them seriously!
By the way There is No US Mail delivery to my house either, Maybe that is
why I've had the same P.O. Box address for almost thirty years!

billdeserthills · July 25, 2007, 05:56 PM

my package today! Thanks
By the way, you know it isn't your fault that your "gundealer" was unable to follow the simple instructions I put on the FFL. I would be happy to mail the box with the incorrect address on it, if you want to make him refund your money for sending this out to the wrong address originally.

Kontender · July 25, 2007, 06:06 PM

Sounds to me like a couple of honest mistakes that made this deal go bad for both of you. Bury the hatchet and go on. If this is all you guys have to worry about then you really don't have anyhting to worry about.

billdeserthills · July 25, 2007, 07:22 PM

Kontender, it's just that Raven5 wanted extra money from me and although I'm not going to pay any more than I already have, I'm just trying to find a way for him to get part of his money back.

keebz · January 4, 2008, 12:06 AM

raven5 , i too dealt with someone wanting more money after i already shipped the gun . i feel your pain.

billdeserthills · January 4, 2008, 11:42 PM

Seems to me you offered to send quite a bit more money than you did send!

**JohnKSa** · January 5, 2008, 12:11 AM

Thought this one was done a long time ago. It is now.

July 22, 2007, 12:06 PM	#1
raven5 Junior Member Join Date: April 21, 2007 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 4	Raven5 vs. billdeserthills He purchased two Beretta .25s from me recently. Payment was prompt. He had asked for a shipping quote and I gave him one via USPS. After attempting to ship the firearms to him (more on this later) I assumed they had arrived after three weeks. I didn't hear anything in the mean time so I assumed he had received them ok. He contacted me and asked where they were. Concerned I checked with my shipping FFL and he gave me the receipt where he had shipped them THREE WEEKS! previous. Well, the package was returned as undeliverable, finally. BilldesertHills then said that only UPS/FEDEX packages can be delivered to his premises and nothing by the US Mail. Well now, I've never heard of an address that can be delivered to by private carriers that the US Mail can't. He said to ship them to his PO Box as everyone else does. Well, attempting this through three different local PO branches none of them would ship to a PO Box; not a handgun. In the meantime, he kept sending me extremely vulgar emails that were very threatening with extensive foul language towards myself and my FFL, saying that "we should have read the FFL" and so on. I was nothing but nice in the meantime trying to resolve this matter for him. Eventually, I had to re-ship them overnight by UPS at my own expense which at this point wasn't worth it for two inexpensive .25 autos. I believe he's just one of those guys that gets a FFL so he can deal out of his home and avoid fees. Who has an address that the ATF will recognize but the US Mail won't? This guy is bad news. I know he hangs here so fair warning to all. Don't get burned. He'll leave you bad feedback on another site (Gunbroker) while the items are still in transit.

July 23, 2007, 11:42 PM	#2
billdeserthills Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 110	Buyer Beware Raven5 I bought and paid for the guns in full back on June 13- still have not received my package! Why is he whining, I'm the one who lost my money! By The Way, I'd Like My Money Returned or MY GUNS! I even posted my ship to and US Mail addresses in advance along with instructions on the neccessary delivery short story, I've been waiting over 5 weeks, still no guns. Why don't you (Raven5) enlighten us all on whatever you think I threatened to do to you after waiting over 5 WEEKS for my property. The only "threat" I have ever made was that I would file a US Mail Fraud Report, and I will if I have not received my money back or my guns inside of 60 days. Unfortunately the US Mail requires me to wait for a full 60 days. I am a Locksmith& Gun Dealer Raven5 and everything I e-mailed to you is a true fact.

July 23, 2007, 11:46 PM	#3
billdeserthills Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 110	Overnight was last week If you sent my package overnight How come I haven't seen it? Sorry to inform you, but they call it "overnight" because it is delivered the next day. Never have received it. Why don't you e-mail me a tracking number?

July 24, 2007, 12:09 AM	#4
billdeserthills Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 110	As Far as believing I work out of my home, well you are wrong I have a storefront. In fact just because you never heard of The US Mail not delivering to a rural store, doesn't make it a lie, Obviously after your so-called Gun Dealer ignored the very careful instructions that say"US Mail must use P.O. Box ONLY" he still tries to send the package US Mail to the address that said "UPS or FedEx ONLY" Besides I only have your word that the package was ever even sent. After sending your payment (US Postal M/o) sent on June 13th, and now you're whining cause I gave you a bad mark on Gunbroker! What was I supposed to do? I have been very patient for FIVE WEEKS. Now give me back my money OR Give me the item I BOUGHT. I can't even figure out why you are complaining? About What-The Fact That You Have MY MONEY? Or Are You Unhappy Cause I never received the guns I paid you for?

July 24, 2007, 01:26 AM	#5
JohnKSa Staff Join Date: February 12, 2001 Location: DFW Area Posts: 24,985	The Firing Line Forum Rules apply here. State your case but do it WITHOUT namecalling or insults. I'm going to merge these two threads and rename the result. __________________ Do you know about the TEXAS State Rifle Association?

July 24, 2007, 11:36 PM	#6
billdeserthills Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 110	Editing Remark JohnKSa, I wish you hadn't edited the remark made by wildalaska, for some reason I did find it reassuring.

July 24, 2007, 11:47 PM	#7
billdeserthills Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 110	Patience Raven5 Do you really think I should have waited more than 5 weeks to leave you bad feedback? I have only left bad feedback twice in the years I have used Gunbroker once was yours, you cannot tell anyone that I was not patient enough. The other time I bought a gun, had a problem&was invited to send it back for a refund on the gun only-I waited and waited, never got my money back from those people. Even Gunbroker thought I waited too long to post a problem. I e-mailed you my two addresses and the ship to/mail to instructions before I ever even got the US Postal M/O mailed to you. The way I see it, you just found out something you did not want to believe, just like your "gun dealer"did. I hope the next time you receive instructions for anything,you find a way to take them seriously! By the way There is No US Mail delivery to my house either, Maybe that is why I've had the same P.O. Box address for almost thirty years!

July 25, 2007, 05:56 PM	#8
billdeserthills Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 110	Wow I actually Got my package today! Thanks By the way, you know it isn't your fault that your "gundealer" was unable to follow the simple instructions I put on the FFL. I would be happy to mail the box with the incorrect address on it, if you want to make him refund your money for sending this out to the wrong address originally.

July 25, 2007, 06:06 PM	#9
Kontender Junior Member Join Date: July 25, 2007 Location: GA Posts: 14	Sounds to me like a couple of honest mistakes that made this deal go bad for both of you. Bury the hatchet and go on. If this is all you guys have to worry about then you really don't have anyhting to worry about.

July 25, 2007, 07:22 PM	#10
billdeserthills Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 110	I agree with you Kontender, it's just that Raven5 wanted extra money from me and although I'm not going to pay any more than I already have, I'm just trying to find a way for him to get part of his money back.

January 4, 2008, 12:06 AM	#11
keebz Member Join Date: September 29, 2007 Posts: 34	raven5 , i too dealt with someone wanting more money after i already shipped the gun . i feel your pain.

January 4, 2008, 11:42 PM	#12
billdeserthills Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 110	Awww... I want some Whine Seems to me you offered to send quite a bit more money than you did send!

January 5, 2008, 12:11 AM	#13
JohnKSa Staff Join Date: February 12, 2001 Location: DFW Area Posts: 24,985	Thought this one was done a long time ago. It is now. __________________ Do you know about the TEXAS State Rifle Association?