why so serious? Bubba? - Page 3

landlord · February 7, 2012, 05:03 PM

did I read right some where you can get a mosin nagant for under a hundred?

rickyrick · February 7, 2012, 05:04 PM

Yes at times 79 bucks.

landlord · February 7, 2012, 05:11 PM

I try to get and keep my old mil rifles the way I find them. but I respect the action of the gun along with the history of it.

inaweofschon · February 7, 2012, 06:12 PM

I recently picked up a sporterized 91/30 that has matching numbers and a really nice bore/crown. I have a "stock" 91/30 that does not have matching numbers. I will be swapping things around until I have the matching numbers in the original stock.

What does that make me?

Edward429451 · February 7, 2012, 06:21 PM

I certainly wouldn't bubbaize that 1894 Winchester, but for the most part, lifes too short to leave the 57 Chevy in the garage so, weapon dependant...in a heartbeat.

If that makes people mad, well pffft.

If you've never made someone mad, check your pulse, you may be dead lol.

emcon5 · February 7, 2012, 06:40 PM

Again, what has "No Collector Value" today, may not have "No Collector Value" even next year.

Two years ago, Soviet Capture K98s were available all over the place for about $200. Now, when you can find them they are about twice that.

Ten years ago, Swede Mausers were going for $99 for a M96 and ~$125 for a M38, retail. Now good examples of either are going for $500.

The newest WW2-era rifles are 67 years old, and they aren't making any more.

If you want to pimp out your milsurp, do yourself a favor and keep the parts, and don't do anything that can't be reversed.

Or leave it alone, and take it out and shoot it. The Sacramento Valley shooting center has Vintage Military silhouette matches monthly, and Long Range Milsurp matches every couple months, out to 800 yards. Hell, I shot a 3-gun match with my K98, in the rain.

Yeah, safe queen.

Dr. Strangelove · February 8, 2012, 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David_The_Gnome

People said the same thing about all those surplus 1911's and look how much those are worth today, even for a mix-master.

Ha! I'm only 38 and I can remember when they were $200.00 surplus, but who the hell wanted an old rattletrap like that?

Abel · February 8, 2012, 04:44 AM

These are the funniest threads to me. I am easily amused I suppose. I just can't wrap my little mind around the extreme desire to keep things original. Even the Constitution has several Amendments. From now on, I refer to sporterized milsurps as amended milsurps!

tahunua001 · February 8, 2012, 07:23 AM

I'd rather amend guns that the constitution but this is drifting into the realm of political discussions which were discouraged on TFL last I checked.

Emissions control 5,
that as a very nice mauser, I really wish I could find a decent one but at the same time I would dread every visit to the ammo shop. I have never even seen a 3 gun match but I find it hilarious that everyone and their dogs use AR15s and frown on anything else and yet you were able to use an old bolt rifle. this makes me want to get my little brothers enfield dialed in(better sights than mine) and compete with it

Old Grump · February 8, 2012, 08:25 AM

Their gun their choice, I prefer mine simple and functional and if a change won't make it shoot better I don't make it. Shooting good counts more than pretty in my book.

Also in my book tactical is a response to a situation and how you react to it to resolve it to your satisfaction. Not hardware.

Tacticool is synonymous with tacky and only makes the gun heavy, bulky, more things to go wrong and more likely something will get broke just when you think you need it the most. If tacticool makes you happy well it's your money, your gun, and you have only you to please. Just don't show it to me and expect me to say, "Like wow, really neat that there gun is like really slick you know, oh wow can I touch it?" It ain't gonna happen.

madcratebuilder · February 8, 2012, 10:10 AM

My God! Some posts sound like they came from the current Administration, "Only I can decide what is best for you" This is a free country, people can do as they please with their possessions.

I am not advocating sportering a good condition or hard to find mil-surp, but they made millions upon millions of these.

Personally I like reverse sporterizing, restore that sporter to it's once military trim. You can even save the most butchered rifles.

This No4 had the barrel cut pretty short, add a little wood and instant "tanker"

emcon5 · February 8, 2012, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Emissions control 5,
that as a very nice mauser, I really wish I could find a decent one but at the same time I would dread every visit to the ammo shop. I have never even seen a 3 gun match but I find it hilarious that everyone and their dogs use AR15s and frown on anything else and yet you were able to use an old bolt rifle. this makes me want to get my little brothers enfield dialed in(better sights than mine) and compete with it

Surplus 8mm ammo is still available for about 30¢/round, and while corrosive, that really isn't a big deal. Especially if you remember that every round ever fired in the rifle up to the point you buy it was corrosive. Just do a quick cleaning after shooting it with water or Windex to neutralize the salts, and it is fine.

I was the only bolt gun there, and while I didn't win, I didn't come in last either. Most importantly, I had fun.

Chris_B · February 8, 2012, 04:14 PM

Quote:

These are the funniest threads to me. I am easily amused I suppose. I just can't wrap my little mind around the extreme desire to keep things original. Even the Constitution has several Amendments. From now on, I refer to sporterized milsurps as amended milsurps!

Again, it depends on what you mean. Let em ask you a question: if somebody gave you a documented correct 1943 Inland M1A1, would you modify it by drilling and tapping the receiver for a scope? How about one of the six groove barrel Smith Corona 03A3s? Or an M1C? Or even an all-correct M1 rifle from 1940? Probably not, I assume. An SKS? Well, you'd probably not feel it has a lot of value

The thing here is not that you cannot do it because somebody else says you shouldn't, it's because well, you probably wouldn't want to lose the value of the thing

While it's my opinion that yes, you can do any damn thing you like to your rifles, it's also my opinion that I can call you a fool for ruining something that can't be replaced- opinions have a nasty habit of being something of a two way street

johnbt · February 8, 2012, 04:42 PM

"if somebody gave you a documented correct 1943 Inland M1A1"

Does it come with the original box and papers?

What the heck is it anyway, a tank or something? See, some of us don't care those old clunky surplus guns.

But that's okay because we're not the ones cutting them up because we don't own any.

If you're giving stuff away, got any made-in-Switzerland pistols? How about a Browning Superposed 28 ga LTRK field gun with open chokes?

John

tahunua001 · February 8, 2012, 05:13 PM

Quote:

"if somebody gave you a documented correct 1943 Inland M1A1"

Does it come with the original box and papers?

What the heck is it anyway, a tank or something? See, some of us don't care those old clunky surplus guns. But that's okay because we're not the ones cutting them up because we don't own any.

If you're giving stuff away, got any made-in-Switzerland pistols? How about a Browning Superposed 28 ga LTRK field gun with open chokes?

John

am I the only one that see's no relevance in this post?

deerslayer303 · February 8, 2012, 05:32 PM

I say its your rifle, do what you want with it. No different than cutting up a 69 Camaro to make 1/4 mile passes all day long. Or Putting those ridiculous MONSTER TRUCK size WHEELS on a MUSCLE CAR! Now with that said I will and am going to bubba up a 91/30 Mosin Izzy Round Receiver, there are only about 17 MILLION of these things floating around so I don't see the harm. I like shooting the 54R round so I want to accurize it as much as possible.
A fella at work has a rare K98 and he has a Boyds stock on it timiney trigger scope, and he loves it he hunts with it religiously. He has the original parts and can return it to original (except for the tapped receiver). I personally wouldn't do that to it, but he is happy and so therefore I am. And I regularly load him up some hunting rounds for it!

deerslayer303 · February 8, 2012, 05:39 PM

Oh and just think of it this way. The more that are bubba'd the more the rest that are not are worth. Just my .02

hornetguy · February 8, 2012, 05:54 PM

In my opinion, for my guns... pristine examples of a military rifle would not be modified at all. Have you ever seen a nice Persian Mauser? Work of art... I saw those for sale about 20 years ago, but they were in the 500 dollar range at that time IIRC.
Others are, as well.. However, most rifles of that quality are not readily available at "bubba" like prices.
Anything else is fair game, if I get the urge to tweak. My deer rifle came to me as a "nice" Swedish mauser.. nothing collectible, just nice. My .35 Whelen was an "ok" 1909 Argentine Mauser. It was not a "collectible" to me.. probably not to any serious collector. My SKS is a Norinco. I painted it's stock black, after adding about 2" of maple to the butt end of it, and inletting the metal butt plate from my Swedish mauser to it, since my arms are a little longer than the average Chinese soldier.

gringojosh · February 8, 2012, 06:12 PM

Just don't sporterize this.

Chris_B · February 8, 2012, 06:59 PM

Quote:

"if somebody gave you a documented correct 1943 Inland M1A1"

Does it come with the original box and papers?

What the heck is it anyway, a tank or something? See, some of us don't care those old clunky surplus guns. But that's okay because we're not the ones cutting them up because we don't own any.

If you're giving stuff away, got any made-in-Switzerland pistols? How about a Browning Superposed 28 ga LTRK field gun with open chokes?

John

Respectfully John, you've missed the point entirely, on several levels. Your perception is skewed here, and I'm not sure you understand the example I used.

In the collectible firearms arena, there's a thing called 'Provenance'. In the case of the M1A1 carbine, there are no "papers" from the manufacturer and never were. However, there was a case of a documented M1A1 that was a firearm used in WWII, and is documented by the vet that brought it home. The case was not very long ago. In 2008 it sold for over 20,000 dollars, precisely because it had history and provenance, as well as being in its preserved state. It is a rare collectible firearm- they made thousands, but that was 70 years ago. It is not 1945 any more, and the pool of available examples today is the pool of similar examples, not the raw numbers made when new. You seem to feel that if they made 100,000 in WWII, they are common firearms today. if so that is flawed logic. How many documented 1969 Camaro Z/28s or ZL-1s are there today? The same number as were made on the production line? Obviously not.

Let me ask again- if I gave you a documented M1A1 such as this, would you drill and tap the receiver for a scope? Please don't cloud the issue by somehow using a tank as a yardstick, as if a tank is something old and valuable but a firearm cannot be, and please also do not bring other types of collectibles into the discussion. The question is about milsurp firearms, not fowling pieces. I just want your honest answer.

Chris_B · February 8, 2012, 07:11 PM

Quote:

No different than cutting up a 69 Camaro to make 1/4 mile passes all day long

I'm gonna touch on something I just posted on by way of reply, because I know a little about collectible firearms, and a whole stinkin bunch about muscle cars.

Your take on this is a used car, not as a collectible. In your youth, even in mine (born in '71) these cars were just crummy used cars.

You would no more cut up a pristine '69 Camaro than I would. We both may cut up a crummy worn out rattletrap '69. But then again, depending on what it is...you may think twice. Knowledge is power, as in all things. If you find any unrestored, crummy '69 Camaros with X33 or X77 on the cowl tag, that has an engine block casting number reading 3932386, 3956618 or 3970010, and has a Holley with a DZ code going for 10 grand or so that you have ideas about cutting up, send me an e-mail and I'll explain why you don't want to cut it up to make a drag car even though it's "just" a 1969 Camaro

The issue, whether it is guns or cars, is that there are more shades than black and white in the spectrum

plumbernater · February 8, 2012, 07:55 PM

This mauser was a WW2 send back already sporterized. It was taken from a sniper from what my uncle told.

tahunua001 · February 9, 2012, 07:38 AM

gringo josh. unless that's a silver plated kentucky rifle that was intended as a gift for George Washington, I would say that has already been bubba'd to some extent. I don't know that too many had been made in stainless.

plumbernater,
that's an interesting mauser. I wasn't aware of any sporterized sniper rifles before vietnem. guess you learn something new every day.

madcratebuilder · February 9, 2012, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris_B

In the collectible firearms arena, there's a thing called 'Provenance'. In the case of the M1A1 carbine, there are no "papers" from the manufacturer and never were. However, there was a case of a documented M1A1 that was a firearm used in WWII, and is documented by the vet that brought it home. The case was not very long ago. In 2008 it sold for over 20,000 dollars, precisely because it had history and provenance, as well as being in its preserved state.

Show me one documented case of a American GI bringing home his issued USGI rifle, other than stealing government property.

'Provenance' and 'bring back' are two terms that set me off. Both are used by mil-surp sellers with to much BS to shovel out.

A 'bring back' well have documentation, otherwise it's a gun show story.

I could easily make up a BS story about the CORRECT Inland paratrooper I built from parts. I can easily fake documentation.

Bring back documentation can be anything from a hand written note from the CO or a regular DOD form.

rickyrick · February 9, 2012, 08:46 AM

I have a no4 that was slightly sporterized and it was used by a family member in Vietnam. I was just a kid, but I remember the rifle coming back and its in photos. Much of the finish was worn off of the barrel and magazine, but otherwise is was in decent shape.

I wanted to keep it the way it returned so, for years I made sure to keep some oil on the bare spots. I started to become concerned that the rifle will stay in the family but not receive the care to keep it from rusting after I pass it on....so I went ahead and blued it to help it last longer. I thought about it because it only has some family value but no real value. I thought it would be better off with some finish than none.

View Poll Results: would you sporterise/tacticool a milsurp rifle?
not in a million years!	61	29.61%
only if it had no collectors vallue	105	50.97%
in a heartbeat!	40	19.42%
Voters: 206. You may not vote on this poll

February 7, 2012, 05:04 PM	#52
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,237	Yes at times 79 bucks. __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

February 8, 2012, 07:23 AM	#59
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	I'd rather amend guns that the constitution but this is drifting into the realm of political discussions which were discouraged on TFL last I checked. Emissions control 5, that as a very nice mauser, I really wish I could find a decent one but at the same time I would dread every visit to the ammo shop. I have never even seen a 3 gun match but I find it hilarious that everyone and their dogs use AR15s and frown on anything else and yet you were able to use an old bolt rifle. this makes me want to get my little brothers enfield dialed in(better sights than mine) and compete with it __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

February 8, 2012, 08:25 AM	#60
Old Grump Member in memoriam Join Date: April 9, 2009 Location: Blue River Wisconsin, in Posts: 3,144	Their gun their choice, I prefer mine simple and functional and if a change won't make it shoot better I don't make it. Shooting good counts more than pretty in my book. Also in my book tactical is a response to a situation and how you react to it to resolve it to your satisfaction. Not hardware. Tacticool is synonymous with tacky and only makes the gun heavy, bulky, more things to go wrong and more likely something will get broke just when you think you need it the most. If tacticool makes you happy well it's your money, your gun, and you have only you to please. Just don't show it to me and expect me to say, "Like wow, really neat that there gun is like really slick you know, oh wow can I touch it?" It ain't gonna happen. __________________ Good intentions will always be pleaded for any assumption of power. The Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern will, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters. --Daniel Webster--

February 8, 2012, 05:54 PM	#68
hornetguy Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2011 Location: on the north side of DFW Posts: 970	In my opinion, for my guns... pristine examples of a military rifle would not be modified at all. Have you ever seen a nice Persian Mauser? Work of art... I saw those for sale about 20 years ago, but they were in the 500 dollar range at that time IIRC. Others are, as well.. However, most rifles of that quality are not readily available at "bubba" like prices. Anything else is fair game, if I get the urge to tweak. My deer rifle came to me as a "nice" Swedish mauser.. nothing collectible, just nice. My .35 Whelen was an "ok" 1909 Argentine Mauser. It was not a "collectible" to me.. probably not to any serious collector. My SKS is a Norinco. I painted it's stock black, after adding about 2" of maple to the butt end of it, and inletting the metal butt plate from my Swedish mauser to it, since my arms are a little longer than the average Chinese soldier. __________________ I always felt that if I got to the point where I thought it was time to bury my firearms, it was actually time to pick them up..

February 7, 2012, 05:03 PM	#51
landlord Member Join Date: February 4, 2012 Posts: 71	did I read right some where you can get a mosin nagant for under a hundred?

February 7, 2012, 05:11 PM	#53
landlord Member Join Date: February 4, 2012 Posts: 71	I try to get and keep my old mil rifles the way I find them. but I respect the action of the gun along with the history of it.

February 7, 2012, 06:12 PM	#54
inaweofschon Member Join Date: December 29, 2008 Location: Idaho Posts: 19	I recently picked up a sporterized 91/30 that has matching numbers and a really nice bore/crown. I have a "stock" 91/30 that does not have matching numbers. I will be swapping things around until I have the matching numbers in the original stock. What does that make me?

February 7, 2012, 06:21 PM	#55
Edward429451 Junior member Join Date: November 12, 2000 Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado Posts: 9,494	I certainly wouldn't bubbaize that 1894 Winchester, but for the most part, lifes too short to leave the 57 Chevy in the garage so, weapon dependant...in a heartbeat. If that makes people mad, well pffft. If you've never made someone mad, check your pulse, you may be dead lol.

February 7, 2012, 06:40 PM	#56
emcon5 Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 1999 Location: High Desert NV Posts: 2,850	Again, what has "No Collector Value" today, may not have "No Collector Value" even next year. Two years ago, Soviet Capture K98s were available all over the place for about $200. Now, when you can find them they are about twice that. Ten years ago, Swede Mausers were going for $99 for a M96 and ~$125 for a M38, retail. Now good examples of either are going for $500. The newest WW2-era rifles are 67 years old, and they aren't making any more. If you want to pimp out your milsurp, do yourself a favor and keep the parts, and don't do anything that can't be reversed. Or leave it alone, and take it out and shoot it. The Sacramento Valley shooting center has Vintage Military silhouette matches monthly, and Long Range Milsurp matches every couple months, out to 800 yards. Hell, I shot a 3-gun match with my K98, in the rain. Yeah, safe queen.

February 8, 2012, 04:44 AM	#58
Abel Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2006 Posts: 1,161	These are the funniest threads to me. I am easily amused I suppose. I just can't wrap my little mind around the extreme desire to keep things original. Even the Constitution has several Amendments. From now on, I refer to sporterized milsurps as amended milsurps!

February 8, 2012, 10:10 AM	#61
madcratebuilder Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2007 Location: Northern Orygun Posts: 4,923	My God! Some posts sound like they came from the current Administration, "Only I can decide what is best for you" This is a free country, people can do as they please with their possessions. I am not advocating sportering a good condition or hard to find mil-surp, but they made millions upon millions of these. Personally I like reverse sporterizing, restore that sporter to it's once military trim. You can even save the most butchered rifles. This No4 had the barrel cut pretty short, add a little wood and instant "tanker"

February 8, 2012, 04:42 PM	#64
johnbt Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1999 Location: Richmond, Virginia USA Posts: 6,004	"if somebody gave you a documented correct 1943 Inland M1A1" Does it come with the original box and papers? What the heck is it anyway, a tank or something? See, some of us don't care those old clunky surplus guns. But that's okay because we're not the ones cutting them up because we don't own any. If you're giving stuff away, got any made-in-Switzerland pistols? How about a Browning Superposed 28 ga LTRK field gun with open chokes? John

February 8, 2012, 05:32 PM	#66
deerslayer303 Senior Member Join Date: January 10, 2011 Location: Leesville SC Posts: 2,653	I say its your rifle, do what you want with it. No different than cutting up a 69 Camaro to make 1/4 mile passes all day long. Or Putting those ridiculous MONSTER TRUCK size WHEELS on a MUSCLE CAR! Now with that said I will and am going to bubba up a 91/30 Mosin Izzy Round Receiver, there are only about 17 MILLION of these things floating around so I don't see the harm. I like shooting the 54R round so I want to accurize it as much as possible. A fella at work has a rare K98 and he has a Boyds stock on it timiney trigger scope, and he loves it he hunts with it religiously. He has the original parts and can return it to original (except for the tapped receiver). I personally wouldn't do that to it, but he is happy and so therefore I am. And I regularly load him up some hunting rounds for it!

February 8, 2012, 05:39 PM	#67
deerslayer303 Senior Member Join Date: January 10, 2011 Location: Leesville SC Posts: 2,653	Oh and just think of it this way. The more that are bubba'd the more the rest that are not are worth. Just my .02

February 8, 2012, 06:12 PM	#69
gringojosh Member Join Date: December 1, 2011 Posts: 42	Just don't sporterize this.

February 8, 2012, 07:55 PM	#72
plumbernater Senior Member Join Date: September 1, 2010 Posts: 165	This mauser was a WW2 send back already sporterized. It was taken from a sniper from what my uncle told.

February 9, 2012, 07:38 AM	#73
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	gringo josh. unless that's a silver plated kentucky rifle that was intended as a gift for George Washington, I would say that has already been bubba'd to some extent. I don't know that too many had been made in stainless. plumbernater, that's an interesting mauser. I wasn't aware of any sporterized sniper rifles before vietnem. guess you learn something new every day. __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

February 9, 2012, 08:46 AM	#75
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,237	I have a no4 that was slightly sporterized and it was used by a family member in Vietnam. I was just a kid, but I remember the rifle coming back and its in photos. Much of the finish was worn off of the barrel and magazine, but otherwise is was in decent shape. I wanted to keep it the way it returned so, for years I made sure to keep some oil on the bare spots. I started to become concerned that the rifle will stay in the family but not receive the care to keep it from rusting after I pass it on....so I went ahead and blued it to help it last longer. I thought about it because it only has some family value but no real value. I thought it would be better off with some finish than none. __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!