S&W,Ruger "no safety" sales - Page 2

Homerboy · April 29, 2015, 07:07 PM

Glock has spent the last 30 years calling their product "Perfection". Adding a safety option, as S&W and Ruger has, would be against that theory. They're too arrogant to do it.

Look at the new Glock 43. For YEARS, people have wanted a single stack Glock. Only after the success of the Shield, the LC9, the CM9, etc, did Glock offer something comparable. Years too late, but Glock fans will still call it the Second Coming.

Fullclip610 · April 29, 2015, 09:27 PM

If glock had a safety on their guns I would own one. Seems like the little tab on the trigger isn't much of a safety. On the trigger isn't the best spot for a safety considering if something gets in the trigger guard it would most likely depress that tab as well.

dakota.potts · April 30, 2015, 12:20 AM

I can use a double action with no safety or a gun with a good 1911 style safety. I have to drill more with the single action with the safety to become comfortable with it, but I can.

What screws me up are the backwards safeties offered by companies like Beretta. I would recommend you stick with one direction of thumb safety if that's your thing.

I still prefer DA/SA with no safety, like my CZ

45_auto · April 30, 2015, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by homerboy

Glock has spent the last 30 years calling their product "Perfection". Adding a safety option, as S&W and Ruger has, would be against that theory. They're too arrogant to do it.

Or maybe the Glock haters are just too arrogant in their mistaken beliefs to do a little research. Could it possibly be that the purchasers of the best selling and most copied pistol in the last 40 years actually don't want a safety option?

Quote:

A thumb safety Glock pistol. Built as part of Austrian Government trials, who were uncomfortable with the notion of external-safetyless pistols. Ultimately, the Austrians chose a passive-only model and the rest is history.

Quote:

During the initial Austrian Army trials of 1982, the Army wasn’t used to the fact that a military weapon could be issued without an external safety. So the Army requested a trial pistol with one and sure enough, Glock produced one for them to examine. The conclusion was that it was not needed, but one of these pistols exists today in the National Firearms Center, Leeds, England.

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2...-safety-glock/

Quote:

Originally Posted by homerboy

Look at the new Glock 43. For YEARS, people have wanted a single stack Glock. Only after the success of the Shield, the LC9, the CM9, etc, did Glock offer something comparable. Years too late, but Glock fans will still call it the Second Coming.

Years too late for what? You believe that the market is saturated and no one will buy them except Glock collectors?

Shephard · April 30, 2015, 08:50 AM

I don't dislike Glocks because of the absence of a safety lever; I have other reasons. Concerning autos without safeties, I never wanted one until recently when I checked out the new Ruger LC9s pro. After purchasing, it became my favorite EDC. I simply determined to never remove it from the holster unless I needed to clean or fire it.

btmj · April 30, 2015, 09:45 AM

DA revolvers don't have manual safeties, and DAO pistols rarely have manual safeties. So it is not a huge stretch to accept a partially-cocked striker fired pistol with no manual safety. And the large numbers of Glock, XD, HK, Walther, and other pistols clearly show that many many shooters agree... and I understand that some of these are actually fully cocked, but that is a different discussion.

I love shooting my 1911, but it is a range gun, a target gun, a steel plate gun. For defense purposes I chose a gun with no safety (Glock, Walther PPS), or a DA/SA gun with the safety off (FNX), or a DA/SA decocker with no safety (SIG).

1911 fans often tell me that getting comfortable with a manual safety is a training issue. Fair enough. But learning to comfortably and safely live with a no-manual-safety pistol is also a training issue.

Like many things, it comes down to personal preference and what each of us is comfortable with. There is a right answer for me, and there is a different right answer for you, but there is no one right answer for everyone.

Jim

AZAK · April 30, 2015, 12:19 PM

I can fully understand not wanting different safety directions; up can be either off or on or down can be?

I personally sold off all of my pistols with up as fire a number of years ago just for this reason; not to mention that I do like my 1911s.

So, muscle memory seems to be important to some folks.

I propose that we bring out a "remote control/computer keyboard" safety. Think about how many of us are pushing the "enter" button on computers and remotes!

If safeties were just push the button simple. No direction... just push.

Then we could be discussing whether the "right hand pinkie" safety was superior to the "right hand thumb" safety! And the south paws would once again be left out in the cold!

...

I fully support a free market system and am happy that we still have choices regarding this topic!

As per the original question, NO safety for me for either S&W or Ruger model listed. But hey, that's just me...

Bongo Boy · April 30, 2015, 05:42 PM

I think the only reasonable way to answer the OP's question would be to survey dealers. But even doing so, I wouldn't expect the accuracy of the response to be very good at all--maybe +/- 20% unless it was a tiny dealer who actually knew details. In that case, the answer wouldn't be of much value either because it would likely not represent the market--assuming that's the objective.

Homerboy · April 30, 2015, 06:17 PM

Not a "Glock Hater", although I am used to being called one by Glock Fanboys. I've owned 2 of them, a 19 and a 26. Just seen too many people who equate the word "Glock" with "firearm" and buy one because the FBI and cops use them, so they must be the best. They are probably the worst choice for new gun owners. No safety, no hammer, and requiring a trigger pull to disassemble.

And I have yet to see ANYBODY show up to the range wearing a S&w t- shirt and hat, while carrying a S&w range bag. Glock seems to have cornered the market on Navy SEAL Mall Ninjas. And thank GOD for the Glock entrenching tool and Glock pistol bayonet too! How did our boys in WW II dig all those foxholes without the official Glock entrenching tool? Think about how many could have been saved at Bastogne if they had one!

As for the 43 being too late, just what is the advantage to it over a Shield or LC9-S? Fatter, bigger, less rounds, more expensive. And probably about to have issues like the 42 did when it came out.

Most copied in 40 years? How about most copied in 100? How many companies make 1911's?

**44 AMP** · May 1, 2015, 01:27 AM

If GLock had been around in WWII, they would have been on the other side, anyway. SO, no GLock entrenching tools for the boys at Bastogne, unless they captured them!

Skeets · May 1, 2015, 09:13 PM

Today I sold my new,unused Ruger lc9s Pro.7 weeks ago I bought it to"upgrade" my main EDC,a well proven lc9s.But for some reason I,even with G42 part of my pocket rotation,I could'nt do it.Thanks to all your replies to OP,I saw that I too wanted that manual safety.

April 30, 2015, 12:20 AM	#28
dakota.potts Senior Member Join Date: February 25, 2013 Location: Keystone Heights, Florida Posts: 3,084	I can use a double action with no safety or a gun with a good 1911 style safety. I have to drill more with the single action with the safety to become comfortable with it, but I can. What screws me up are the backwards safeties offered by companies like Beretta. I would recommend you stick with one direction of thumb safety if that's your thing. I still prefer DA/SA with no safety, like my CZ __________________ Certified Gunsmith (On Hiatus) Certified Armorer - H&K and Glock Among Others You can find my writings at my website, pottsprecision.com.

April 30, 2015, 09:45 AM	#31
btmj Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2011 Location: Near St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 864	DA revolvers don't have manual safeties, and DAO pistols rarely have manual safeties. So it is not a huge stretch to accept a partially-cocked striker fired pistol with no manual safety. And the large numbers of Glock, XD, HK, Walther, and other pistols clearly show that many many shooters agree... and I understand that some of these are actually fully cocked, but that is a different discussion. I love shooting my 1911, but it is a range gun, a target gun, a steel plate gun. For defense purposes I chose a gun with no safety (Glock, Walther PPS), or a DA/SA gun with the safety off (FNX), or a DA/SA decocker with no safety (SIG). 1911 fans often tell me that getting comfortable with a manual safety is a training issue. Fair enough. But learning to comfortably and safely live with a no-manual-safety pistol is also a training issue. Like many things, it comes down to personal preference and what each of us is comfortable with. There is a right answer for me, and there is a different right answer for you, but there is no one right answer for everyone. Jim Last edited by btmj; April 30, 2015 at 10:19 AM.

April 30, 2015, 12:19 PM	#32
AZAK Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2008 Location: the object towards which the action of the sea is directed Posts: 2,123	I can fully understand not wanting different safety directions; up can be either off or on or down can be? I personally sold off all of my pistols with up as fire a number of years ago just for this reason; not to mention that I do like my 1911s. So, muscle memory seems to be important to some folks. I propose that we bring out a "remote control/computer keyboard" safety. Think about how many of us are pushing the "enter" button on computers and remotes! If safeties were just push the button simple. No direction... just push. Then we could be discussing whether the "right hand pinkie" safety was superior to the "right hand thumb" safety! And the south paws would once again be left out in the cold! ... I fully support a free market system and am happy that we still have choices regarding this topic! As per the original question, NO safety for me for either S&W or Ruger model listed. But hey, that's just me... __________________ The lowest paid college major/degree in this country after graduation... Elementary Education. Now, go figure...

April 30, 2015, 05:42 PM	#33
Bongo Boy Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2008 Location: Colo Spgs CO Posts: 517	I think the only reasonable way to answer the OP's question would be to survey dealers. But even doing so, I wouldn't expect the accuracy of the response to be very good at all--maybe +/- 20% unless it was a tiny dealer who actually knew details. In that case, the answer wouldn't be of much value either because it would likely not represent the market--assuming that's the objective. __________________ NRA Benefactor Member “If I had to live my life again, I'd make the same mistakes, only sooner.” T Bankhead "I think only the authorities should have weapons." The New American Electorate

April 30, 2015, 06:17 PM	#34
Homerboy Junior member Join Date: June 16, 2004 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,320	Not a "Glock Hater", although I am used to being called one by Glock Fanboys. I've owned 2 of them, a 19 and a 26. Just seen too many people who equate the word "Glock" with "firearm" and buy one because the FBI and cops use them, so they must be the best. They are probably the worst choice for new gun owners. No safety, no hammer, and requiring a trigger pull to disassemble. And I have yet to see ANYBODY show up to the range wearing a S&w t- shirt and hat, while carrying a S&w range bag. Glock seems to have cornered the market on Navy SEAL Mall Ninjas. And thank GOD for the Glock entrenching tool and Glock pistol bayonet too! How did our boys in WW II dig all those foxholes without the official Glock entrenching tool? Think about how many could have been saved at Bastogne if they had one! As for the 43 being too late, just what is the advantage to it over a Shield or LC9-S? Fatter, bigger, less rounds, more expensive. And probably about to have issues like the 42 did when it came out. Most copied in 40 years? How about most copied in 100? How many companies make 1911's? Last edited by Homerboy; April 30, 2015 at 08:33 PM.

April 29, 2015, 07:07 PM	#26
Homerboy Junior member Join Date: June 16, 2004 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,320	Glock has spent the last 30 years calling their product "Perfection". Adding a safety option, as S&W and Ruger has, would be against that theory. They're too arrogant to do it. Look at the new Glock 43. For YEARS, people have wanted a single stack Glock. Only after the success of the Shield, the LC9, the CM9, etc, did Glock offer something comparable. Years too late, but Glock fans will still call it the Second Coming.

April 29, 2015, 09:27 PM	#27
Fullclip610 Senior Member Join Date: July 29, 2014 Posts: 119	If glock had a safety on their guns I would own one. Seems like the little tab on the trigger isn't much of a safety. On the trigger isn't the best spot for a safety considering if something gets in the trigger guard it would most likely depress that tab as well.

April 30, 2015, 08:50 AM	#30
Shephard Junior Member Join Date: April 29, 2015 Posts: 3	I don't dislike Glocks because of the absence of a safety lever; I have other reasons. Concerning autos without safeties, I never wanted one until recently when I checked out the new Ruger LC9s pro. After purchasing, it became my favorite EDC. I simply determined to never remove it from the holster unless I needed to clean or fire it.

May 1, 2015, 01:27 AM	#35
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,846	If GLock had been around in WWII, they would have been on the other side, anyway. SO, no GLock entrenching tools for the boys at Bastogne, unless they captured them! __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

May 1, 2015, 09:13 PM	#36
Skeets Member in memoriam Join Date: April 6, 2015 Location: Indiana Posts: 583	Sold Ruger Pro Today I sold my new,unused Ruger lc9s Pro.7 weeks ago I bought it to"upgrade" my main EDC,a well proven lc9s.But for some reason I,even with G42 part of my pocket rotation,I could'nt do it.Thanks to all your replies to OP,I saw that I too wanted that manual safety. __________________ Skeets "Over Kill Never Fails"