AR sub MOA upper/barrel search

[smax]

Hand guard: That hand rail will do you very well. If you're going optic-only though (no front sight) I'd suggest saving a few bucks on the V1 rail.

What length are you going to get? If you want to get a rail that covers the gas block, you'll need to buy a low profile gas block (I have a steel DPMS 0.936" low profile block on my rifle and it works well).


Barrel: Between the two for your purposes I'd 100% go with the SDM barrel. It's lighter weight, it's threaded, and by every account I've seen it's an amazing barrel (though I haven't heard a single bad thing about WOA in general).

The varmint barrels are great, but an extra pound or so on the barrel really affects the balance of a gun. I bought my unfluted 24" varmint barrel knowing full well that it'd weight a ton, but I probably won't ever shoot the thing without a bench so it works for me (I like the look of a comically long barrel anyway).

Also, if you see an option to add something to your cart on WOA's website, it means they keep the part in stock (they're already made). Expect to wait if they have to turn a new varmint barrel for you, flute it, and thread it. I was originally quoted 4 weeks on mine (though they got ahead of schedule and had it out within a week or so).

On top of that, there's the bang-for-your-buck factor. A varmint barrel plus fluting plus threading will cost a bit more than the SDM.


Upper receiver: You can find them cheaper. I picked up my assembled Aero upper for $75 shipped. Just shop around a bit - Anderson has some very affordable ones as well, but you may want to look elsewhere if you're afraid of people judging you for buying an affordable upper.


Bipod mount: I think that style mount is for the EMR V0 rail, though I might be wrong there. I don't see how that will mount solidly to an M-LOK slot at all.

I picked up one of these: https://www.magpul.com/products/m-lo...A2-bipod-mount
Interestingly enough, I believe ALG manufactures Magpul's aluminum parts (at least I think I heard that somewhere). It's well-made and mounts to the rail solidly.

[LandToSea]

Thanks again Smax! John replied from WOA with the below after I inquired about the SPR. I believe that a SPR is based on a SDM per the description but I am unsure as to the differences besides lengths?
John; "If shooting 6-700 yards, you will want at least a 20” barrel and something heavier than the SPR barrel."

As far as the rail goes, it is only $20 at the 15" length I plan to order to get the versatility to add BUIS so mind as well.

I would grab a PSA upper but is will cost more than the complete WOA. I will look around but I may just have WOA assemble everything minus the handguard. The Anderson upper is only $10 less than WOA.
http://www.andersonrifles.com/produc...kit-installed/

[smax]

This is what I got, though it was $75 at the time:
http://www.graniteridgeoutfitters.co...AP501603-A.htm

Shop around, you can find assembled uppers in the ~$70 range. Protip: don't shop on the manufacturer's websites since you won't see a price below MSRP unless they have some sort of sale going on.

[LandToSea]

Looks good, thanks again as you have helped streamline this process for me! WOA will not thread the varmint barrels so the SDM was the option. They said it is a varmint barrel base but tapered at the muzzle end and is very close in capability. If shooting high volume it performs better due to the 12 groove fluting. I guess I need to buy a roll pin set now...

I ordered:
Hand rail
http://algdefense.com/ergonomic-modu...-v2-m-lok.html

Receiver
http://www.graniteridgeoutfitters.co...AP501603-A.htm

Barrel
https://www.whiteoakarmament.com/xca...roductid=17565

[smax]

You snagged a gas block, gas tube, and roll pin, right?

For the gas tube pin, you should be able to get by with a fine pair of needle nosed pliers and a thin steel punch.

[HJ857]

Also make sure the diameter of the gas block will fit under the handguard. You'll also need a muzzle device of your choosing, either a flash hider or a brake. For distance shooting a brake is really nice to have.

[LandToSea]

Yes, I got the SS low profile gas block which WOA said they will test fit before shipping. They include the pin. I have a Specwar suppressor and proprietary Trifecta flash hider it screws onto

I will just order the below after researching a bunch it seems like the best bang for the $. I was surprised that I could not find a well reviewed set including roll pin starters and punches for the AR specifically. It looks like a void in the market. If you want both you have to buy a pricey full bore Armorer's kit or do what I did and buy two sets that include punches you do not need. It seems that the smaller diameter punch heads are made too long to stand up to the task. Someone needs to design some that are just long enough for their intended pins since them being easily bent is going to be unavoidable at longer lengths? I bet an affordable set including the required sizes of both starter and punch pins would sell well if these things were kept in mind.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...=ATVPDKIKX0DER

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...A2JQK68BBEBNQ0

[LandToSea]

As FYI the below is from my email to WOA;

Me:
"Thanks for the reply John. I am thinking a Varmint 20" then. How do you feel about fluting effecting barrel flex and accuracy? In testing your varmint barrels specifically do you see a difference either direction once fluted? Which fluting would you suggest, 7 or 12 groove? Lastly, can you thread the muzzle so that I can apply my brake that my can connects to?"

John @ WOA:
"We will not thread our varmint barrels. Fluting will not effect accuracy nearly as much as hanging a bunch of stuff on the end of the barrel will."

[Jayhawkhuntclub]

In my experience, it's harder to get an AR that doesn't shoot sub-MOA than not. That assumes you are using good ammo and a scope. Yeah, if you're shooting Lake City or Tula, you're probably not going to get sub-moa. But with good ammo, it's usually no problem. On average, the ARs I've owned have been more accurate than the bolt rifles, sans my new 300 BO build. But she's a work in progress.

[LandToSea]

Sub MOA was more so an adjective describing the build than a goal of it if that makes sense. The main goal is 600yds effective with as small of groups as one could reasonably expect from an AR at that range.

[LandToSea]

The ALG handguard came in and I have to give them props. This is a very nicely built piece for the $. It is even nicer than online pics can convey.

[smax]

Yep, I can't get over how good the ALG handguards are. Ridiculously light, tight fitting, good looking, cheap.

Installation is super easy as well. Be sure to read the installation instructions carefully before you install it.

You have an upper vice block or a reaction rod to install the barrel nut, right?

[LandToSea]

I went with this style of vice block
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NO-M-A-R-Bla...item1c50a85480

Install looks fairly easy?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0crIvK8fu-A

[LandToSea]

Lightweight adjustable stock suggestions?

[noonesshowmonkey]

Adjustable stocks come in all kinds of flavors.

The Magpul STR and ACS are good in general. The BCM Gunfighter stock, which I have on my rifle, is light and tough. For 600m target shooting, consider a fixed stock, or the Magpul UBR. The UBR isn't light--or rather, as light as a standard M4 stock--, nor is it cheap, but I'd call it a go-to for serious long range shooting.

[LandToSea]

I have been looking at the Magpul UBR (most versatile with collapable function but no cheek weld adjustment and expensive), Magpul PRS (Best LR setup and middle cost of the 3) and the Luth-AR (cheapest and appears to be a compromise in design)

[LandToSea]

Hmm?
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/886...ProductFinding

This is an option but no LOP adjustment
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/794...ynthetic-black

[LandToSea]

I ordered the Mako above to try since while I want this to be a LR rifle I want it to be reasonably portable and not a bench rifle. I have decided to split the builds and convert all of the old parts back to the stock rifle and use all of the mods for a new solo build. All I really need at this point is a buffer tube assembly and lower receiver with safety switch and trigger guard

[waveslayer]

Originally Posted by LandToSea

I have a PSA M4 16" that I have added Leupold glass sitting on LaRue QD, SSA trigger, grips and rails... I like distance shooting and my perspective is if SHTF you can only carry one rifle and a couple handguns if on foot with ammo etc. Therefore I like a well rounded rifle. I know not everyone agrees, but this is what I want. When I got the AR $ was tight so I bought a base I should not have considering my preferences. I could sell it after stripping the mods and then get a new platform but I figure why not just get a second upper which supports my perspective. Carry complete shorter barrel carbine and backup long range upper in a pack. I am shooting 1.5-2" MOA on this setup with a can on it.

I am not sure that I want to learn how to and take the risk of the unknown compatibility of parts to build an upper. I am looking for suggestions on some of the better floated heavy barrel uppers out there for under $800 without a BCG or charging handle. I think I want a 18-20" barrel as anything more on an AR seems to be moot and unnecessary weight for my goals of up to 700yds? Thanks in advance for any insight!

buy a Rock river Arms! tack drivers and out perform almost all other AR's. 700 yards no issue with my R3 with 77 gr. smk

[noonesshowmonkey]

I had somehow missed the point of the rifle. Ignoring the SHTF portion of it, you can accomplish the Do-It-All AR15 with the recce style build. A 16" precision stainless steel barrel, with a decent optic, and an excellent trigger, combined with a good shooter, can reliably ring steel plates out to 500 or 600m. All of this in a lightweight, portable platform. When someone starts talking about a swiss army knife of a rifle, the recce is the pattern what I suggest.

Also, Tirod's suggestions about a standard enlistment tour in the infantry is about the best advice for learning how to operate in the field realistically in any scenario, much less something as far out as SHTF. How's your land navigation skills these days? Can you ruck march well? More important questions for SHTF than what kind of rifle you are carrying...

It is easy to over think the AR platform. If you are doing high power, get a 20-24" varmint/match barrel on a fixed stock and a free float tube. If you want an SPR/DMR, get an 18-20" stainless barrel, mount an UBR, add a rail for PEQ15s, lights, etc. If you want a rifle you could conceivably take into structures, or have to run & gun with, make a 16" recce with a 13" free floated rail on it to mount fighting gear to. If you need something discrete for a protection detail or a dedicated CQB fighter, consider an 11.5 inch SBR (and consider .300 blackout) with whatever foreward mounted kit you expect it to need, while remaining small & handy. All of these can benefit from a Geiselle G2S / SSA / SSA-E trigger.

The main difference here is that a High Power match type rifle doesn't need to have the ruggedized parts of an SPR/recce. It doesn't need the forward mounting points for a white light, or an IR marking device. The barrel need not be threaded for a can (which is why WOA doesn't thread their varmint barrels: if you that kind of purpose built barrel, you don't care about a compensator or suppressor as much...); that stuff just interrupts the pinpoint accuracy that the barrel is designed for. A match barrel doesn't necessarily need to be slinged. A field rifle needs a sling. Etc.

If you really are trying for a field quality rifle that can shoot out to 600m or so, do some research into the recce style concept. Noveske & BCM both produce turn key rifles of these types. Take a look at their setups.

[LandToSea]

Thanks noonesshowmonkey, I guess you missed some of my comments, but no worries. Anyway, this is the end result. Thank you all for the help and suggestions! I an going with two setups, this LR and simplifying the 16" PSA for CQC. I think I am going to a Mark 6 3-18x44mm instead of the 3-9x since I get Leupold at wholesale. If anyone is interested in the current Vari-X 3-9x on LaRue QD mount hit me up.

Before: "All in one"


After: LR setup, CQC still needs lower built but I have 75% of the parts

[Erno86]

A Krieger barrel, has a longer barrel life than most AR barrels out there.

[Rick A Redmon]

osts: 1

I need help I just built my first m4 style ar

I just recently built my first ar. I used a core 15 complete upper and Anderson stripped lower with a cmmg lower parts kit. I used a complete magpul dark earth furniture set on it. The first time I took it out I sent about 350 rounds down range using some Remington greenbox .223 the next time I went out to shoot I had some fn 5.56 60gr fmj and some pci but when I tried using these the bolt would not close all the way and you couldn't close it with the forward assist either so I ended up having to mortar clear multiple rounds so I switch back to the Remington shells I had left and had no problems it would shoot just like it's suppose to. This is the only complaint I can make about this ar it shoots tight groups slightly over 1moa at 100. Any information would be greatly appreciated, also if if I'm not in the right forum my apologies this is my first posting.

-CENSORED--CENSORED--CENSORED-
qq

[LandToSea]

Since I never stated it above I went with the WOA SDM 20" barrel.

[smax]

Looks great, I'm glad it all came together well!