40 S & W Reloading!! - Page 2

tenn_man75 · August 18, 2005, 12:49 PM

10 grains of blue dot is to hot in my S & W. It made the shots nose dive. So I gotta back off the powder. Going to do what everyone is telling me to. Going to start out low and work my way up slowly.

joshua · August 18, 2005, 06:33 PM

Ten Man, wise decision! I've loaded plenty of 40s because I shoot it in USPSA/IPSC type competition. Never had a problem with it compared to some case head separations I've actually seen that is suppose to be common with handloaded 40S&W rounds utilizing heavy bullets and fast burning powders. Mostly glocks - no flaming intended. I did have some high pressure signs once with Tite Group when I used 200 grain Lead truncated cone style bullets and unknown times fired mix brass. I had primers popping out and most that stayed were showing signs of over pressure. That was during the hottest time of summer in Utah. I did get jams due to the primers falling into the magazine. If you are looking to hot rod the 40 you may as well go to 10mm. 180 @ 1200 fps are warm loads in the 10mm.

UnSafe · August 20, 2005, 04:14 PM

FWIW, I tried the Nosler 135gr JHPs over Longshot, starting at 10.2gr and loaded up to 12.0gr, fired in a G23 and Kel Tec P-40. I stopped ar 11.2gr because of pressure signs. Hit velocities over 1400fps in both pistols. Accurate, but tough to come back on target quickly.

I've read of folks working up 800X loads in .40S&W for fast loads with lower pressures. Not sure if it's worth the effort to run the .40 that fast, but loadwork is a hobby, after all

tenn_man75 · August 20, 2005, 09:29 PM

Well I loaded up some this weekend. I took your advice J.D.B I went out and bought a LEE Crimper Die for that .40 I couldn't get the crimper that comes with the 3 die set to crimp enough. It would buckle the brass and leave ridges in it. I didn't like that so I canned those loads and bought the crimper and it works great. I done the test with the bullets moving or not and got them crimped enough that they didn't move. See I wouldn't have know that if it hadn't been for yall. I loaded at 7.5, 7.7, 8.0, and going to try some at 10.0 because the hodgdon Long Shot Data says to start at 10.5 So I am testing now and see what happens. I shot some at 7.5 and they was a little off at 10 yds never hit the paper at 20yds. So I think 7.5 isn't going to work. Haven't been able to shoot the others yet. Going to do that Tomorrow. Well I will let yall know what happens.

tenn_man75 · September 3, 2005, 12:55 PM

Hey, Well here is my test shots at about 25 yds best I can calculate. I know it might be me a little but you tell me what you think. I got them marked 10, 7.7, 7.5, and 8.0 for the grains I used. I tried to get as steady as possible. I was shooting at middle target. The F means Factory Loads. Maybe you can see them all good. They all shot about the same to me. All over the place.. LOL. I had more loaded at 10 grains so thats why there are more of them. I only had a few of each of the others. The powder I used was Hodgdon Longshot.

Tim R · September 3, 2005, 03:00 PM

If you are bending brass trying crimp, you are crimping WAY too much. Auto loader rounds are not like wheel gun rounds where you expect to see a nice roll crimp. For the auto loader you take the bell out enough for the round to camber.....the crimp is not, I repeat is not meant to hold the round in place. The taper crimp is meant to allow the mouth of the case to head space. What holds the bullet in place is case tension....wore out brass won't hold a bullet and increasing crimp one these rounds will only make things worse.

I have read the 135's shoot the best but I load 165's. I have loaded 155's in the past and they are good bullets. I have used Unique, Bullseye, Bluedot and Power Pistol. I like Power Pistol the best. Blue Dot by the way is my favorite 357 Mag. powder.

Powderman · September 3, 2005, 04:56 PM

Hm. Looks like you are doing the following things that are preventing you from hitting where you aim:

1) Using not enough trigger finger. (Assuming you're right handed, if you are left handed, you're using too much.) This causes you to push (or pull) your shots to the side.

2) Anticipating recoil/pushing off. Looks like you are pushing the gun forward a split second before the shot breaks. This causes the gun to nosedive, and places the shot low.

Concentrate on your front sight, and sight alignment. Put that front sight blade dead center of your target, and pull that trigger straight back. Make it a steady pull--and here's the trick: Do it so that your sight picture is not disturbed. You should be concentrating on that sight until the shot breaks.

You'll know when you do it right--you'll actually see the muzzle flash.

Offered in the spirit of advice. Good luck!

BeMan · September 3, 2005, 07:04 PM

I have had my best luck using 8.2 gr Blue Dot with a 170 gr bullet. Good accuracy! I didn't have any 165 gr bullets to try, but doubt they would differ greatly. I have had zero luck with accuracy on the lighter bullets and Blue Dot. I prefer 180 gr bullets over 9.8 gr AA#9. Good luck.

BeMan

tenn_man75 · September 3, 2005, 08:38 PM

So its more of my shooting technique now than the powder load. The 10.0 looks to be a good load then. I just need to practice more on my shooting then and leave the loads where they are at. Get to shooting better and then see where I am grouping. Thanks for the advice Powderman. I will try it next time. This is my first hand gun to own. So I gotta practice a lot I see...

CHM · September 4, 2005, 05:03 AM

I've recently loaded 200 Gr Rainier plated bullets with around 6 gr 800X, and have been very pleased. In my experience, the 40 is easy to load except for the OAL tolerances. I don't have a Glock, so no worries.

WESHOOT2 · September 5, 2005, 09:11 AM

Uh-oh, wife just called for breakfast, so I'll just say that the one-powder choice in 40 is without question Power Pistol.
Bye (food!)

caz223 · September 15, 2005, 03:40 PM

1. power pistol (For hot loads.)
2. WSF (med. power loads.)
3. Unique (lead loads.)
Data is really hard to find for some bullet weights in .40, esp. lower volume powders like wsf. Not a fan of longshot. The data seems optimistic.
Haven't tried titegroup in .40, it would seem to be in the right area in the burn rate chart.

WESHOOT2 · September 17, 2005, 04:55 PM

Getting ready to load some 40 Minor: 180g TCJ-FP Rainier, CCI550, 3.8g W231, OAL 1.130", W-W once-fired brass.

So I can go shootin' tomorrow (Witness, L-10).

Ben Shepherd · September 19, 2005, 10:43 PM

WESHOOT2, your thoughts on AA5 vs. power pistol in 40? AA5 has been working well for me(In ruger p-series pistols mostly). Meters well, burns clean.

Just wanting some free hints 'ya know.

kgpcr · September 20, 2005, 01:10 AM

Power pistol for heavy bullets and for my 155grn poppers i use Titegroup

boogalou1 · September 23, 2005, 10:33 AM

I've been experimenting with AA5, Universal Clays, & Unique on my 165 plated & 175 lead loads using a CZ40. So far, I've been pretty happy with AA5.

WESHOOT2 · September 25, 2005, 10:05 AM

I suggest that Power Pistol is more accurate more often more easily developed.

There, howdoya like THAT sentence?

Ben Shepherd · September 27, 2005, 09:12 PM

WS2, hows about: Power pistol is more accurate, more often, and loads are more easily devloped for it than AA5.

That work?

WESHOOT2 · October 1, 2005, 09:24 AM

Yep.

That said, them W231 / 180g Rainier loads are accurate, as in accurate.

August 20, 2005, 09:29 PM	#29
tenn_man75 Member Join Date: August 15, 2005 Location: Tennessee Posts: 18	Loading Test. Well I loaded up some this weekend. I took your advice J.D.B I went out and bought a LEE Crimper Die for that .40 I couldn't get the crimper that comes with the 3 die set to crimp enough. It would buckle the brass and leave ridges in it. I didn't like that so I canned those loads and bought the crimper and it works great. I done the test with the bullets moving or not and got them crimped enough that they didn't move. See I wouldn't have know that if it hadn't been for yall. I loaded at 7.5, 7.7, 8.0, and going to try some at 10.0 because the hodgdon Long Shot Data says to start at 10.5 So I am testing now and see what happens. I shot some at 7.5 and they was a little off at 10 yds never hit the paper at 20yds. So I think 7.5 isn't going to work. Haven't been able to shoot the others yet. Going to do that Tomorrow. Well I will let yall know what happens. __________________ Own: Remington 700 270 Remington 1100 12 gauge Thompson Black Diamond .50 Smoke Poll 410 Bolt Action Single Shot S & W .40 Pistol

September 3, 2005, 03:00 PM	#31
Tim R Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2004 Location: God's side of Washington State Posts: 1,601	If you are bending brass trying crimp, you are crimping WAY too much. Auto loader rounds are not like wheel gun rounds where you expect to see a nice roll crimp. For the auto loader you take the bell out enough for the round to camber.....the crimp is not, I repeat is not meant to hold the round in place. The taper crimp is meant to allow the mouth of the case to head space. What holds the bullet in place is case tension....wore out brass won't hold a bullet and increasing crimp one these rounds will only make things worse. I have read the 135's shoot the best but I load 165's. I have loaded 155's in the past and they are good bullets. I have used Unique, Bullseye, Bluedot and Power Pistol. I like Power Pistol the best. Blue Dot by the way is my favorite 357 Mag. powder. __________________ God Bless our Troops especially our Snipers.

September 3, 2005, 04:56 PM	#32
Powderman Senior Member Join Date: September 7, 2001 Location: Washington State Posts: 2,166	Hm. Looks like you are doing the following things that are preventing you from hitting where you aim: 1) Using not enough trigger finger. (Assuming you're right handed, if you are left handed, you're using too much.) This causes you to push (or pull) your shots to the side. 2) Anticipating recoil/pushing off. Looks like you are pushing the gun forward a split second before the shot breaks. This causes the gun to nosedive, and places the shot low. Concentrate on your front sight, and sight alignment. Put that front sight blade dead center of your target, and pull that trigger straight back. Make it a steady pull--and here's the trick: Do it so that your sight picture is not disturbed. You should be concentrating on that sight until the shot breaks. You'll know when you do it right--you'll actually see the muzzle flash. Offered in the spirit of advice. Good luck! __________________ Hiding in plain sight...

September 3, 2005, 07:04 PM	#33
BeMan Member Join Date: June 30, 2005 Posts: 18	Blue Dot/light bullets I have had my best luck using 8.2 gr Blue Dot with a 170 gr bullet. Good accuracy! I didn't have any 165 gr bullets to try, but doubt they would differ greatly. I have had zero luck with accuracy on the lighter bullets and Blue Dot. I prefer 180 gr bullets over 9.8 gr AA#9. Good luck. BeMan

September 3, 2005, 08:38 PM	#34
tenn_man75 Member Join Date: August 15, 2005 Location: Tennessee Posts: 18	So its more of my shooting technique now than the powder load. The 10.0 looks to be a good load then. I just need to practice more on my shooting then and leave the loads where they are at. Get to shooting better and then see where I am grouping. Thanks for the advice Powderman. I will try it next time. This is my first hand gun to own. So I gotta practice a lot I see... __________________ Own: Remington 700 270 Remington 1100 12 gauge Thompson Black Diamond .50 Smoke Poll 410 Bolt Action Single Shot S & W .40 Pistol

August 18, 2005, 12:49 PM	#26
tenn_man75 Member Join Date: August 15, 2005 Location: Tennessee Posts: 18	10 grains of blue dot is to hot in my S & W. It made the shots nose dive. So I gotta back off the powder. Going to do what everyone is telling me to. Going to start out low and work my way up slowly.

August 18, 2005, 06:33 PM	#27
joshua Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2004 Location: norCal Posts: 2,161	Ten Man, wise decision! I've loaded plenty of 40s because I shoot it in USPSA/IPSC type competition. Never had a problem with it compared to some case head separations I've actually seen that is suppose to be common with handloaded 40S&W rounds utilizing heavy bullets and fast burning powders. Mostly glocks - no flaming intended. I did have some high pressure signs once with Tite Group when I used 200 grain Lead truncated cone style bullets and unknown times fired mix brass. I had primers popping out and most that stayed were showing signs of over pressure. That was during the hottest time of summer in Utah. I did get jams due to the primers falling into the magazine. If you are looking to hot rod the 40 you may as well go to 10mm. 180 @ 1200 fps are warm loads in the 10mm.

August 20, 2005, 04:14 PM	#28
UnSafe Junior Member Join Date: May 24, 2004 Location: Chickasha, OK Posts: 3	FWIW, I tried the Nosler 135gr JHPs over Longshot, starting at 10.2gr and loaded up to 12.0gr, fired in a G23 and Kel Tec P-40. I stopped ar 11.2gr because of pressure signs. Hit velocities over 1400fps in both pistols. Accurate, but tough to come back on target quickly. I've read of folks working up 800X loads in .40S&W for fast loads with lower pressures. Not sure if it's worth the effort to run the .40 that fast, but loadwork is a hobby, after all

September 4, 2005, 05:03 AM	#35
CHM Member Join Date: June 13, 2005 Posts: 20	I've recently loaded 200 Gr Rainier plated bullets with around 6 gr 800X, and have been very pleased. In my experience, the 40 is easy to load except for the OAL tolerances. I don't have a Glock, so no worries.

September 5, 2005, 09:11 AM	#36
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	40 thoughts Uh-oh, wife just called for breakfast, so I'll just say that the one-powder choice in 40 is without question Power Pistol. Bye (food!) __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

September 15, 2005, 03:40 PM	#37
caz223 Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,429	1. power pistol (For hot loads.) 2. WSF (med. power loads.) 3. Unique (lead loads.) Data is really hard to find for some bullet weights in .40, esp. lower volume powders like wsf. Not a fan of longshot. The data seems optimistic. Haven't tried titegroup in .40, it would seem to be in the right area in the burn rate chart. __________________ I'm not just a gun. I'm YOUR gun. (Hold me.)

September 17, 2005, 04:55 PM	#38
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	Getting ready to load some 40 Minor: 180g TCJ-FP Rainier, CCI550, 3.8g W231, OAL 1.130", W-W once-fired brass. So I can go shootin' tomorrow (Witness, L-10). __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

September 19, 2005, 10:43 PM	#39
Ben Shepherd Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2001 Location: Utah Posts: 1,462	WESHOOT2, your thoughts on AA5 vs. power pistol in 40? AA5 has been working well for me(In ruger p-series pistols mostly). Meters well, burns clean. Just wanting some free hints 'ya know. __________________ From my cold dead hands......... NRA certified rifle, pistol and shotgun instructor. Hunter education instructor

September 20, 2005, 01:10 AM	#40
kgpcr Senior Member Join Date: May 23, 2005 Posts: 955	Power pistol for heavy bullets and for my 155grn poppers i use Titegroup __________________ Colt King Cobra .357 Colt Anaconda .44mag Springfield Armory .45 Double stack Loaded XD40 service XD45 Taurus 617 .357mag Smith M&P 40

September 23, 2005, 10:33 AM	#41
boogalou1 Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2001 Location: Michigan Posts: 138	I've been experimenting with AA5, Universal Clays, & Unique on my 165 plated & 175 lead loads using a CZ40. So far, I've been pretty happy with AA5.

September 25, 2005, 10:05 AM	#42
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	uh-oh I suggest that Power Pistol is more accurate more often more easily developed. There, howdoya like THAT sentence? __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

September 27, 2005, 09:12 PM	#43
Ben Shepherd Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2001 Location: Utah Posts: 1,462	WS2, hows about: Power pistol is more accurate, more often, and loads are more easily devloped for it than AA5. That work? __________________ From my cold dead hands......... NRA certified rifle, pistol and shotgun instructor. Hunter education instructor

October 1, 2005, 09:24 AM	#44
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	whoo-eee! Yep. That said, them W231 / 180g Rainier loads are accurate, as in accurate. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"