cant decide

JC5503 · December 12, 2010, 02:06 PM

Hey all,

Im new to BP revolvers but wanted to get into them for plinking and maybe hunting, So I found some on sale at Cabelas but I dont know enough about them to know if its a good buy or if it would be just junk

. So if anyone can tell me about the 1851 Confederate Navy .44 caliber Sheriff revolver I would appreciate.

Doc Hoy · December 12, 2010, 03:08 PM

There is no way to recommend one pistol over another but the Sheriffs model is a nice pistol.

I can't remember the sale that is on right now but I can tell you that Colt clones can be a tiny bit more finnicky that Remington clones. A good way to start would be the 8 inch barrel 1858 Remington in steel. It is on sale almost non-stop for 199.99.

I had a Sheriff's model in .36 and it shot fine. The first four shots I put through it went inside of four inches at 25 yards. You may find that it shoots significantly above point of aim. This is disconcerting and takes a little getting used to.

The Remington should pretty much shoot POA.

If you have not already done so, go read the postit at the top entitled, "So you talked your wife into letting you buy a cap and ball revolver." or words to that effect. It is a storehouse of info.

Note that I recommended the Remington over the Colt but there is no real reason for you to change your mind if you have your heart set on the Colt. I like Colts better'n Remingtons but cleaning, field stripping and such are easier with a Remington.

I alway like to leave the post like this because now, fifty people will respond with arguments why Colts are better or Remingtons are better. It is truly fun to watch.

mykeal · December 12, 2010, 03:20 PM

Remington. They're stronger.

No. Colt. They're prettier.

No. Remington. They're stronger.

No. Colt. They're prettier.

No. Remington. They're stronger.

No. Colt. They're prettier.

Ford.

No. Chevy.

Ooops. Wrong thread.

etc.

etc.

Hawg · December 12, 2010, 03:30 PM

The so called Confederate Navy has a brass frame and wont hold up to heavy loads. You'd be better off with a steel frame. IMHO the Remington is more beginner friendly but the Colt isn't that hard to learn.

Chevy
no, Ford
Wait, Chevy
Ummm Ford
oh jeez

zippy13 · December 12, 2010, 03:43 PM

IMHO, for a first BP cap-n-ball revolver, start with a Remington-style reproduction. They don't have a barrel key which is one less thing for a newbie to worry about. Terms like Confederate and Sheriff are often used for modern versions of the old designs. In some cases a Confederate model is a .44-cal version of a revolver that was originally a .36-cal. Sheriff usually means a shortened barrel version.

So, you take a Colt's 1851 brass-framed replica, bump it up from .36-cal to .44-cal, clip the barrel and call it a Confederate Sheriff's model. I suspect the demand the this version wasn't what Cabelas expected and that's why we're seeing it at a bargain basement price.

Unless the Confederate Sheriff model really appeals to your sense of style (not just your wallet), I think you'd be happier with one of Cabelas discounted steel-framed Remingtons. As Doc Hoy noted, they are frequently on sale for $199.99.

Hellgate · December 12, 2010, 07:45 PM

The Remingtons will eat any load you can cram into it as long as you use BP or a BP substitute. They'll take conical 200gr bullets too.

Fingers McGee · December 12, 2010, 07:49 PM

Even though I am a died in the wool Colt's style revolver afficionado. I tend to agree with Doc and the others that advocate a Remington style revolver as one's first foray into the BP C&B experience and obsession. Once you become fully immersed into the smoke lord lifestyle, and get a few thousand rounds under your belt, you can graduate to the more complex and beautifully styled Colt's.

Oh, and, by the way..............................

Mary Ann

Hawg · December 12, 2010, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Mary Ann

Ginger

Fingers McGee · December 12, 2010, 07:52 PM

Mary Ann

Mary Ann

Mary Ann

Mary Ann

Hawg · December 12, 2010, 08:31 PM

OK I'll take Mary Ann, you can have Mrs. Howell.

Hardcase · December 12, 2010, 09:19 PM

Dodge.

bedbugbilly · December 12, 2010, 10:17 PM

You mean they make revolvers with brass frames?

And by the way . . I'd gladly take Mary Ann AND Ginger . . . you can keep Mrs. Howell . . . . . .

napp · December 12, 2010, 10:26 PM

I couldn't decide between the Colt and the Remington; so I ordered one of each.

Now, I can't decide between Mary Ann and Ginger....hmmmm.

Razor740 · December 13, 2010, 02:08 AM

Quote:

I couldn't decide between the Colt and the Remington; so I ordered one of each.

I like your problem solving technique.

Smokin_Gun · December 13, 2010, 03:05 AM

Not a problem helpin' you out with your decision ... Remington would be the Rev to choose.
and Mopar for your muscle Car/Truck :O)
This 1861 Remington Old Army is still makin' Smoke and thowin' lead since 1862 ... So one a them 1858 NMA .44's from Cabelas should last you long enough, and remember you'll be buyin' more soon

madcratebuilder · December 13, 2010, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Hawg

OK I'll take Mary Ann, you can have Mrs. Howell.

At my age Mrs Howell well do.

Howard31 · December 13, 2010, 04:46 PM

I got an Army,a Remmie and a Navy.When you can't decide you get em all.Shoot the hell out of them and somewhere in the smoke of thousands of rounds the answers will appear. I don't care for 36 cal. I took the Navy and used my 44 cylander and Barrel and gave it a good try.For me the small grip is a problem.For some one else it could be a plus.
Now its 44 Army vs 44 Remington, Pietta vs Uberti, and Triple 7 vs Pyrodex P. I am still no closer to which one I like best. There are plus's and minus's to each.
I never could make up my mind between Mary Ann or Ginger and today Mrs Howell ain't looking bad either.
Guns are a personal choice,what I like I am sure somebody some where really hates. It 's Ford or Chevy,Vanilla or chocolate.
Take your time,go look at the guns ,get what you want and go shoot the thing .If you don't like it sell and get something else.

JC5503 · December 19, 2010, 10:31 PM

http://images.cabelas.com/is/image/c...sDtqwHrf9XNA3j
So after alot of debate that is what I ended up buying and cant wait till it gets to my house lol im pumped to try it out

Hellgate · December 19, 2010, 11:28 PM

JC5503,
I have one of those. I shoot 20grs FFFg Goex+lube wad+.454 ball. I would not exceed 25grs powder on a regular basis since the brass frame is softer than steel and it could shoot loose with heavy loads. The Colt Navy style guns are round ball only. You cannot get a conical under the rammer. No big deal since the ball is just as much fun, easy to load, a cinch to cast and easier on the gun.

starbuck125 · December 19, 2010, 11:30 PM

when in doubt....buy both

JC5503 · December 20, 2010, 08:46 AM

Hellgate,

I am new to BP revolvers and am curious if the load you described above is potent enough for whitetail hunting

. Also can you load conical's if you remove the cylinder? and why are the balls easier on the gun compared to the conical?

Fiv3 · December 20, 2010, 04:35 PM

Congrats on your revolver

The Colts are beautiful. I started with an 1858 earlier this year, fell into ownership of a lil brass framed baby Dragoon, and would like to get an 1860 sooner than later.

I believe I detect the rattle of lead balls in one of the packages under the tree with my name on it. I'm also thinking there might be a 5lb brick under there which means my wife is giving me the go-ahead to start casting

So, I guess to make it a worth while investment on her part, I should in turn invest in more .44 revolvers

Hellgate · December 21, 2010, 01:28 AM

JC5503,
I would not take that gun whitetail hunting unless you can stick the muzzle in the buck's ear and pull the trigger. It could kill a deer but you may have to track it for a long time. You are probably going to have ballistics somewhere less than a 38 special. A .357 magnum is considered minimal for handgun whitetail hunting. Some states set minimum muzzle energy requirements and that gun won't do it. Even if you loaded it up to 30grs powder the short sight radius would not let you get a good aim unless real close and a few 30 grain loads might shoot the gun loose by pulling the arbor out of the frame. The 200gr conicals can be loaded off the gun but they generate more pressure and drag as they go down the barrel which can pull the arbor loose over time. A Remington fully stoked or a Dragoon or Walker would be a better choice. The Walker has a 9" barrel, holds about 55grs powder under the ball and shoots like a rifle (I have TWO!). I know there are people out there who have killed deer with less and may have shot all kinds of heavy loads from their brass framed Colt but, geeze, I have enough trouble getting one with a scoped '06 let alone a snubbie C&B and a ball flying at about 600-700 fps.

JC5503 · December 21, 2010, 10:13 AM

Ok thanks for the input on that I am wanting to get into handgun hunting and have taken a whitetail with a handgun before but thought if I liked the C&B I would give that a whirl to

. If I like the C&B then that will give me an excuse to get a steel framed one and go after some deer lol... well thanks for the info everybody.

crgator · December 27, 2010, 04:14 PM

JC5503, I got one of those from Cabella's last summer, and don't regret it in the least. It's been a lot of fun, and the price just couldn't be beat. I load it with 20 gr and a .454 ball. Got a melter, mold and ladle from Santa and will soon be casting my own round balls for it.

And yes, I will own others.

December 12, 2010, 02:06 PM	#1
JC5503 Member Join Date: October 4, 2010 Location: southeast Ohio Posts: 76	cant decide Hey all, Im new to BP revolvers but wanted to get into them for plinking and maybe hunting, So I found some on sale at Cabelas but I dont know enough about them to know if its a good buy or if it would be just junk. So if anyone can tell me about the 1851 Confederate Navy .44 caliber Sheriff revolver I would appreciate.

December 12, 2010, 03:08 PM	#2
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	JC There is no way to recommend one pistol over another but the Sheriffs model is a nice pistol. I can't remember the sale that is on right now but I can tell you that Colt clones can be a tiny bit more finnicky that Remington clones. A good way to start would be the 8 inch barrel 1858 Remington in steel. It is on sale almost non-stop for 199.99. I had a Sheriff's model in .36 and it shot fine. The first four shots I put through it went inside of four inches at 25 yards. You may find that it shoots significantly above point of aim. This is disconcerting and takes a little getting used to. The Remington should pretty much shoot POA. If you have not already done so, go read the postit at the top entitled, "So you talked your wife into letting you buy a cap and ball revolver." or words to that effect. It is a storehouse of info. Note that I recommended the Remington over the Colt but there is no real reason for you to change your mind if you have your heart set on the Colt. I like Colts better'n Remingtons but cleaning, field stripping and such are easier with a Remington. I alway like to leave the post like this because now, fifty people will respond with arguments why Colts are better or Remingtons are better. It is truly fun to watch. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

December 12, 2010, 03:43 PM	#5
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	IMHO, for a first BP cap-n-ball revolver, start with a Remington-style reproduction. They don't have a barrel key which is one less thing for a newbie to worry about. Terms like Confederate and Sheriff are often used for modern versions of the old designs. In some cases a Confederate model is a .44-cal version of a revolver that was originally a .36-cal. Sheriff usually means a shortened barrel version. So, you take a Colt's 1851 brass-framed replica, bump it up from .36-cal to .44-cal, clip the barrel and call it a Confederate Sheriff's model. I suspect the demand the this version wasn't what Cabelas expected and that's why we're seeing it at a bargain basement price. Unless the Confederate Sheriff model really appeals to your sense of style (not just your wallet), I think you'd be happier with one of Cabelas discounted steel-framed Remingtons. As Doc Hoy noted, they are frequently on sale for $199.99. Last edited by zippy13; December 13, 2010 at 12:23 AM. Reason: typo

December 12, 2010, 07:45 PM	#6
Hellgate Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2010 Location: Orygun Posts: 869	The Remingtons will eat any load you can cram into it as long as you use BP or a BP substitute. They'll take conical 200gr bullets too. __________________ With over 15 perCUSSIN' revolvers, I've been called the Imelda Marcos of cap & ball. SASS#3302 (Life), SASS Regulator, NRA (Life), Dirty Gamey Bastards #129 Wolverton Mtn. Peacekeepers (WA), former Orygun Cowboy (Ranger, Posse from Hell)

December 12, 2010, 07:49 PM	#7
Fingers McGee Senior Member Join Date: March 19, 2008 Location: High & Dry in Missouri Ozarks Posts: 2,113	Even though I am a died in the wool Colt's style revolver afficionado. I tend to agree with Doc and the others that advocate a Remington style revolver as one's first foray into the BP C&B experience and obsession. Once you become fully immersed into the smoke lord lifestyle, and get a few thousand rounds under your belt, you can graduate to the more complex and beautifully styled Colt's. Oh, and, by the way.............................. Mary Ann __________________ Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee - AKA Man of Many Colts - Alter ego of Diabolical Ken; SASS Regulator 28564-L-TG; Rangemaster and stage writer extraordinaire; Frontiersman, Pistoleer, NRA Endowment Life, NMLRA, SAF, CCRKBA, STORM 327, SV115; Charter member, Central Ozarks Western Shooters Cynic: A blackguard whose faulty vision see things as they are, not as they should be. Ambrose Bierce

December 12, 2010, 03:20 PM	#3
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	Remington. They're stronger. No. Colt. They're prettier. No. Remington. They're stronger. No. Colt. They're prettier. No. Remington. They're stronger. No. Colt. They're prettier. Ford. No. Chevy. Ooops. Wrong thread. etc. etc.

December 12, 2010, 03:30 PM	#4
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	The so called Confederate Navy has a brass frame and wont hold up to heavy loads. You'd be better off with a steel frame. IMHO the Remington is more beginner friendly but the Colt isn't that hard to learn. Chevy no, Ford Wait, Chevy Ummm Ford oh jeez

December 12, 2010, 07:52 PM	#9
Fingers McGee Senior Member Join Date: March 19, 2008 Location: High & Dry in Missouri Ozarks Posts: 2,113	Mary Ann Mary Ann Mary Ann Mary Ann __________________ Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee - AKA Man of Many Colts - Alter ego of Diabolical Ken; SASS Regulator 28564-L-TG; Rangemaster and stage writer extraordinaire; Frontiersman, Pistoleer, NRA Endowment Life, NMLRA, SAF, CCRKBA, STORM 327, SV115; Charter member, Central Ozarks Western Shooters Cynic: A blackguard whose faulty vision see things as they are, not as they should be. Ambrose Bierce

December 12, 2010, 08:31 PM	#10
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	OK I'll take Mary Ann, you can have Mrs. Howell.

December 12, 2010, 09:19 PM	#11
Hardcase Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2009 Location: Sunny Southern Idaho Posts: 1,909	Dodge. __________________ Well we don't rent pigs and I figure it's better to say it right out front because a man that does like to rent pigs is... he's hard to stop - Gus McCrae

December 12, 2010, 10:17 PM	#12
bedbugbilly Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2009 Posts: 3,287	You mean they make revolvers with brass frames? And by the way . . I'd gladly take Mary Ann AND Ginger . . . you can keep Mrs. Howell . . . . . . __________________ If a pair of '51 Navies were good enough for Billy Hickok, then a single Navy on my right hip is good enough for me . . . besides . . . I'm probably only half as good as he was anyways. Hiram's Rangers Badge #63

December 12, 2010, 10:26 PM	#13
napp Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2010 Location: Georgia Posts: 152	I couldn't decide between the Colt and the Remington; so I ordered one of each. Now, I can't decide between Mary Ann and Ginger....hmmmm. __________________ napp

December 13, 2010, 03:05 AM	#15
Smokin_Gun Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 2005 Location: Mojave Desert, CA Posts: 1,195	Not a problem helpin' you out with your decision ... Remington would be the Rev to choose. and Mopar for your muscle Car/Truck :O) This 1861 Remington Old Army is still makin' Smoke and thowin' lead since 1862 ... So one a them 1858 NMA .44's from Cabelas should last you long enough, and remember you'll be buyin' more soon __________________ "I Smoke Black Powder" "Favor an 1858 Remington" SGT. Smokin' Gun, Mosby's Rangers 43rd Virginia Cavalry C.S.A. SASS# 19634, ... Admin:http://blackpowdersmoke.com/oldcoots/index.php

December 13, 2010, 04:46 PM	#17
Howard31 Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 2009 Location: Hudson Valley,NY Posts: 231	I can't decide either. I got an Army,a Remmie and a Navy.When you can't decide you get em all.Shoot the hell out of them and somewhere in the smoke of thousands of rounds the answers will appear. I don't care for 36 cal. I took the Navy and used my 44 cylander and Barrel and gave it a good try.For me the small grip is a problem.For some one else it could be a plus. Now its 44 Army vs 44 Remington, Pietta vs Uberti, and Triple 7 vs Pyrodex P. I am still no closer to which one I like best. There are plus's and minus's to each. I never could make up my mind between Mary Ann or Ginger and today Mrs Howell ain't looking bad either. Guns are a personal choice,what I like I am sure somebody some where really hates. It 's Ford or Chevy,Vanilla or chocolate. Take your time,go look at the guns ,get what you want and go shoot the thing .If you don't like it sell and get something else.

December 19, 2010, 10:31 PM	#18
JC5503 Member Join Date: October 4, 2010 Location: southeast Ohio Posts: 76	http://images.cabelas.com/is/image/c...sDtqwHrf9XNA3j So after alot of debate that is what I ended up buying and cant wait till it gets to my house lol im pumped to try it out

December 19, 2010, 11:28 PM	#19
Hellgate Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2010 Location: Orygun Posts: 869	JC5503, I have one of those. I shoot 20grs FFFg Goex+lube wad+.454 ball. I would not exceed 25grs powder on a regular basis since the brass frame is softer than steel and it could shoot loose with heavy loads. The Colt Navy style guns are round ball only. You cannot get a conical under the rammer. No big deal since the ball is just as much fun, easy to load, a cinch to cast and easier on the gun. __________________ With over 15 perCUSSIN' revolvers, I've been called the Imelda Marcos of cap & ball. SASS#3302 (Life), SASS Regulator, NRA (Life), Dirty Gamey Bastards #129 Wolverton Mtn. Peacekeepers (WA), former Orygun Cowboy (Ranger, Posse from Hell)

December 19, 2010, 11:30 PM	#20
starbuck125 Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 2009 Location: kentucky Posts: 140	when in doubt....buy both

December 20, 2010, 08:46 AM	#21
JC5503 Member Join Date: October 4, 2010 Location: southeast Ohio Posts: 76	Hellgate, I am new to BP revolvers and am curious if the load you described above is potent enough for whitetail hunting . Also can you load conical's if you remove the cylinder? and why are the balls easier on the gun compared to the conical?

December 20, 2010, 04:35 PM	#22
Fiv3 Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2010 Posts: 273	Congrats on your revolver The Colts are beautiful. I started with an 1858 earlier this year, fell into ownership of a lil brass framed baby Dragoon, and would like to get an 1860 sooner than later. I believe I detect the rattle of lead balls in one of the packages under the tree with my name on it. I'm also thinking there might be a 5lb brick under there which means my wife is giving me the go-ahead to start casting So, I guess to make it a worth while investment on her part, I should in turn invest in more .44 revolvers

December 21, 2010, 01:28 AM	#23
Hellgate Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2010 Location: Orygun Posts: 869	JC5503, I would not take that gun whitetail hunting unless you can stick the muzzle in the buck's ear and pull the trigger. It could kill a deer but you may have to track it for a long time. You are probably going to have ballistics somewhere less than a 38 special. A .357 magnum is considered minimal for handgun whitetail hunting. Some states set minimum muzzle energy requirements and that gun won't do it. Even if you loaded it up to 30grs powder the short sight radius would not let you get a good aim unless real close and a few 30 grain loads might shoot the gun loose by pulling the arbor out of the frame. The 200gr conicals can be loaded off the gun but they generate more pressure and drag as they go down the barrel which can pull the arbor loose over time. A Remington fully stoked or a Dragoon or Walker would be a better choice. The Walker has a 9" barrel, holds about 55grs powder under the ball and shoots like a rifle (I have TWO!). I know there are people out there who have killed deer with less and may have shot all kinds of heavy loads from their brass framed Colt but, geeze, I have enough trouble getting one with a scoped '06 let alone a snubbie C&B and a ball flying at about 600-700 fps. __________________ With over 15 perCUSSIN' revolvers, I've been called the Imelda Marcos of cap & ball. SASS#3302 (Life), SASS Regulator, NRA (Life), Dirty Gamey Bastards #129 Wolverton Mtn. Peacekeepers (WA), former Orygun Cowboy (Ranger, Posse from Hell)

December 21, 2010, 10:13 AM	#24
JC5503 Member Join Date: October 4, 2010 Location: southeast Ohio Posts: 76	Ok thanks for the input on that I am wanting to get into handgun hunting and have taken a whitetail with a handgun before but thought if I liked the C&B I would give that a whirl to . If I like the C&B then that will give me an excuse to get a steel framed one and go after some deer lol... well thanks for the info everybody.

December 27, 2010, 04:14 PM	#25
crgator Junior Member Join Date: July 18, 2010 Posts: 14	JC5503, I got one of those from Cabella's last summer, and don't regret it in the least. It's been a lot of fun, and the price just couldn't be beat. I load it with 20 gr and a .454 ball. Got a melter, mold and ladle from Santa and will soon be casting my own round balls for it. And yes, I will own others.