Conspiracy threads - Page 3

OuTcAsT · February 1, 2009, 01:16 PM

I voted in favor of deleting the posts for reasons someone else put quite eloquently:

Quote:

I really do not wish them to remain on the site "locked" from retorts from the members. If we cannot respond to demonstrate the foolishness of their premise, then there is no benefit

**Tom Servo** · February 2, 2009, 02:44 PM

I voted for deletion. They don't really add any real knowledge that people can use, just alot of finger-pointing and "what ifs."

Of course, the Mayan calendar ends on 2012, and some asteroid is going to hit the earth. If you're not already in league with the Secret Alien Cabal That Runs Everything, you're out of luck, anyhow, so it's all moot.

Glenn E. Meyer · February 2, 2009, 02:48 PM

I originally was for locking but seeing how the Revolution thread went down the drain - I'm switching to deleting. They just bring out the worst.

Wildalaska · February 2, 2009, 03:16 PM

I'd like to see the endless and duplicative "ALERT-HR (insert number here) to Confiscate all Guns Introduced in House" threads deleted too

One is OK, 15 trillion are boring

WildboringAlaska ™

**44 AMP** · February 2, 2009, 11:26 PM

which most aren't. I will admit a small degree of frustration not being able to reply to a closed thread, especially when I have a killer answer that is sure to make all of them see the light. Oh well.

Leave them or delete them, I care not, there are equally valid arguments both ways.

I would like to point out that conspiracies have, and do exist. That cannot, and should not be denied. Where the trouble comes in is those theories which have the "root cause" as something beyond what we consider reasonable or rational. Those are the ones called kooks. And most are. BUT...

As pointed out already, some of the things that have been done, and are being done are conspiracies, even if they are not being done by giant space ants.

bclark1 · February 2, 2009, 11:46 PM

I abstained from voting, because as was pointed out, it's ambiguous what a "conspiracy thread" is. WA put it well in that worrying that someone's watching is paranoid in and of itself. Mike Irwin goes to the other side but makes an equally strong point - just because it's far-featched doesn't mean it's not true. If you'd have told me two years ago that we'd be throwing around a trillion dollars, fast-tracked to try to hide that 3/4 is baloney, I'd have probably looked at you a little funny. Ultimately, reasonable people will differ (same ol', I know

). I would certainly like to see the more detrimental (for lack of a better word) threads - revolution, 9/11 "truth", alien coverup and anything suggestive of an honest politician in Chicago - deleted outright. But then again, I may be an inadequate judge of what is detrimental.

So I'm no help. But if we're doing something with them, I guess I would favor deletion over locking, because a prompt locking does not allow the board members - who I would aggregate as reasonable - to "wash" the thread and inject some well-thought counterpoints into it for the record. While merely locking it makes the point that it's not tolerated, it still leaves an otherwise undisputed negative artifact in the archives indefinitely. I didn't vote it though because I'm not convinced that it's necessary to do something unless they otherwise violate the board rules, which they tend to do anyway.

OnTheFly · February 3, 2009, 12:02 AM

I voted to lock but keep them. It might have a few benefits...

These posts help define limits and may allow us to measure our ranking in the world of sanity.
When others who visit TFL see that the mods don't allow posts from left field, they understand that the drive of the forum and the majority of the members are not that radical.

I'm not too passionate about the subject either way because I've already mastered the mind control techniques necessary to thwart the government experiments which employ aliens to read my thoughts.

Fly

JuanCarlos · February 3, 2009, 03:23 PM

Assuming this sub-forum is indexed by google (and I assume that, like the rest of the forums, it is) I'd say we should be mindful about how much junk we let our crazy uncles leave in our front yard.

I'd say the optimal solution would be to leave them until they drop off the front page, both so we can all share a good double-u-tee-eff and to serve as an example to any new members who might need an example of what not to do.

No need to leave them longer, because if said newb isn't going to read the rules sticky he's not going to go much past the front page looking for cautionary notes (and wouldn't get it even if he did). Leaving them longer just raises the odds that TFL will come higher up when somebody punches "black helicopter" into google.

However, that's probably more a pain in the butt than it's worth (keeping track of them, that is) for the mod staff, so I say we just nuke them from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

Creature · February 3, 2009, 03:29 PM

Quote:

I'd say the optimal solution would be to leave them until they drop off the front page, both so we can all share a good double-u-tee-eff and to serve as an example to any new members who might need an example of what not to do.

I agree with this sentiment and the solution.

coltncat · February 4, 2009, 10:41 AM

Put them in their own spot, and if anyone wants to view that type of thing; they can get all they want there. Let's not mix them into laws and rights. They are opinions ...

Al Norris · February 4, 2009, 12:58 PM

TFL has never been a conspiracy board, regardless of the number of posts, and opinions, that might cause someone to think otherwise. There are many places on the interwebs where you may go to read and/or comment upon such. TFL is not that place.

With that, firmly in mind, we are not entertaining even a hint of a place to put such... except perhaps the trashcan. Hence the advisory poll for this thread.

kirpi97 · February 4, 2009, 01:10 PM

I will not add anything here because it gets me in trouble. But as I read through this thread, I realize we are no closer to a resounding resolution. Back in the beginning, when I voted, it was 5 - 5 for and against. Now it is 33 - 34. Good luck taking this one to the board for a decision. I hope you have an odd number on the court. 'Cause I am seeing a 5 - 4 decision.

34 to 34 I like it.

Al Norris · February 6, 2009, 08:52 AM

Ah, but remember kirpi97, those who voted who do not post regularly in this area of the board, will not count as heavily as those who do post in this section, regularly.

Like all data points, some votes are given more weight than others.

Big Don · February 12, 2009, 07:24 PM

As in "Everyone is equal, but some are more equal than others?"

kirpi97 · February 13, 2009, 02:25 AM

OK, where are the hanging chads?

Here I thought the idea was to vote and vote often. This way one person could sway the outcome. And now you are telling me it ain't so. That is so unAmerican. Even "Dancing with the Stars" gives one five votes. I learned my politics on the east side of Chicago. And with a few more deceased members voting and I could be a contender.

If I gain a little more weight, will that help my vote carry more?

Are we getting any closer to a decision on the initial question? I see a few Staff members voicing their position.

EricReynolds · February 18, 2009, 09:25 PM

I must admit that I find them entertaining, but it perpetuates the stereotypes of gun enthusiasts being paranoid delusional people. Gun people who believe that the government is trying to control us all, are not our best representatives.

OuTcAsT · February 18, 2009, 09:33 PM

Quote:

it perpetuates the stereotypes of gun enthusiasts being paranoid delusional people

The voices in my head tell me otherwise.

OnTheFly · February 18, 2009, 09:40 PM

Quote:

The voices in my head tell me otherwise.

Don't worry. You're not paranoid or delusional. You're schizophrenic!

Fly

Glenn E. Meyer · February 20, 2009, 11:05 AM

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,496309,00.html

Prepare for the robot conspiracy. Now can you imagine that thread. What round for robots? Do we need FA for robots. Is Cheney the first wave? Is Arnold really Ar-nuhld? I fought the robots when I was a Navy Seal.

Gaxicus · February 21, 2009, 06:08 PM

Seems to me that if the board is sanitized, people running into conspiracy stuff wont have a decent place to learn the truth. Just the kook boards. Is that helping?

Being afraid to discuss this stuff here or anywhere else is volentarily silencing ourselves.

I dont blame the moderators for being burned out with the same threads coming up so often. Instead of closing threads and forbidding people to talk about this stuff, make a sticky thread that fleshes out the details of the particular issue and, if they come up, people can refer them to the sticky.

Driving people to kook boards and silencing people looking to this board for decent info isnt helping gun owners, it is silencing them and feeding the conspiracies.

Wildalaska · February 21, 2009, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Seems to me that if the board is sanitized, people running into conspiracy stuff wont have a decent place to learn the truth. Just the kook boards. Is that helping?

If a person is visiting "kook boards" for information then any debunking here makes no difference.

Its the GreenCheese Conundrum.

I would hope this Board remains a place for normal gunowners to hang out. Plenty of places for the "others" to go

WildrobotsatemyfleshAlaska ™

El Paso Joe · February 21, 2009, 07:43 PM

I voted to lock but leave in view. After a number of years as a mental health professional in an isolated rural area, I think I have heard them all. But clearly I haven't. I know the Air Force is not spraying mind control agents from high flying aircraft. And I don't often give much credence to folks with tinfoil hats (actually had one as a colleague in grad school - until he was arrested for contraband herbage). But I would rather that everything be in the open and let folks read them for whatever reason.

TheNatureBoy · February 21, 2009, 07:50 PM

Conspiracy theory threads are entertaining for a few minutes but after that..... I pay more attention to the responses than anything else. Kooky and scary at the same time because these people are serious. I say allow for responses but lock them if it gets too crazy. It takes so called experts and kooks to make this whole thing work anyway. This board is filled with both.

Hey El Paso Joe, are you sure the Air Force isn't spraying mind control agents from high flying aircraft? I live down the street from Langley, AFB and I've heard rumors.

David Armstrong · February 28, 2009, 03:27 PM

Lock them and delete them. There is enough bad information and phony reality running around the 'net without adding to it.

Double J · March 1, 2009, 11:04 AM

Just read all this stuff and still haven't a clue what a Conspiracy Thread is?

View Poll Results: What Do You Feel Should Be Done With Conspiracy Threads?
Lock them, but leave in public view.	53	53.00%
Delete them from the forum	47	47.00%
Voters: 100. You may not vote on this poll

February 2, 2009, 02:44 PM	#52
Tom Servo Staff Join Date: September 27, 2008 Location: Foothills of the Appalachians Posts: 13,059	I voted for deletion. They don't really add any real knowledge that people can use, just alot of finger-pointing and "what ifs." Of course, the Mayan calendar ends on 2012, and some asteroid is going to hit the earth. If you're not already in league with the Secret Alien Cabal That Runs Everything, you're out of luck, anyhow, so it's all moot. __________________ Sometimes it’s nice not to destroy the world for a change. --Randall Munroe

February 2, 2009, 02:48 PM	#53
Glenn E. Meyer Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2000 Posts: 20,064	I originally was for locking but seeing how the Revolution thread went down the drain - I'm switching to deleting. They just bring out the worst. __________________ NRA, TSRA, IDPA, NTI, Polite Soc. - Aux Armes, Citoyens

February 2, 2009, 11:26 PM	#55
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,844	I enjoy reding them, if they are well written which most aren't. I will admit a small degree of frustration not being able to reply to a closed thread, especially when I have a killer answer that is sure to make all of them see the light. Oh well. Leave them or delete them, I care not, there are equally valid arguments both ways. I would like to point out that conspiracies have, and do exist. That cannot, and should not be denied. Where the trouble comes in is those theories which have the "root cause" as something beyond what we consider reasonable or rational. Those are the ones called kooks. And most are. BUT... As pointed out already, some of the things that have been done, and are being done are conspiracies, even if they are not being done by giant space ants. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

February 3, 2009, 12:02 AM	#57
OnTheFly Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2007 Location: SE Nebraska Posts: 859	I voted to lock but keep them. It might have a few benefits... These posts help define limits and may allow us to measure our ranking in the world of sanity. When others who visit TFL see that the mods don't allow posts from left field, they understand that the drive of the forum and the majority of the members are not that radical. I'm not too passionate about the subject either way because I've already mastered the mind control techniques necessary to thwart the government experiments which employ aliens to read my thoughts. Fly __________________ I told my wife I was scheduling a mid-life crisis. It was either a Harley or guns. Secretly, I've already decided on guns. :-) Bang... Bang... Bang...

February 2, 2009, 03:16 PM	#54
Wildalaska Junior member Join Date: November 25, 2002 Location: In my own little weird world in Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 14,172	I'd like to see the endless and duplicative "ALERT-HR (insert number here) to Confiscate all Guns Introduced in House" threads deleted too One is OK, 15 trillion are boring WildboringAlaska ™

February 2, 2009, 11:46 PM	#56
bclark1 Senior Member Join Date: January 5, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,531	I abstained from voting, because as was pointed out, it's ambiguous what a "conspiracy thread" is. WA put it well in that worrying that someone's watching is paranoid in and of itself. Mike Irwin goes to the other side but makes an equally strong point - just because it's far-featched doesn't mean it's not true. If you'd have told me two years ago that we'd be throwing around a trillion dollars, fast-tracked to try to hide that 3/4 is baloney, I'd have probably looked at you a little funny. Ultimately, reasonable people will differ (same ol', I know ). I would certainly like to see the more detrimental (for lack of a better word) threads - revolution, 9/11 "truth", alien coverup and anything suggestive of an honest politician in Chicago - deleted outright. But then again, I may be an inadequate judge of what is detrimental. So I'm no help. But if we're doing something with them, I guess I would favor deletion over locking, because a prompt locking does not allow the board members - who I would aggregate as reasonable - to "wash" the thread and inject some well-thought counterpoints into it for the record. While merely locking it makes the point that it's not tolerated, it still leaves an otherwise undisputed negative artifact in the archives indefinitely. I didn't vote it though because I'm not convinced that it's necessary to do something unless they otherwise violate the board rules, which they tend to do anyway.

February 3, 2009, 03:23 PM	#58
JuanCarlos Senior Member Join Date: July 22, 2006 Posts: 2,459	Assuming this sub-forum is indexed by google (and I assume that, like the rest of the forums, it is) I'd say we should be mindful about how much junk we let our crazy uncles leave in our front yard. I'd say the optimal solution would be to leave them until they drop off the front page, both so we can all share a good double-u-tee-eff and to serve as an example to any new members who might need an example of what not to do. No need to leave them longer, because if said newb isn't going to read the rules sticky he's not going to go much past the front page looking for cautionary notes (and wouldn't get it even if he did). Leaving them longer just raises the odds that TFL will come higher up when somebody punches "black helicopter" into google. However, that's probably more a pain in the butt than it's worth (keeping track of them, that is) for the mod staff, so I say we just nuke them from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

February 4, 2009, 10:41 AM	#60
coltncat Junior Member Join Date: January 29, 2009 Location: New Mexico Posts: 4	Put them in their own spot, and if anyone wants to view that type of thing; they can get all they want there. Let's not mix them into laws and rights. They are opinions ...

February 4, 2009, 12:58 PM	#61
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	TFL has never been a conspiracy board, regardless of the number of posts, and opinions, that might cause someone to think otherwise. There are many places on the interwebs where you may go to read and/or comment upon such. TFL is not that place. With that, firmly in mind, we are not entertaining even a hint of a place to put such... except perhaps the trashcan. Hence the advisory poll for this thread.

February 4, 2009, 01:10 PM	#62
kirpi97 Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Location: Oregon Posts: 236	I will not add anything here because it gets me in trouble. But as I read through this thread, I realize we are no closer to a resounding resolution. Back in the beginning, when I voted, it was 5 - 5 for and against. Now it is 33 - 34. Good luck taking this one to the board for a decision. I hope you have an odd number on the court. 'Cause I am seeing a 5 - 4 decision. 34 to 34 I like it. __________________ The parting shot... "Those who hammer their guns into plows, will plow for those who do not." Thomas Jefferson Last edited by kirpi97; February 5, 2009 at 12:00 PM.

February 6, 2009, 08:52 AM	#63
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	Ah, but remember kirpi97, those who voted who do not post regularly in this area of the board, will not count as heavily as those who do post in this section, regularly. Like all data points, some votes are given more weight than others.

February 12, 2009, 07:24 PM	#64
Big Don Senior Member Join Date: June 13, 2006 Location: Hayden, ID Posts: 375	As in "Everyone is equal, but some are more equal than others?" __________________ [SIZE="3"][SIZE="2"]Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he's too old to fight, he'll just kill you. "If men are so wicked with religion, what would they be if without it?"- Benjamin Franklin

February 13, 2009, 02:25 AM	#65
kirpi97 Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Location: Oregon Posts: 236	OK, where are the hanging chads? Here I thought the idea was to vote and vote often. This way one person could sway the outcome. And now you are telling me it ain't so. That is so unAmerican. Even "Dancing with the Stars" gives one five votes. I learned my politics on the east side of Chicago. And with a few more deceased members voting and I could be a contender. If I gain a little more weight, will that help my vote carry more? Are we getting any closer to a decision on the initial question? I see a few Staff members voicing their position. __________________ The parting shot... "Those who hammer their guns into plows, will plow for those who do not." Thomas Jefferson

February 18, 2009, 09:25 PM	#66
EricReynolds Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2008 Location: Syracuse, NY Posts: 393	I must admit that I find them entertaining, but it perpetuates the stereotypes of gun enthusiasts being paranoid delusional people. Gun people who believe that the government is trying to control us all, are not our best representatives.

February 20, 2009, 11:05 AM	#69
Glenn E. Meyer Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2000 Posts: 20,064	http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,496309,00.html Prepare for the robot conspiracy. Now can you imagine that thread. What round for robots? Do we need FA for robots. Is Cheney the first wave? Is Arnold really Ar-nuhld? I fought the robots when I was a Navy Seal. __________________ NRA, TSRA, IDPA, NTI, Polite Soc. - Aux Armes, Citoyens

February 21, 2009, 06:08 PM	#70
Gaxicus Senior Member Join Date: January 28, 2009 Location: USA Posts: 172	Why not let them get fleshed out Seems to me that if the board is sanitized, people running into conspiracy stuff wont have a decent place to learn the truth. Just the kook boards. Is that helping? Being afraid to discuss this stuff here or anywhere else is volentarily silencing ourselves. I dont blame the moderators for being burned out with the same threads coming up so often. Instead of closing threads and forbidding people to talk about this stuff, make a sticky thread that fleshes out the details of the particular issue and, if they come up, people can refer them to the sticky. Driving people to kook boards and silencing people looking to this board for decent info isnt helping gun owners, it is silencing them and feeding the conspiracies.

February 21, 2009, 07:43 PM	#72
El Paso Joe Senior Member Join Date: July 4, 2006 Location: Spokane Valley Posts: 340	I voted to lock but leave in view. After a number of years as a mental health professional in an isolated rural area, I think I have heard them all. But clearly I haven't. I know the Air Force is not spraying mind control agents from high flying aircraft. And I don't often give much credence to folks with tinfoil hats (actually had one as a colleague in grad school - until he was arrested for contraband herbage). But I would rather that everything be in the open and let folks read them for whatever reason.

February 21, 2009, 07:50 PM	#73
TheNatureBoy Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2007 Posts: 1,204	Conspiracy theory threads are entertaining for a few minutes but after that..... I pay more attention to the responses than anything else. Kooky and scary at the same time because these people are serious. I say allow for responses but lock them if it gets too crazy. It takes so called experts and kooks to make this whole thing work anyway. This board is filled with both. Hey El Paso Joe, are you sure the Air Force isn't spraying mind control agents from high flying aircraft? I live down the street from Langley, AFB and I've heard rumors.

February 28, 2009, 03:27 PM	#74
David Armstrong Junior member Join Date: January 24, 2005 Location: SW Louisiana Posts: 2,289	Lock them and delete them. There is enough bad information and phony reality running around the 'net without adding to it.

March 1, 2009, 11:04 AM	#75
Double J Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2007 Location: So. Illinois Posts: 547	Just read all this stuff and still haven't a clue what a Conspiracy Thread is?