10 mm on 45 platform?

CReynolds · August 24, 2001, 03:12 PM

Is it possible to use a 10mm barrel in a 45 platform, such as the Kimber or Colt? Specifically, can the 45 platform handle the pressures and pounding of the 10mm and are there barrels available for this project?

Coley

blades67 · August 24, 2001, 10:21 PM

No, the case head diameters are different. You could have a .45 acp gun converted to 10mm, but they can't be made interchagable with just a barrel swap.

hksigwalther · August 25, 2001, 07:06 AM

AMT/IAI marketed the Hardballer Longslide (.45ACP) and Javalina (10mm) at one time. Both were identical with the only difference being the barrel, recoil spring, and magazine. I can't recall if the breachfaces of the slides are the same or not (making them caliber specific), I'll have to examine them when I get back up to my parents house some time. I do recall trying to swap slide assembles but the 10mm slide on the .45ACP frame needed minor slide rail fitting as it wouldn't fit all the way on. In any event, if you do have a 10mm barrel fitted to a previously .45ACP 1911, a much stronger recoil spring is necessary. The 10mm mags are the same as the .45ACP one but have internal ridges molded into the sides for the more narrow cartridge. IME, these are not really needed as I have been able to shoot 10mm using .45ACP mags.

Peters Stahl (Germany) still does make the 'Omega' line of 1911 based guns that are caliber interchangable with a simple barrel, recoil spring, mag swap. They, however, are not being imported into the USA (as far as I know). There are older Springfield Omegas out there when they were imported by them a long time ago. The entire slide assembly is very different from the regular 1911. It incorporates a linkless barrel system like today's SIGs, Glocks, HK USPs, etc. The flat breachface of the slide and dual extractors that self adjust to casehead diameter allow for the use of the same slide for all calibers. The dual extractor system isn't the greatest as empties will occasionally fly back at your face, at least in 10mm.

Gunslinger45 · August 25, 2001, 09:22 AM

Simple way to get 10mm performance is to get a 400 CorBon barrel from Brownells (45ACP case necked down to 40).
REALLY spits those 135 grainers out !
Just swap out the barrel - same clips, you should already be using a stout recoil spring.
Only pain is no carbide dies for reloading.

jtduncan · August 25, 2001, 01:10 PM

No no no.

Even it some are doing it, it shouldn't be done.

The 45 ACP round is designed at 50 percent of the pressure loads of the average factory 10mm round.

You will batter that gun down and yourself in less than 40K rounds.

Look at the Colt Delta Elite for a 1911 in 10mm. Its the best one out there.

These conversions can ened up costing you close to the amount of just going out and buying a gun designed fro the 10mm round.

And with its pressures, you're better safe than sorry less a hand.

Be safe and get the whole gun whatever it is.

jakester · August 25, 2001, 04:35 PM

You can use the 45 frame, but you'll need a 10mm/40 slide. There are several out there. The conversion can be expensive: $200+ for the frame, $150-200 for the barrel, then all the "extras" like sights, ejector, extractor, magazinzes, firing pin, etc. I was considering the idea myself, but considering plan B & C now. Plan B: New 1911 in 40S&W (ream the barrel and change the recoil spring) or Plan C: buy a EAA Witness 10mm or Glock 20 10mm new. The EAA's are in the $300 range, while the Glock 20's are in the $500-600 range. The EAA is not well liked by the gun dealers in my area, but the shooters posting on this forum seem to really like the gun. The choice is your's. Ultimately, a used Delta Elite would be great, but I haven't found any locally, and the ones advertised on the gun sale web sites are typically in the $800+ range.

hksigwalther · August 25, 2001, 07:42 PM

Oh, forgot to mention. Then AMT/IAI products suck (at least the samples I got). I keep the 10mm for parts for an Omega 10mm and the frame for the .45ACP for a single shot (rifle cartridge) platform. Still have the slide assemblies though.

WESHOOT2 · August 25, 2001, 10:20 PM

Dillon has carbide 400 C-B dies.

CReynolds · August 27, 2001, 02:12 PM

Thanks for all the replies everyone. Here is a follow up question. Can I buy a new Kimber chambered for 40 and convert the barrel or are there other necessary changes?

Coley

CastleBravo · August 27, 2001, 02:38 PM

You'd need either a new barrel or the chamber of the old one reamed out, and a heavier recoil spring. Mags are the same. There might be more to it but it won't be much. Should be simple for any good gunsmith to do.

August 24, 2001, 03:12 PM	#1
CReynolds Member Join Date: March 16, 2001 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 49	10 mm on 45 platform? Is it possible to use a 10mm barrel in a 45 platform, such as the Kimber or Colt? Specifically, can the 45 platform handle the pressures and pounding of the 10mm and are there barrels available for this project? Coley __________________ Cead Mile Failte

August 24, 2001, 10:21 PM	#2
blades67 Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 1999 Location: Chandler, Arizona, USA Posts: 6,014	No, the case head diameters are different. You could have a .45 acp gun converted to 10mm, but they can't be made interchagable with just a barrel swap. __________________ Guns cause crime like spoons cause Rosie O'Donnell to be fat! I hunt, therefore I am.

August 25, 2001, 07:06 AM	#3
hksigwalther Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 1998 Location: NE OH, USA Posts: 3,198	AMT/IAI marketed the Hardballer Longslide (.45ACP) and Javalina (10mm) at one time. Both were identical with the only difference being the barrel, recoil spring, and magazine. I can't recall if the breachfaces of the slides are the same or not (making them caliber specific), I'll have to examine them when I get back up to my parents house some time. I do recall trying to swap slide assembles but the 10mm slide on the .45ACP frame needed minor slide rail fitting as it wouldn't fit all the way on. In any event, if you do have a 10mm barrel fitted to a previously .45ACP 1911, a much stronger recoil spring is necessary. The 10mm mags are the same as the .45ACP one but have internal ridges molded into the sides for the more narrow cartridge. IME, these are not really needed as I have been able to shoot 10mm using .45ACP mags. Peters Stahl (Germany) still does make the 'Omega' line of 1911 based guns that are caliber interchangable with a simple barrel, recoil spring, mag swap. They, however, are not being imported into the USA (as far as I know). There are older Springfield Omegas out there when they were imported by them a long time ago. The entire slide assembly is very different from the regular 1911. It incorporates a linkless barrel system like today's SIGs, Glocks, HK USPs, etc. The flat breachface of the slide and dual extractors that self adjust to casehead diameter allow for the use of the same slide for all calibers. The dual extractor system isn't the greatest as empties will occasionally fly back at your face, at least in 10mm. __________________ - Ron V. Last edited by hksigwalther; August 25, 2001 at 07:39 PM.

August 25, 2001, 09:22 AM	#4
Gunslinger45 Member Join Date: August 22, 2001 Location: Springfield, Ohio Posts: 49	Simple way to get 10mm performance is to get a 400 CorBon barrel from Brownells (45ACP case necked down to 40). REALLY spits those 135 grainers out ! Just swap out the barrel - same clips, you should already be using a stout recoil spring. Only pain is no carbide dies for reloading. __________________ Gunslinger Cogno, ergo, boom

August 25, 2001, 01:10 PM	#5
jtduncan Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 1999 Location: Seattle, Washington, USA Posts: 1,686	No no no. Even it some are doing it, it shouldn't be done. The 45 ACP round is designed at 50 percent of the pressure loads of the average factory 10mm round. You will batter that gun down and yourself in less than 40K rounds. Look at the Colt Delta Elite for a 1911 in 10mm. Its the best one out there. These conversions can ened up costing you close to the amount of just going out and buying a gun designed fro the 10mm round. And with its pressures, you're better safe than sorry less a hand. Be safe and get the whole gun whatever it is. __________________ The Seattle SharpShooter Reloaded .223 Rem, 9mm, 40SW, 357 SIG, 10mm, 44 Mag, 45 ACP Today?

August 25, 2001, 04:35 PM	#6
jakester Senior Member Join Date: July 6, 2001 Posts: 129	45 Frame with new slide You can use the 45 frame, but you'll need a 10mm/40 slide. There are several out there. The conversion can be expensive: $200+ for the frame, $150-200 for the barrel, then all the "extras" like sights, ejector, extractor, magazinzes, firing pin, etc. I was considering the idea myself, but considering plan B & C now. Plan B: New 1911 in 40S&W (ream the barrel and change the recoil spring) or Plan C: buy a EAA Witness 10mm or Glock 20 10mm new. The EAA's are in the $300 range, while the Glock 20's are in the $500-600 range. The EAA is not well liked by the gun dealers in my area, but the shooters posting on this forum seem to really like the gun. The choice is your's. Ultimately, a used Delta Elite would be great, but I haven't found any locally, and the ones advertised on the gun sale web sites are typically in the $800+ range.

August 25, 2001, 07:42 PM	#7
hksigwalther Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 1998 Location: NE OH, USA Posts: 3,198	Oh, forgot to mention. Then AMT/IAI products suck (at least the samples I got). I keep the 10mm for parts for an Omega 10mm and the frame for the .45ACP for a single shot (rifle cartridge) platform. Still have the slide assemblies though. __________________ - Ron V.

August 25, 2001, 10:20 PM	#8
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	GS45 Dillon has carbide 400 C-B dies. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

August 27, 2001, 02:12 PM	#9
CReynolds Member Join Date: March 16, 2001 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 49	What about converting a Kimber 40? Thanks for all the replies everyone. Here is a follow up question. Can I buy a new Kimber chambered for 40 and convert the barrel or are there other necessary changes? Coley __________________ Cead Mile Failte

August 27, 2001, 02:38 PM	#10
CastleBravo Senior Member Join Date: December 11, 1999 Posts: 2,144	You'd need either a new barrel or the chamber of the old one reamed out, and a heavier recoil spring. Mags are the same. There might be more to it but it won't be much. Should be simple for any good gunsmith to do.