Cases stuck in chamber - Page 3

**Unclenick** · April 16, 2010, 10:34 AM

He's got some shiny rings on the cases, so I assume the chamber is rough and is contributing to the extraction issue. But he's getting brass stretching and flat primers (high pressure signs) and blackened case neck (low pressure sign) at the same time. Soft brass is about the only way I can see all that happening.

Recently there was a thread by Greco having a problem in .308 with some old LC brass. He could only load it to about 70% of normal pressure before the cases would stick in the chamber. I sent him a few new LC cases and he had no problem loading them to normal pressures. So, it seems his old LC had been previously stretched too far, probably in a machine gun, to return to shape normally in firing. Captain Hook is getting one firing from the S&B and then it seems to be over-stretched already. Note how his Remington case didn't grow on firing but the S&B's did. It certainly seems to be a hardness issue with brass that new.

I also have some mid-80's Berdan primed S&B that is quite springy and hard, so this is a surprise. However, I'd heard that Remington (I think it was) had been forced to reject some foreign contract brass this year that had been annealed too soft and all the way to the head. With various overseas manufacturers getting involved in making different head stamps on contract, I expect a lot of brass is changing from what we were used to. I don't know that S&B is contracting out, but they could be if they had a shortfall of capacity.

oneoldsap · April 16, 2010, 02:30 PM

Case length in and of it's self within .020" will not cause head space issues or indicators . Pushing the shoulder back too far however will look like high pressure . I always set my die to the chamber of the rifle that I'm loading for . If you take a wax candle and light it and hold a resized case in the smoke on the shoulder , it will turn nice and black . Chamber it , if it slides right in and doesn't leave a mark in the smoke on the shoulder turn your die down 1/4 turn and repeat . You want to get a mark on the shoulder and still have the bolt close easily . This keeps brass flow to a minimum .
You can find your OAL in the same manner by candling the bullet and just getting a mark when you close the bolt . Then I shorten by .010" and load a starting string and see what happens from there ! Try it you'll like it !

**Unclenick** · April 16, 2010, 03:05 PM

You normally have that 0.020" trim safety margin ahead of the maximum case length, but he's stretching those S&B cases up to 0.010" in firing. That's bound to happen while the bullet is pushed forward before the neck lets it go, so I'd not trust there to be more than half that safety margin available to him with these particular cases.

Captain Hook · April 16, 2010, 03:53 PM

Hey guys your input has really been great.
Being new to reloading necked cases, I was wondering if I could set the shoulder of the die to the fired round? It seems that the case would be an exact fit to the chamber.

oneoldsap · April 16, 2010, 07:08 PM

Once fired is exact , then I neck size if they aren't hunting rounds and are for a bolt action .

Jim243 · April 17, 2010, 12:27 AM

You best bet is to get a collet die to do neck sizing only for your caliber.

Jim

April 16, 2010, 10:34 AM	#51
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	He's got some shiny rings on the cases, so I assume the chamber is rough and is contributing to the extraction issue. But he's getting brass stretching and flat primers (high pressure signs) and blackened case neck (low pressure sign) at the same time. Soft brass is about the only way I can see all that happening. Recently there was a thread by Greco having a problem in .308 with some old LC brass. He could only load it to about 70% of normal pressure before the cases would stick in the chamber. I sent him a few new LC cases and he had no problem loading them to normal pressures. So, it seems his old LC had been previously stretched too far, probably in a machine gun, to return to shape normally in firing. Captain Hook is getting one firing from the S&B and then it seems to be over-stretched already. Note how his Remington case didn't grow on firing but the S&B's did. It certainly seems to be a hardness issue with brass that new. I also have some mid-80's Berdan primed S&B that is quite springy and hard, so this is a surprise. However, I'd heard that Remington (I think it was) had been forced to reject some foreign contract brass this year that had been annealed too soft and all the way to the head. With various overseas manufacturers getting involved in making different head stamps on contract, I expect a lot of brass is changing from what we were used to. I don't know that S&B is contracting out, but they could be if they had a shortfall of capacity. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

April 16, 2010, 03:05 PM	#53
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	You normally have that 0.020" trim safety margin ahead of the maximum case length, but he's stretching those S&B cases up to 0.010" in firing. That's bound to happen while the bullet is pushed forward before the neck lets it go, so I'd not trust there to be more than half that safety margin available to him with these particular cases. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

April 16, 2010, 02:30 PM	#52
oneoldsap Senior Member Join Date: September 16, 2009 Location: I live in the foot of the Green Mountains of Vermont Posts: 1,602	Case length in and of it's self within .020" will not cause head space issues or indicators . Pushing the shoulder back too far however will look like high pressure . I always set my die to the chamber of the rifle that I'm loading for . If you take a wax candle and light it and hold a resized case in the smoke on the shoulder , it will turn nice and black . Chamber it , if it slides right in and doesn't leave a mark in the smoke on the shoulder turn your die down 1/4 turn and repeat . You want to get a mark on the shoulder and still have the bolt close easily . This keeps brass flow to a minimum . You can find your OAL in the same manner by candling the bullet and just getting a mark when you close the bolt . Then I shorten by .010" and load a starting string and see what happens from there ! Try it you'll like it !

April 16, 2010, 03:53 PM	#54
Captain Hook Member Join Date: April 14, 2010 Location: Michigan Posts: 19	Hey guys your input has really been great. Being new to reloading necked cases, I was wondering if I could set the shoulder of the die to the fired round? It seems that the case would be an exact fit to the chamber.

April 16, 2010, 07:08 PM	#55
oneoldsap Senior Member Join Date: September 16, 2009 Location: I live in the foot of the Green Mountains of Vermont Posts: 1,602	Once fired is exact , then I neck size if they aren't hunting rounds and are for a bolt action .

April 17, 2010, 12:27 AM	#56
Jim243 Senior Member Join Date: January 5, 2009 Location: Just off Route 66 Posts: 5,067	You best bet is to get a collet die to do neck sizing only for your caliber. Jim