Sauer & Sohn 6.5x53 rifle

webhak · October 28, 2010, 11:31 PM

I've inherited a beautiful breech-loading rifle from J.P. Sauer & Sohn, Suhl. The barrel markings include:

ELL 6.5x53 R
???UFF - LAUFSTAHL (with bullet-shaped symbol after) * The ??? indicate some letters that obscured by the scope mounting plate.

I have no other info to provide but would sure appreciate any information as to the value and history of this rifle.

I'll also be posting some questions about four European parlor/dueling pistols as well.

webhak · October 28, 2010, 11:33 PM

Sorry about the large image size. I'm on the road and don't have access to my main computer to get these re-sized.

mapsjanhere · October 29, 2010, 07:50 AM

probably chambered for this cartridge, you can get the dies from Midway and the brass from Grafs. A picture of the proofmarks on the underside of the barrel would help to give more exact date of manufacture, but the crown B crown U on the action say Germany prior to 1939.

webhak · October 29, 2010, 08:46 AM

Thanks. I looked again and did not see any markings on the barrel. I did notice the number "473" stamped on the inside of the trigger guard.

mapsjanhere · October 29, 2010, 08:59 AM

Did you take the barrel out of the action? The stamps are usually at the root of the barrel, just in front of the part that engages the action.
I looked at value, and you have two issues. You're missing the top claw mounts, that's $200 for anyone who wants to use it. The other is the cartridge. It's the old WWI era Dutch military caliber, long out of production, even in Europe with RWS, Norma and Lapua. Brass is $2 a pop, so despite this being a very nice German stalking rifle you'll find very few people who'd buy this to actually use it for hunting.
Typically a Sauer like that would go for $1000 - $1500 at Gunbroker, with the two limitations I mentioned you'd be lucky to get the lower value.

webhak · October 29, 2010, 09:04 AM

Thanks. He may have some cartridges lying around that go with this one...or another German rifle/shotgun combo he used to have. I can't be sure as I was a kid when he bought these. It's too nice to shoot for me and will be a wall hanger if I have anything to say about it.

James K · October 29, 2010, 12:45 PM

I suspect your "--FF LAUFSTAHL" is actually "KRUPP LAUFSTAHL" (Krupp Barrel Steel). As noted, cases can be made from .303 British but (I think) also from .30-40 Krag cases.

Jim

Jim Watson · October 29, 2010, 02:10 PM

Buffalo Arms has 6.5x53R Dutch brass reformed from .303 at $2.09 each but "only" $82 for 50 or $160 a hundred.
http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,740.html

Bertram brass with correct headstamp is more expensive but probably not worth the difference.

I don't know about load data, 6.5x54 Mannlicher would be a place to start looking or maybe there is something on the www.

sauerfan · October 30, 2010, 02:02 AM

Hi webhak,

what you have is Sauer & Sohn model "Tell" (more precisely: "Tell-Büchse" = Tell rifle). There were two variations; you have the better one with detachable barrel (the screw lever on the left). Turn it to the left for some revolutions and you can take the barrel off from the action.

Please do so: as already mentioned, there you'll find (probably) more markings, like the proof date and so on.

Are you sure about the calibre? Very unusual for a Tell. I liked to see a photo of the calibre markings.

Regards

Martin

October 28, 2010, 11:31 PM	#1
webhak Junior Member Join Date: November 5, 2002 Location: Nevada Posts: 5	Sauer & Sohn 6.5x53 rifle I've inherited a beautiful breech-loading rifle from J.P. Sauer & Sohn, Suhl. The barrel markings include: ELL 6.5x53 R ???UFF - LAUFSTAHL (with bullet-shaped symbol after) * The ??? indicate some letters that obscured by the scope mounting plate. I have no other info to provide but would sure appreciate any information as to the value and history of this rifle. I'll also be posting some questions about four European parlor/dueling pistols as well.

October 29, 2010, 07:50 AM	#3
mapsjanhere Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: Albuquerque Posts: 2,832	probably chambered for this cartridge, you can get the dies from Midway and the brass from Grafs. A picture of the proofmarks on the underside of the barrel would help to give more exact date of manufacture, but the crown B crown U on the action say Germany prior to 1939. __________________ I used to love being able to hit hard at 1000 yards. As I get older I find hitting a mini ram at 200 yards with the 22 oddly more satisfying.

October 29, 2010, 08:59 AM	#5
mapsjanhere Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: Albuquerque Posts: 2,832	Did you take the barrel out of the action? The stamps are usually at the root of the barrel, just in front of the part that engages the action. I looked at value, and you have two issues. You're missing the top claw mounts, that's $200 for anyone who wants to use it. The other is the cartridge. It's the old WWI era Dutch military caliber, long out of production, even in Europe with RWS, Norma and Lapua. Brass is $2 a pop, so despite this being a very nice German stalking rifle you'll find very few people who'd buy this to actually use it for hunting. Typically a Sauer like that would go for $1000 - $1500 at Gunbroker, with the two limitations I mentioned you'd be lucky to get the lower value. __________________ I used to love being able to hit hard at 1000 yards. As I get older I find hitting a mini ram at 200 yards with the 22 oddly more satisfying.

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October 28, 2010, 11:33 PM	#2
webhak Junior Member Join Date: November 5, 2002 Location: Nevada Posts: 5	Sorry about the large image size. I'm on the road and don't have access to my main computer to get these re-sized.

October 29, 2010, 08:46 AM	#4
webhak Junior Member Join Date: November 5, 2002 Location: Nevada Posts: 5	Thanks. I looked again and did not see any markings on the barrel. I did notice the number "473" stamped on the inside of the trigger guard.

October 29, 2010, 09:04 AM	#6
webhak Junior Member Join Date: November 5, 2002 Location: Nevada Posts: 5	Thanks. He may have some cartridges lying around that go with this one...or another German rifle/shotgun combo he used to have. I can't be sure as I was a kid when he bought these. It's too nice to shoot for me and will be a wall hanger if I have anything to say about it.

October 29, 2010, 12:45 PM	#7
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	I suspect your "--FF LAUFSTAHL" is actually "KRUPP LAUFSTAHL" (Krupp Barrel Steel). As noted, cases can be made from .303 British but (I think) also from .30-40 Krag cases. Jim

October 29, 2010, 02:10 PM	#8
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,528	Buffalo Arms has 6.5x53R Dutch brass reformed from .303 at $2.09 each but "only" $82 for 50 or $160 a hundred. http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,740.html Bertram brass with correct headstamp is more expensive but probably not worth the difference. I don't know about load data, 6.5x54 Mannlicher would be a place to start looking or maybe there is something on the www.

October 30, 2010, 02:02 AM	#9
sauerfan Member Join Date: October 10, 2008 Location: Germany Posts: 51	Hi webhak, what you have is Sauer & Sohn model "Tell" (more precisely: "Tell-Büchse" = Tell rifle). There were two variations; you have the better one with detachable barrel (the screw lever on the left). Turn it to the left for some revolutions and you can take the barrel off from the action. Please do so: as already mentioned, there you'll find (probably) more markings, like the proof date and so on. Are you sure about the calibre? Very unusual for a Tell. I liked to see a photo of the calibre markings. Regards Martin