to hot of a load?

hoyter · February 3, 2011, 07:47 PM

Hello, I am new to this site and fairly new to reloading. About a year ago I decided to start reloading for my .270 wsm. I read a lot and decided to use berger 140 grain vlds with 61 grains reloader 17 mag powder, remington brass and cci magnum primers. I am shooting a weatherby vanguard with a 28 inch barrel. Shooting right around 3100 fps. The load is very accurate and I have killed deer elk bear and antelope with it. The problem is that after shooting each brass just once they no longer fit properly back into the gun and the bolt becomes difficult to close. after unloading once and reloading into the gun again the brass has rings around it from rubbing when rotating with the bolt. There are no other signs of pressure. I have found very similar loads on both the reloader 17 web page as well as on other web pages with no reports of pressure. Also, I dropped the load from 61 grains to 59 grains and I still have the same problem. Any suggestions/thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.

flyboyjake · February 3, 2011, 08:27 PM

what kind of dies are you using? Are you neck sizing only? or full length sizing? If full length sizing, how are you setting up your die? How many times have you shot this brass? The issue sounds to me like your resizing setup is not resizing back to spec. need more info.

When a case is fired, the firing pressure expands the case both laterally and longitudinally, so in order for it to fit back in your without a slight jam, it will have to be resized to adjust headspace back to spec. I necksize most of mine, and its quite common to have to exert a bit more pressure to chamber them.

Doodlebugger45 · February 3, 2011, 08:37 PM

Hmmm... I had to go ponder over my notes about this one. The highest charge of RL-17 I ever used in my 270 WSM with Sierra 140 gr bullets is 59.0 gr. I have loaded between 56.0 and 59.0 with that powder and bullet using Federal cases and CCI std primers. I see in my notebook that I had written down that the max was 60.0 gr. But I see I had originally written down that max was 61.0 and I had marked through that and changed it to 60. I can't remember right now where I arrived at those numbers, probably from the Alliant site.

Regardless though, you got the problem even when you dropped down to 59.0 gr. I know RL-17 is fairly new stuff and a few guys have told me they got some unusual velocity readings when they started increasing their charges. It is odd that your just fired cases won't re-chamber. I'm not an expert, but maybe your chamber is a bit rough?

When you re-size the cases in a FL die, do they then chamber correctly?

I agree that the most obvious sign of overpressure is when you have a tough time lifting the bolt to extract the case. You don't have that, so it doesn't sound like too much pressure to me.

wncchester · February 3, 2011, 09:08 PM

From reading the post I don't know if you're having trouble re-chambering a just fired round or trouble chambering a reloaded round. If it's the latter, turn your size die down another 1/16th turn, no more or you will then have a sloppy fit.

hoyter · February 4, 2011, 08:46 AM

I am only re-sizing the neck of the cartridge, I guess I really didn't know that you could re-size the entire cartridge. Is this the problem?

Doodlebugger45 · February 4, 2011, 10:56 AM

AHHH!!
That explains it all pretty well now.

Yeah, run it through a FL sizer and see how that works. My preferred method especially on my WSMs is to do partial full length sizing. That resizes the body back to spec and only bumps the shoulder back about 0.002" or so to preserve brass life but still assure easy chambering.

flyboyjake · February 4, 2011, 04:53 PM

yes, if you are only neck sizing, it will be e tight fit in your chamber, and more so each time you fir it. I can only neck size 3 or 4 shots before I have to FL size it again. I have never seen a die kit that only came with a neck sizer, but if yours did, you will need to get a full length sizing die. Dont worry about the "partial full length sizing" yet until you get a grasp on all the variables involved in reloading. It can be like drinking through a fire hose, so dont overwhelm yourself. When FL sizing, you will also need to lubricate your cases.

Shoney · February 4, 2011, 05:03 PM

flyboyjake
You also need to measure the case length; and if they are over the max case length, trim them to minimum case length after sizing. If they are too long, they will bind the whole cartridge, because the mouth of the case will not go past the end of the chamber.

flyboyjake · February 4, 2011, 05:40 PM

I agree with this, however the majority of the case stretch in the neck occurs during the FL sizing process. Another testimate that you need to read the entire reloading section of a reputable book such as siera, LEE, or the like Hoyt. There are many many variables involved, especially when dealing with bottlenecked cases.

Clark · February 5, 2011, 02:41 AM

With a 22" 270 Win 130 gr I am getting 3200 fps with long brass life and Re17.

I would have bet money that was impossible.

Later I saw the velocity vs temp graph of Re17 vs Varget.
Varget is about 10X flatter.

February 3, 2011, 07:47 PM	#1
hoyter Junior Member Join Date: February 3, 2011 Posts: 2	to hot of a load? Hello, I am new to this site and fairly new to reloading. About a year ago I decided to start reloading for my .270 wsm. I read a lot and decided to use berger 140 grain vlds with 61 grains reloader 17 mag powder, remington brass and cci magnum primers. I am shooting a weatherby vanguard with a 28 inch barrel. Shooting right around 3100 fps. The load is very accurate and I have killed deer elk bear and antelope with it. The problem is that after shooting each brass just once they no longer fit properly back into the gun and the bolt becomes difficult to close. after unloading once and reloading into the gun again the brass has rings around it from rubbing when rotating with the bolt. There are no other signs of pressure. I have found very similar loads on both the reloader 17 web page as well as on other web pages with no reports of pressure. Also, I dropped the load from 61 grains to 59 grains and I still have the same problem. Any suggestions/thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.

February 3, 2011, 08:27 PM	#2
flyboyjake Senior Member Join Date: February 19, 2010 Posts: 135	what kind of dies are you using? Are you neck sizing only? or full length sizing? If full length sizing, how are you setting up your die? How many times have you shot this brass? The issue sounds to me like your resizing setup is not resizing back to spec. need more info. When a case is fired, the firing pressure expands the case both laterally and longitudinally, so in order for it to fit back in your without a slight jam, it will have to be resized to adjust headspace back to spec. I necksize most of mine, and its quite common to have to exert a bit more pressure to chamber them. Last edited by flyboyjake; February 3, 2011 at 08:31 PM. Reason: additional comment

February 4, 2011, 05:03 PM	#8
Shoney Senior Member Join Date: February 21, 2002 Location: Transplanted from Montana Posts: 2,311	flyboyjake You also need to measure the case length; and if they are over the max case length, trim them to minimum case length after sizing. If they are too long, they will bind the whole cartridge, because the mouth of the case will not go past the end of the chamber. __________________ I pledge allegiance to the Flag - - -, and to the Republic for which it stands….Our Forefathers were brilliant for giving us a Republic, not a democracy! Do you know the difference??? and WHY?http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissue...les.asp?id=111

February 3, 2011, 08:37 PM	#3
Doodlebugger45 Senior Member Join Date: April 15, 2009 Location: Wyoming Posts: 1,717	Hmmm... I had to go ponder over my notes about this one. The highest charge of RL-17 I ever used in my 270 WSM with Sierra 140 gr bullets is 59.0 gr. I have loaded between 56.0 and 59.0 with that powder and bullet using Federal cases and CCI std primers. I see in my notebook that I had written down that the max was 60.0 gr. But I see I had originally written down that max was 61.0 and I had marked through that and changed it to 60. I can't remember right now where I arrived at those numbers, probably from the Alliant site. Regardless though, you got the problem even when you dropped down to 59.0 gr. I know RL-17 is fairly new stuff and a few guys have told me they got some unusual velocity readings when they started increasing their charges. It is odd that your just fired cases won't re-chamber. I'm not an expert, but maybe your chamber is a bit rough? When you re-size the cases in a FL die, do they then chamber correctly? I agree that the most obvious sign of overpressure is when you have a tough time lifting the bolt to extract the case. You don't have that, so it doesn't sound like too much pressure to me.

February 3, 2011, 09:08 PM	#4
wncchester Senior Member Join Date: December 1, 2002 Posts: 2,832	From reading the post I don't know if you're having trouble re-chambering a just fired round or trouble chambering a reloaded round. If it's the latter, turn your size die down another 1/16th turn, no more or you will then have a sloppy fit.

February 4, 2011, 08:46 AM	#5
hoyter Junior Member Join Date: February 3, 2011 Posts: 2	I am only re-sizing the neck of the cartridge, I guess I really didn't know that you could re-size the entire cartridge. Is this the problem?

February 4, 2011, 10:56 AM	#6
Doodlebugger45 Senior Member Join Date: April 15, 2009 Location: Wyoming Posts: 1,717	AHHH!! That explains it all pretty well now. Yeah, run it through a FL sizer and see how that works. My preferred method especially on my WSMs is to do partial full length sizing. That resizes the body back to spec and only bumps the shoulder back about 0.002" or so to preserve brass life but still assure easy chambering.

February 4, 2011, 04:53 PM	#7
flyboyjake Senior Member Join Date: February 19, 2010 Posts: 135	yes, if you are only neck sizing, it will be e tight fit in your chamber, and more so each time you fir it. I can only neck size 3 or 4 shots before I have to FL size it again. I have never seen a die kit that only came with a neck sizer, but if yours did, you will need to get a full length sizing die. Dont worry about the "partial full length sizing" yet until you get a grasp on all the variables involved in reloading. It can be like drinking through a fire hose, so dont overwhelm yourself. When FL sizing, you will also need to lubricate your cases.

February 4, 2011, 05:40 PM	#9
flyboyjake Senior Member Join Date: February 19, 2010 Posts: 135	I agree with this, however the majority of the case stretch in the neck occurs during the FL sizing process. Another testimate that you need to read the entire reloading section of a reputable book such as siera, LEE, or the like Hoyt. There are many many variables involved, especially when dealing with bottlenecked cases.

February 5, 2011, 02:41 AM	#10
Clark Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 1999 Location: WA, the ever blue state Posts: 4,678	With a 22" 270 Win 130 gr I am getting 3200 fps with long brass life and Re17. I would have bet money that was impossible. Later I saw the velocity vs temp graph of Re17 vs Varget. Varget is about 10X flatter.