battlebargains shady dealer

UpandAtIt · March 13, 2010, 02:58 AM

I bid on and won a Hi-Standard Sport King from battlebargains.com via gunbroker.com.

Listing Text:

Up for bid is a vintage HI-STAND SPORT KING (First Model) semi-auto .22 LR pistol s.n. 406,xxx. First Models were manufactured 1950-1954,this variation is w/o last rd. hold open,and features takedown lever at front of trigger guard. Pistol barrel is approx. 6 3/4"lg. with brite bore/rifling. Overall condition is near very good with finish turning a patina tho right grip is cracked thru at screw. Comes with the shown 10 rd. magazine.---I accept only U.S. issued Postal money orders,cashier's checks,or most major credit cards. NO PERSONAL CHECKS or PAYPAL. Full payment to be received within 10 days after auction end.---Pkg./shpg. within Con. U.S. is $30.00(other states higher). Any insurance,etc. is buyer's option and extra.--- I DO NOT SHIP OUTSIDE of U.S.A. C. & R. ELIGIBLE. NO SHIPMENTS to a CALIFORNIA F.F.L.;although to a California C. & R. holder is OK.---It is the bidder's responsibility to know and abide by all federal/state/local laws and or ordinances before placing bids. DO NOT BID if you are not permitted to receive/have this item.---Questions? Email me at [email protected].---I'm only available to read/answer Emails from 11:00AM to 4:00PM Mon. thru Sat.---Check our other items on the website BattleBargains.com.
[Information added 2/24/2010 5:38:16 PM]
We are NOW set-up to ship to CALIFORNIA F.F.L. DEALERS!

Pictures from the listing:

The ad or listing described a decent first model with a cracked right grip, other wise finish was patina. The pictures were just out of focus enough to not show detail, but shows a decent pistol in a patina state, very slight notice of the bluing difference that I wrote off to bad lighting.

I paid for it using a Visa card and sent my C&R in.

I received the pistol, took it to my gunsmith for a look over and found the following issues: NOTE: I knew about the cracked grip, it was no real concern to me.

1. Pitting rust from the muzzle to about 1 1/2 inches from muzzle end back. Gunsmith stated at least a 30% loss in value.

2. Botched bluing job on the barrel, looks like Birchwood Casey's bluing paste was used and left on, it flakes off showing the rust in the pits. Another 15% loss in value

3. The slide fitting number does not match the frame serial number. Another 20% loss in value (this is really important to HS collectors that they match)

4. Magazine is not the orig as shown in the ad/listing, it is a cheap triple -K knockoff. a new USED HS mag will cost me about $45

5. Peened over chamber from dry firing. Gunsmithing charge of $80 to polish and lap the chamber. also a 10% loss in value

6. Overcharged S&H. Charged $30, expected overnight delivery via UPS or FedEx. It was delivered via USPO Bulk Rate Medium Box. a loss to me of at least $18.

Overall approx loss in value due to condition is 60-75%, the gunsmith said a gunshow condition of this pistol would be about 40-50% at best. This also includes the cracked grip that I 110% knew about and bought ahead of time a set of grips from Vintage Gun Grips ($37).

Picture of the barrel pitting

Actions I took:

1. Sent email with no answer to any of the three email addresses he had given to gunbroker and on the sales receipt. I come to find out none of his emails work and is using a friends email. I also found out the main store is a hardware store with a junk store / odds n ends store at the same address that has an FFL.

The three names are:

sharpsburgarmory - email does not work
battlebargains -email does not work
collector corner - email does not work

and the Hardeware store is
Shawleys Hardware Inc. and their FFL is assigned in that name & address.

2. Called with the complaints and faxed a copy of the gunsmiths report. The owner, Bill, just kind of laughed and asked me what I want to do about all of it. I told him either a full refund or at least a discount for all the damages and pay for restoration. He laughed again and stated it was accurately described. I asked about the pitting rust, he states there was none, even though I show him very close up and detailed pictures of it. I asked about the slide to frame number mismatch and he said that must of been a factory mix up, the magazine is clearly not the one pictured in the listing and he said that one broke so he replaced it with the triple K. He basically states he will not do anything about it.

3. I sent a snail mail letter to include all of the proof. Still no answer from them.

4. I started proceedings for a credit card charge back and finally got a partial charge back credit of $125.00 off of a $255 total purchase. I had to send them the copy of the listing, copies of proof of the gunsmith report as well as pictures.

5. Left negative feedback for battlebargains on gunbroker.

He is now screaming FOUL since I did the charge back and he lost money.

In the end, I have found out that gunbroker.com truly does not offer any real protections except for feed back ratings, they state buyer beware, even though I did it right. I checked his feedback, looked good, checked other listings, looked good. In basics I was hoodwinked. Gunbroker does not allow customer service to get involved with description Vs. reality issues so that email was rejected and closed the same day.

I will add pictures as soon as I get em uploaded to the hosting server.

Noskov · March 14, 2010, 05:41 AM

Sorry to hear about the bad deal. A couple people I know had similar experiences on gunbroker as well as auctionarms and gunsamerica. I don't believe there is any firearm auction site that is immune to such things. My buddies didn't get much help from the auction sites themselves because they can't really do much.

I myself got duped on gunbroker over a Masuer 98K that was missing some metal but the seller cleverly took pictures in angles so it looked like everything was there but really wasn't.

Anyway the feedback system on gunbroker isn't any form of protection at all. It can be abused because some sellers won't post positive feedback until they get positive feedback first. A lot of new buyers tend to get intimidated by the negative feedback if they have say...only 12 or 30 feedback versus the seller with 700+ or more.

You did everything right, about the same as me. I too check the feedback and their other listings if they have any. I also ask a fair amount of questions regarding things internally or stuff I can see in the pictures they state or don't state. If they only have 1 or 2 pictures I usually ask for more to verify now after my Mauser rip-off. If they do a single word or short reply that sounds like they don't care, I move on and disregard that auction and don't bid.

March 13, 2010, 02:58 AM	#1
UpandAtIt Junior member Join Date: February 14, 2010 Posts: 233	battlebargains shady dealer I bid on and won a Hi-Standard Sport King from battlebargains.com via gunbroker.com. Listing Text: Up for bid is a vintage HI-STAND SPORT KING (First Model) semi-auto .22 LR pistol s.n. 406,xxx. First Models were manufactured 1950-1954,this variation is w/o last rd. hold open,and features takedown lever at front of trigger guard. Pistol barrel is approx. 6 3/4"lg. with brite bore/rifling. Overall condition is near very good with finish turning a patina tho right grip is cracked thru at screw. Comes with the shown 10 rd. magazine.---I accept only U.S. issued Postal money orders,cashier's checks,or most major credit cards. NO PERSONAL CHECKS or PAYPAL. Full payment to be received within 10 days after auction end.---Pkg./shpg. within Con. U.S. is $30.00(other states higher). Any insurance,etc. is buyer's option and extra.--- I DO NOT SHIP OUTSIDE of U.S.A. C. & R. ELIGIBLE. NO SHIPMENTS to a CALIFORNIA F.F.L.;although to a California C. & R. holder is OK.---It is the bidder's responsibility to know and abide by all federal/state/local laws and or ordinances before placing bids. DO NOT BID if you are not permitted to receive/have this item.---Questions? Email me at [email protected].---I'm only available to read/answer Emails from 11:00AM to 4:00PM Mon. thru Sat.---Check our other items on the website BattleBargains.com. [Information added 2/24/2010 5:38:16 PM] We are NOW set-up to ship to CALIFORNIA F.F.L. DEALERS! Pictures from the listing: The ad or listing described a decent first model with a cracked right grip, other wise finish was patina. The pictures were just out of focus enough to not show detail, but shows a decent pistol in a patina state, very slight notice of the bluing difference that I wrote off to bad lighting. I paid for it using a Visa card and sent my C&R in. I received the pistol, took it to my gunsmith for a look over and found the following issues: NOTE: I knew about the cracked grip, it was no real concern to me. 1. Pitting rust from the muzzle to about 1 1/2 inches from muzzle end back. Gunsmith stated at least a 30% loss in value. 2. Botched bluing job on the barrel, looks like Birchwood Casey's bluing paste was used and left on, it flakes off showing the rust in the pits. Another 15% loss in value 3. The slide fitting number does not match the frame serial number. Another 20% loss in value (this is really important to HS collectors that they match) 4. Magazine is not the orig as shown in the ad/listing, it is a cheap triple -K knockoff. a new USED HS mag will cost me about $45 5. Peened over chamber from dry firing. Gunsmithing charge of $80 to polish and lap the chamber. also a 10% loss in value 6. Overcharged S&H. Charged $30, expected overnight delivery via UPS or FedEx. It was delivered via USPO Bulk Rate Medium Box. a loss to me of at least $18. Overall approx loss in value due to condition is 60-75%, the gunsmith said a gunshow condition of this pistol would be about 40-50% at best. This also includes the cracked grip that I 110% knew about and bought ahead of time a set of grips from Vintage Gun Grips ($37). Picture of the barrel pitting Actions I took: 1. Sent email with no answer to any of the three email addresses he had given to gunbroker and on the sales receipt. I come to find out none of his emails work and is using a friends email. I also found out the main store is a hardware store with a junk store / odds n ends store at the same address that has an FFL. The three names are: sharpsburgarmory - email does not work battlebargains -email does not work collector corner - email does not work and the Hardeware store is Shawleys Hardware Inc. and their FFL is assigned in that name & address. 2. Called with the complaints and faxed a copy of the gunsmiths report. The owner, Bill, just kind of laughed and asked me what I want to do about all of it. I told him either a full refund or at least a discount for all the damages and pay for restoration. He laughed again and stated it was accurately described. I asked about the pitting rust, he states there was none, even though I show him very close up and detailed pictures of it. I asked about the slide to frame number mismatch and he said that must of been a factory mix up, the magazine is clearly not the one pictured in the listing and he said that one broke so he replaced it with the triple K. He basically states he will not do anything about it. 3. I sent a snail mail letter to include all of the proof. Still no answer from them. 4. I started proceedings for a credit card charge back and finally got a partial charge back credit of $125.00 off of a $255 total purchase. I had to send them the copy of the listing, copies of proof of the gunsmith report as well as pictures. 5. Left negative feedback for battlebargains on gunbroker. He is now screaming FOUL since I did the charge back and he lost money. In the end, I have found out that gunbroker.com truly does not offer any real protections except for feed back ratings, they state buyer beware, even though I did it right. I checked his feedback, looked good, checked other listings, looked good. In basics I was hoodwinked. Gunbroker does not allow customer service to get involved with description Vs. reality issues so that email was rejected and closed the same day. I will add pictures as soon as I get em uploaded to the hosting server. Last edited by UpandAtIt; March 13, 2010 at 03:14 AM.

March 14, 2010, 05:41 AM	#2
Noskov Member Join Date: September 29, 2008 Posts: 38	Sorry to hear about the bad deal. A couple people I know had similar experiences on gunbroker as well as auctionarms and gunsamerica. I don't believe there is any firearm auction site that is immune to such things. My buddies didn't get much help from the auction sites themselves because they can't really do much. I myself got duped on gunbroker over a Masuer 98K that was missing some metal but the seller cleverly took pictures in angles so it looked like everything was there but really wasn't. Anyway the feedback system on gunbroker isn't any form of protection at all. It can be abused because some sellers won't post positive feedback until they get positive feedback first. A lot of new buyers tend to get intimidated by the negative feedback if they have say...only 12 or 30 feedback versus the seller with 700+ or more. You did everything right, about the same as me. I too check the feedback and their other listings if they have any. I also ask a fair amount of questions regarding things internally or stuff I can see in the pictures they state or don't state. If they only have 1 or 2 pictures I usually ask for more to verify now after my Mauser rip-off. If they do a single word or short reply that sounds like they don't care, I move on and disregard that auction and don't bid.