another 1911

Spydie Man · March 2, 2002, 11:48 PM

1911 A1 U.S. ARMY on the right side of the slide and colt with patent dates ranging from 1897 to 1913 the parkerization is a little darker for about the first two inches from the muzzle.

The frame seems different though It is blued not parkerized trigger and hammer are blued as well as the grip saftey and mainspring housing which has no lanyard loop and is flat unlike the A1 I realize that this is an old firearm and could have been modified before I ever saw it .

The serial number seems a little odd there is no makers name and the number is almost like an italics script the number is 59-- only four digits the only other markings I have found were the number 60 stamped on the trigger guard on the right side on the other side there is an X stamped on the trigger guard and below that is a tri-angle with the letters VP inside of the tri-angle.

With the slide off to the right of the disconnector appears to be the letter R it is a little faint .

Any help in identifing this frame and its possible Value would be greatley appreciated before I go and cut it for a bevartail grip-saftey . I would hate to destroy something that had some type of value and could be restored. To me it would be like sending an old classic to a demolition derby.

I Intend to pass this down to one of my sons.

James K · March 3, 2002, 12:32 AM

Hi, Spydie Man,

Some pictures would help, but I am going to stick my neck out a bit on this one as it is sight unseen. You have a Colt-made replacement slide on a Colt commercial frame. The frame could be a Super .38 or a Colt Ace frame (neither had a letter prefix/suffix, and both used Italic looking numbers), or possibly a renumbered Argentine contract frame. Assuming that the lanyard loop was never present, the flat mainspring housing is also commercial; it may be from an older Colt or may be a modern part as many shooters prefer the flat housing and they are being made.

If the gun is reasonably accurate and reliable, it should serve you well. Unfortunately, it has no collector value, and is worth only around $300 retail.

I might note that if the frame is a Colt Ace frame, a collector might be interested. If anyone is, I trust they will contact you direct.

HTH

Jim

Spydie Man · March 3, 2002, 10:31 AM

Here's a picture guys. She's not pretty but she sure does shoot well. Can anyone tell me what the "VP" is in the triangle on the trigger guard? I've seen it on other Colts.

Spydie Man · March 3, 2002, 10:36 AM

An additional note: upon further study of this pistol, I've discovered the ejector protrudes beyond the frame and slide which leads me to believe this may not be the original ejector. This pistol is currently in .45 configuration.

Spydie Man · March 19, 2002, 10:57 PM

I have looked at some websites that list sereial numbers and they seem to conflict.

One site says that it is a colt ace that has been converted to 45A.P.C. and another site says it is a pistol built for the navy in .45 ??????

I realize that what ever it is , it is old and would like to restore it to original condition in order to pass down to my sons. The problem now is finding out exactley what caliber it was and when it was made in order to find the proper slide , barrel and ejecter.

Any further help would be greatley appreciated.

Also..... Can anyone tell me what the letters VP in the triangle on the left side of the triggerguard signify? I have seen this on other colts both military and commercial. but only on colts. Is this the proof mark for colt ? On the other side of the trigger guard is the number 60 dose anyone have any idea what that represents?

Thanks

BADSBSNF81 · March 19, 2002, 11:35 PM

Have you been over to 1911forum.com?

BADSBSNF81 · March 19, 2002, 11:39 PM

The VP in a triangle is a colt marking.

Spydie Man · March 19, 2002, 11:46 PM

Yes I have. However I havent Put all of this stuff up. Just checked sereial numbers.

Johnny Guest · March 26, 2002, 04:18 PM

- - - until you do more checking and get some definitive answers.

It is definitely a 1911-A1 frame, and the VP mark is definitely a Colt proof mark. I don't think any 1911s were made especially for the Navy. All the Colt .45s made for commercial market had a C- prefix or suffix, depending on the vintage. I believe all those with C as suffix were much higher numbers.

I'm probably mistaken, but I want to say that all the Colt commercial Automatics had the C serial number. I only own two non-.45 Colt autos. One, a .22 has the C. Don't recall about the .380.

I kind of like Jim Keenan's idea that it might be a Super .38 frame. I haven't owned a Super in many years.

You mention "the ejector protrudes beyond the frame and slide." I don't see this in either side view. Perhaps I don't understand what you mean.

Sorry I don't have any reference material here at the office . . . .

Best,
Johnny

March 2, 2002, 11:48 PM	#1
Spydie Man Junior Member Join Date: March 2, 2002 Location: N.W. Ohio Posts: 14	another 1911 1911 A1 U.S. ARMY on the right side of the slide and colt with patent dates ranging from 1897 to 1913 the parkerization is a little darker for about the first two inches from the muzzle. The frame seems different though It is blued not parkerized trigger and hammer are blued as well as the grip saftey and mainspring housing which has no lanyard loop and is flat unlike the A1 I realize that this is an old firearm and could have been modified before I ever saw it . The serial number seems a little odd there is no makers name and the number is almost like an italics script the number is 59-- only four digits the only other markings I have found were the number 60 stamped on the trigger guard on the right side on the other side there is an X stamped on the trigger guard and below that is a tri-angle with the letters VP inside of the tri-angle. With the slide off to the right of the disconnector appears to be the letter R it is a little faint . Any help in identifing this frame and its possible Value would be greatley appreciated before I go and cut it for a bevartail grip-saftey . I would hate to destroy something that had some type of value and could be restored. To me it would be like sending an old classic to a demolition derby. I Intend to pass this down to one of my sons. __________________ If you dont stand for something you will fall for anything

March 19, 2002, 10:57 PM	#5
Spydie Man Junior Member Join Date: March 2, 2002 Location: N.W. Ohio Posts: 14	Still looking for some kind of clarification I have looked at some websites that list sereial numbers and they seem to conflict. One site says that it is a colt ace that has been converted to 45A.P.C. and another site says it is a pistol built for the navy in .45 ?????? I realize that what ever it is , it is old and would like to restore it to original condition in order to pass down to my sons. The problem now is finding out exactley what caliber it was and when it was made in order to find the proper slide , barrel and ejecter. Any further help would be greatley appreciated. Also..... Can anyone tell me what the letters VP in the triangle on the left side of the triggerguard signify? I have seen this on other colts both military and commercial. but only on colts. Is this the proof mark for colt ? On the other side of the trigger guard is the number 60 dose anyone have any idea what that represents? Thanks __________________ If you dont stand for something you will fall for anything

March 19, 2002, 11:35 PM	#6
BADSBSNF81 Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2001 Posts: 386	Have you been over to 1911forum.com? __________________ All stations stand by for flash traffic...

March 19, 2002, 11:39 PM	#7
BADSBSNF81 Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2001 Posts: 386	The VP in a triangle is a colt marking. __________________ All stations stand by for flash traffic...

March 19, 2002, 11:46 PM	#8
Spydie Man Junior Member Join Date: March 2, 2002 Location: N.W. Ohio Posts: 14	Yes I have. However I havent Put all of this stuff up. Just checked sereial numbers. __________________ If you dont stand for something you will fall for anything

March 3, 2002, 12:32 AM	#2
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Hi, Spydie Man, Some pictures would help, but I am going to stick my neck out a bit on this one as it is sight unseen. You have a Colt-made replacement slide on a Colt commercial frame. The frame could be a Super .38 or a Colt Ace frame (neither had a letter prefix/suffix, and both used Italic looking numbers), or possibly a renumbered Argentine contract frame. Assuming that the lanyard loop was never present, the flat mainspring housing is also commercial; it may be from an older Colt or may be a modern part as many shooters prefer the flat housing and they are being made. If the gun is reasonably accurate and reliable, it should serve you well. Unfortunately, it has no collector value, and is worth only around $300 retail. I might note that if the frame is a Colt Ace frame, a collector might be interested. If anyone is, I trust they will contact you direct. HTH Jim

March 26, 2002, 04:18 PM	#9
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	I'd be reluctant to cut on that frame - - - - - - until you do more checking and get some definitive answers. It is definitely a 1911-A1 frame, and the VP mark is definitely a Colt proof mark. I don't think any 1911s were made especially for the Navy. All the Colt .45s made for commercial market had a C- prefix or suffix, depending on the vintage. I believe all those with C as suffix were much higher numbers. I'm probably mistaken, but I want to say that all the Colt commercial Automatics had the C serial number. I only own two non-.45 Colt autos. One, a .22 has the C. Don't recall about the .380. I kind of like Jim Keenan's idea that it might be a Super .38 frame. I haven't owned a Super in many years. You mention "the ejector protrudes beyond the frame and slide." I don't see this in either side view. Perhaps I don't understand what you mean. Sorry I don't have any reference material here at the office . . . . Best, Johnny