Utah County men charged in poaching 18 deer

younggun20 · May 13, 2009, 03:09 PM

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=6478145

SPRINGVILLE, Utah (AP) -- Four Utah County men are facing 14 felony counts in the poaching of 18 mule deer in Juab County.

State officials say it's one of the largest poaching cases in recent years. DWR conservation officer Jay Topham says they were first alerted to this poaching problem when sportsmen started finding the deer carcasses.

A two year investigation led the DWR to the home of Rex Powell in Utah County. There they found sets of antlers throughout the home.

The Utah Division of Wildlife Resources on Wednesday displayed 18 sets of antlers taken after a search warrant was served. Seven of the antlers are considered trophy-size under state law.

Three of the men are each charged with multiple third-degree felony counts of wanton destruction of protected wildlife. A fourth man faces one count.

The restitution value of each of the trophy-size antlers is $8,000 apiece.

They say at least 15 of the antlers come from deer poached in the Vernon hunting area in Juab County, an area that is limited to hunters so the bucks can grown into trophy deer.

davlandrum · May 13, 2009, 03:52 PM

Thanks for sharing.

I will probably add this to my resources for Hunter Safety class.

Dave

hogdogs · May 13, 2009, 04:21 PM

Quote:

They say at least 15 of the antlers come from deer poached in the Vernon hunting area in Juab County, an area that is limited to hunters so the bucks can grown into trophy deer.

While I am all for the prosecution of trophy poachers, I am confused... Why prevent hunting to grow trophy size deer if they can't be bagged as trophy deer? Trophy is for hunters...
Brent

younggun20 · May 13, 2009, 04:32 PM

"an area that is limited to hunters so the bucks can grown into trophy deer."

Only so many tags are handed out. They are bagged, just not all in one season

hogdogs · May 13, 2009, 04:39 PM

gotcha

Brent

johnwilliamson062 · May 13, 2009, 05:36 PM

so these guys were trophy poaching for a personal collection?
I could understand(not condone) poaching for food or for profit, but to poach for a personal collection that you couldn't show anyone?

teeroux · May 13, 2009, 05:45 PM

How do they prove said antlers came from poached deer?

I find it hard to belive they used DNA testing before serving a warrant so where did they get their lead?

Are they on film, witnesses, snitch?

Having antlers and trophies doesn't make you a poacher where and what is the actual evidence?

hogdogs · May 13, 2009, 05:55 PM

You would be surprised at the stupidity and loose lips of poachers... I am one who feels game laws are out the window when food is needed but a rack don't roast fer nuttin'. I see poaching for money the same as selling dope or smugglin' illegal mexicans across the border for a fee.
Brent

Csspecs · May 13, 2009, 06:13 PM

EVERYONE can understand a person poaching for food. It makes sense, no one is really hurt by it and they can eat for free.

This is the kind of thing that I like reading, when they really get the book thrown at them for poaching and leaving the whole deer minus rack to rot.

Hope they get a good boyfriend in jail

do you serve jail time for a third-degree felony? I hope so.

teeroux · May 13, 2009, 06:56 PM

I mean if they are poachers by all means throw the book at them. Its just that the news story is awfully vague.

davlandrum · May 13, 2009, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Its just that the news story is awfully vague.

I think it is because they are just starting the prosecution. It says the investigation took 2 years, so I bet there is plenty of evidence before the charges were filed.

Just a guess...

treg · May 13, 2009, 09:26 PM

There is a spot near here where there were 22 carcasses dumped in a 1/8 mile stretch of road over the winter. Most looked to be quickly skinned for the largest cuts of meat - rear quarters and backstraps. 2 yrs ago there were 15 (IIRC) carcasses in the same stretch.

A_McDougal · May 14, 2009, 08:06 AM

Is poaching considered a violent crime with a firearm?
If guilty, I'd like to see them punished, but I wouldn't want to see them get the mandatory extra sentencing while worse criminals get released early.

FrankenMauser · May 14, 2009, 10:47 AM

Quote:

How do they prove said antlers came from poached deer?

I find it hard to belive they used DNA testing before serving a warrant so where did they get their lead?

Are they on film, witnesses, snitch?

Having antlers and trophies doesn't make you a poacher where and what is the actual evidence?

The DWR here won't make an arrest without a witness or confession. So, there's something they're not saying.

However, as for the poaching charges...
In the state of Utah, you must retain your tag with the largest portion of meat until it is consumed. If the animal was a male, the tag must then be permanently attached to the antlers/horns. Having no tag, and no meat equates to a poached animal.

The same goes for shed antlers that are attached to a skull. When a shed hunter finds a skull with antlers intact, it is considered poaching to remove the item from the location before a game warden can inspect the animal and site. Once given the clear, a certificate is given to the shed hunter to show that the skull was legally recovered. (So it doesn't look like a poaching violation if the thing shows up on a trophy wall.)

Crankylove · May 14, 2009, 08:58 PM

This is the second big poaching scandal we have had here in the last few years. In the last one the poacher killed 13 does and fawns out of season..............to see if his gun was sighted in. :barf:

If caught poaching, you can lose your vehicle, your firearm, your freedom, get slapped with some pretty hefty fines, and lose your hunting privilages anywhere from one year.......to life.

And as the article stated, shooting a "trohpy" quality animal as defined by the state, severly increases the penalties.

Gbro · May 15, 2009, 07:53 AM

Quote:

I find it hard to believe they used DNA testing

There are many wildlife cases prosecuted from DNA matches.

Quote:

The DWR here won't make an arrest without a witness or confession.

On a small violation I would agree, but with a huge case like this and the possible recovery of trophy fines.

DNA, and I would surmise evidence from taxidermy services, this could go to court without a confession. However my gut tell me one of the dependents is getting some reduced charges for a reason.

Quote:

A fourth man faces one count.

I am glad they are caught. This gang is just another bunch of thieves!

cornbush · May 15, 2009, 05:10 PM

I work with one of the guys who was part of the 13 does getting killed. He got caught because like most people he couldn't keep his mouth shut. Given enough rope most people will hang themselves. The ironic part is his dad works extensively with the fish and game here in Utah, and is a board member for the Rocky Mountain Wild Sheep foundation. Unfortunately they could never find the rifle used to poach the animals so they couldn't get the conviction they wanted, but the jury stuck with most of them and he ended up with some severe fines and loss of hunting priveledges for atleast five years, might be more, can't remember. I think it ended up costing him about 25,000 bucks plus his attorney, not enough in my opinion. They killed the deer and left them to rot, I have no sympathy for him or his buddy who helped.

A_Gamehog · May 18, 2009, 01:55 PM

After working with criminals for years, that's "all they got caught doing".

Some are smarter and have done far worse and never got caught. it's just a sign of our times. Guides can green score a Bull Elk on the hoof and charge $$ accordingly. Too much emphasis on the finished "product" instead of just going hunting anymore. Magazine writers have contributed to this mess as equals. The average Joe who reads these rags thinks he can just show up and get a trophy rack. Here's one for you, how many Boone and Crocket animals were taken with Night Vison Scopes? Game Wardens deserve our respect and help.

Most of these arrests are made after an anomyous tip from a Taxidermist.

just my 2 cents...

Double Naught Spy · May 18, 2009, 02:58 PM

Quote:

I find it hard to believe they used DNA testing

Quote:

There are many wildlife cases prosecuted from DNA matches.

I don't think the query was about the usefulness or validity of DNA for prosecution. Instead, I think what was being asked was what was DNA tested before the warrant was issued?. If they had not confiscated materials, then what could they test?

dipper · May 18, 2009, 03:26 PM

Quote:

. I am one who feels game laws are out the window when food is needed but a rack don't roast fer nuttin'.

Quote:

EVERYONE can understand a person poaching for food. It makes sense, no one is really hurt by it and they can eat for free.

Well, that all depends on the situation.
Some people use the woods and wild game like a grocery store.
Some poachers have money but instead of using it to feed their families, they either sit in a bar room and drink it up, gamble it away, or spend it on nice toys like ATVs, trucks and motorcycles....whatever.

Then use the excuse, " I am just trying to feed my family"......BS.

For the record, when I caught someone who I knew TRULY needed the food, I let them go at risk to myself.
Like the guy that had 12 kids and worked 2 jobs and never took a penny of welfare, I let HIM go.
Others, who used the "feeding family" excuse got the book thrown at them....when they had the nicest toys and such.

I have no time for poachers and " game hogs".

davlandrum · May 18, 2009, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Magazine writers

Magazine writers, some maybe. I personally would stack more of the "Trophy" mentality on the TV shows.

I watched a elk hunt (Saskatchawan ?) for the full 1/2 hour of the show, and did not figure out it was a high fence operation until I looked at the "outfitter's" website...:barf:

hogdogs · May 18, 2009, 04:45 PM

dipper, I reckon I would get the "pass"... Using a cheap gun with cheap ammo to take a little doe and haul her in the trunk of a 220k mile 15 year old car...

No 4 wheeler and no bars or gambling, but I am guilty of tippin' a cheap beer!
Brent

dipper · May 18, 2009, 07:21 PM

Darn Brent, I am sure I wouldn't even see you in the woods!!

I probably couldn't catch you anyway with my old car.
19 years old and 240K on her.

Gbro · May 18, 2009, 07:54 PM

Quote:

don't think the query was about the usefulness or validity of DNA for prosecution. Instead, I think what was being asked was what was DNA tested before the warrant was issued?. If they had not confiscated materials, then what could they test?

Your Bodine is showing.
A visit to the taxidermy shop for scraps(garbage can) to match DNA from a carcass found on a shooting preserve, How is that hard to understand

.

cornbush · May 18, 2009, 08:54 PM

Utah does use DNA testing. They will take samples of carcasses, and if they can match them to evidence during an investigation it kind of seals the deal. They have a pretty good anti-poaching program set up, they use rewards and "reward tags"to entice people to report poaching or suspected poaching. I know a couple fish cops around here and quite a few cases start with a tip from someone who only suspects poaching and they do a little poking around and people usually open their mouth a little more than they think and get caught. I have no sympathy for poachers other than in the most extreme cases, there are organizations to help if you're in need of food. "I had to feed the family" doesn't carry the weight it used to. Poachers cost us all millions in court and investigation costs as well as the cost to take care of them if they get what they deserve and get to stay in the steel hilton. Not all rules are made to be broken.

May 13, 2009, 03:09 PM	#1
younggun20 Member Join Date: February 26, 2009 Posts: 33	Utah County men charged in poaching 18 deer http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=6478145 SPRINGVILLE, Utah (AP) -- Four Utah County men are facing 14 felony counts in the poaching of 18 mule deer in Juab County. State officials say it's one of the largest poaching cases in recent years. DWR conservation officer Jay Topham says they were first alerted to this poaching problem when sportsmen started finding the deer carcasses. A two year investigation led the DWR to the home of Rex Powell in Utah County. There they found sets of antlers throughout the home. The Utah Division of Wildlife Resources on Wednesday displayed 18 sets of antlers taken after a search warrant was served. Seven of the antlers are considered trophy-size under state law. Three of the men are each charged with multiple third-degree felony counts of wanton destruction of protected wildlife. A fourth man faces one count. The restitution value of each of the trophy-size antlers is $8,000 apiece. They say at least 15 of the antlers come from deer poached in the Vernon hunting area in Juab County, an area that is limited to hunters so the bucks can grown into trophy deer.

May 13, 2009, 03:52 PM	#2
davlandrum Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2006 Location: Lane County Oregon Posts: 2,547	Thanks for sharing. I will probably add this to my resources for Hunter Safety class. Dave __________________ U.S Army, Retired Ethics is knowing the difference between what you have a right to do and what is right to do. -Potter Stewart

May 13, 2009, 04:32 PM	#4
younggun20 Member Join Date: February 26, 2009 Posts: 33	Area limited to hunters "an area that is limited to hunters so the bucks can grown into trophy deer." Only so many tags are handed out. They are bagged, just not all in one season

May 13, 2009, 09:26 PM	#12
treg Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2006 Posts: 1,102	There is a spot near here where there were 22 carcasses dumped in a 1/8 mile stretch of road over the winter. Most looked to be quickly skinned for the largest cuts of meat - rear quarters and backstraps. 2 yrs ago there were 15 (IIRC) carcasses in the same stretch. __________________ .44 Special: For those who get it, no explanation is necessary. For those who don't, no explanation is possible.

May 14, 2009, 08:58 PM	#15
Crankylove Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2008 Location: 8B ID Posts: 1,753	This is the second big poaching scandal we have had here in the last few years. In the last one the poacher killed 13 does and fawns out of season..............to see if his gun was sighted in. :barf: If caught poaching, you can lose your vehicle, your firearm, your freedom, get slapped with some pretty hefty fines, and lose your hunting privilages anywhere from one year.......to life. And as the article stated, shooting a "trohpy" quality animal as defined by the state, severly increases the penalties. __________________ The answer to 1984 is 1776

May 13, 2009, 04:39 PM	#5
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	gotcha Brent

May 13, 2009, 05:36 PM	#6
johnwilliamson062 Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 9,995	so these guys were trophy poaching for a personal collection? I could understand(not condone) poaching for food or for profit, but to poach for a personal collection that you couldn't show anyone?

May 13, 2009, 05:45 PM	#7
teeroux Senior Member Join Date: December 12, 2006 Posts: 1,512	How do they prove said antlers came from poached deer? I find it hard to belive they used DNA testing before serving a warrant so where did they get their lead? Are they on film, witnesses, snitch? Having antlers and trophies doesn't make you a poacher where and what is the actual evidence?

May 13, 2009, 05:55 PM	#8
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	You would be surprised at the stupidity and loose lips of poachers... I am one who feels game laws are out the window when food is needed but a rack don't roast fer nuttin'. I see poaching for money the same as selling dope or smugglin' illegal mexicans across the border for a fee. Brent

May 13, 2009, 06:13 PM	#9
Csspecs Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2005 Posts: 1,111	EVERYONE can understand a person poaching for food. It makes sense, no one is really hurt by it and they can eat for free. This is the kind of thing that I like reading, when they really get the book thrown at them for poaching and leaving the whole deer minus rack to rot. Hope they get a good boyfriend in jail do you serve jail time for a third-degree felony? I hope so.

May 13, 2009, 06:56 PM	#10
teeroux Senior Member Join Date: December 12, 2006 Posts: 1,512	I mean if they are poachers by all means throw the book at them. Its just that the news story is awfully vague.

May 14, 2009, 08:06 AM	#13
A_McDougal Member Join Date: May 1, 2009 Posts: 48	Is poaching considered a violent crime with a firearm? If guilty, I'd like to see them punished, but I wouldn't want to see them get the mandatory extra sentencing while worse criminals get released early.

May 15, 2009, 05:10 PM	#17
cornbush Senior Member Join Date: September 29, 2008 Location: The retarded place below Idaho Posts: 1,408	I work with one of the guys who was part of the 13 does getting killed. He got caught because like most people he couldn't keep his mouth shut. Given enough rope most people will hang themselves. The ironic part is his dad works extensively with the fish and game here in Utah, and is a board member for the Rocky Mountain Wild Sheep foundation. Unfortunately they could never find the rifle used to poach the animals so they couldn't get the conviction they wanted, but the jury stuck with most of them and he ended up with some severe fines and loss of hunting priveledges for atleast five years, might be more, can't remember. I think it ended up costing him about 25,000 bucks plus his attorney, not enough in my opinion. They killed the deer and left them to rot, I have no sympathy for him or his buddy who helped. Last edited by cornbush; May 15, 2009 at 07:08 PM.

May 18, 2009, 01:55 PM	#18
A_Gamehog Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2009 Location: Central Oregun Posts: 563	One fact was left out, After working with criminals for years, that's "all they got caught doing". Some are smarter and have done far worse and never got caught. it's just a sign of our times. Guides can green score a Bull Elk on the hoof and charge $$ accordingly. Too much emphasis on the finished "product" instead of just going hunting anymore. Magazine writers have contributed to this mess as equals. The average Joe who reads these rags thinks he can just show up and get a trophy rack. Here's one for you, how many Boone and Crocket animals were taken with Night Vison Scopes? Game Wardens deserve our respect and help. Most of these arrests are made after an anomyous tip from a Taxidermist. just my 2 cents... __________________ "Happiness is knowing the Barred Owl is Eating the Spotted Owl and environmentalists are watching Nature take it's course"

May 18, 2009, 04:45 PM	#22
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	dipper, I reckon I would get the "pass"... Using a cheap gun with cheap ammo to take a little doe and haul her in the trunk of a 220k mile 15 year old car... No 4 wheeler and no bars or gambling, but I am guilty of tippin' a cheap beer! Brent

May 18, 2009, 07:21 PM	#23
dipper Senior Member Join Date: April 6, 2008 Posts: 895	Darn Brent, I am sure I wouldn't even see you in the woods!! I probably couldn't catch you anyway with my old car. 19 years old and 240K on her. __________________ --------------------------------------------------------- "It is better to die on your feet than live on your knees" EMILIANO ZAPATA SALAZAR

May 18, 2009, 08:54 PM	#25
cornbush Senior Member Join Date: September 29, 2008 Location: The retarded place below Idaho Posts: 1,408	Utah does use DNA testing. They will take samples of carcasses, and if they can match them to evidence during an investigation it kind of seals the deal. They have a pretty good anti-poaching program set up, they use rewards and "reward tags"to entice people to report poaching or suspected poaching. I know a couple fish cops around here and quite a few cases start with a tip from someone who only suspects poaching and they do a little poking around and people usually open their mouth a little more than they think and get caught. I have no sympathy for poachers other than in the most extreme cases, there are organizations to help if you're in need of food. "I had to feed the family" doesn't carry the weight it used to. Poachers cost us all millions in court and investigation costs as well as the cost to take care of them if they get what they deserve and get to stay in the steel hilton. Not all rules are made to be broken.