I swear....

Doc Hoy · April 21, 2012, 03:47 AM

....I am going to find the winning bidder on this auction and go into business selling him junk pistol parts.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/110861796163...84.m1423.l2649

Bill Akins · April 21, 2012, 05:23 AM

Gosh you're right Doc. He could have had a complete brasser for that price instead of just a frame.

I know e bay won't allow complete firearms nor any part that aids the firearm to shoot (what the heck does that mean?? ANY part of a firearm aids it in shooting, yet they allow some parts and not others, crazy). However, as we all know, the National Firearms Act (NFA) does not recognize muzzle loading black powder weapons nor reproductions thereof to be classified as "firearms".

Soooo, if Ebay won't allow "firearms" or any part that aids a "firearm" to shoot, to be advertised at their site, and since muzzleloaders aren't "firearms" under the law, then why can't complete muzzleloaders be sold on Ebay according to their very own rules?

Or like most anti-gunners do they just make up their own rules as they go along in spite of contradicting what their own "rules" say regarding "firearms"? Lol.

.

Andy Griffith · April 21, 2012, 05:36 AM

I think I'd list it on the Japanese fleabay site...at least the grips and grip frame...they'd likely bring a whole lot more. The Japanese love to buy grips...or so I'm told.

Well Doc...I'd get to takin' pictures and sell all the jun...I mean high-priced quality merchandise to some unsuspecting....I mean connoisseur for a good profit so I's could get something else I wanted.

They're likely going to hang it on the wall inside a cheesy cracker barrel anyway.

Hawg · April 21, 2012, 08:04 AM

Ebay has changed their policy again. You can sell cylinders and barrels etc.

deerslayer303 · April 21, 2012, 08:10 AM

WOW! Maybe I'll bust a few down and sell em!

Naw I couldn't do that and sleep at night.

OutlawJoseyWales · April 21, 2012, 08:35 AM

Saw this myself, Wow

I think someone needs to do a search and find out that gunbroker.com and Cabela's really does exist. man that's dumb.

Beagle333 · April 21, 2012, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Maybe I'll bust a few down and sell em!

There are lots of folks doing just that. Check out the Hawkens and Renegades. Several of the stock descriptions read "For the barrel, see my other listing" or "Barrel to be auctioned after stock auction ends" and a couple of bolder guys say "Win this auction on my stock and get a free gift along with your stock!".

Sure Shot Mc Gee · April 21, 2012, 09:43 AM

Quote:

EBays moto: Supply and demand.

It appears that seller is about to laugh all the way to his bank. It's the only place I know where one can get rich by doing so little to earn it. Just one step down from winning the lottery Doc. I think you should get involved with EBay selling parts. You could change your current EBay name to one more suitable for your new enterprise. Like Doc Hoys Parts & Pieces or Doc Hoys "Jim Dandy" Stuff. If you choose to go down that road to new riches and delegating all your free time to EBay with hopes to achieve your new endeavor. I support your decision 100% If you choose to stay right here on TFLF with many who enjoy your words of Witt and knowledge. That deserves a % of my support too. Just what percentage I don't know as I haven't given it much thought Doc. I just assumed you would be here forever. (Locked IN!!) so to speak. Yep!!

zullo74 · April 21, 2012, 04:00 PM

Bill Atkins wrote

Quote:

However, as we all know, the National Firearms Act (NFA) does not recognize muzzle loading black powder weapons nor reproductions thereof to be classified as "firearms".

Wrong. It was the GCA '68 that gave that definition.

bedbugbilly · April 21, 2012, 05:03 PM

Ahhh . . . c'mon Doc . . . you know one man's junk is another man's treasure!

As Forrest Gump's mother said . . . "You can't fix stupid!".

I will say this though . . . you can't fault the seller. Over the years, I've had a number of long arms that I was going to sell but couldn't get the price for them that they should have brought. (I'm talking some general antique and vintage long arms). Instead, I parted them out and made more money on the parts than on the complete gun had I sold it intact. Go figure . . .

As someone stated . for that price, the guy could have purchased a complete brasser.

bedbugbilly · April 21, 2012, 05:05 PM

Bill - eBay won't allow ammunition to be sold as well but I've seen lots of "antique cartridges" pass through without a hitch. Go figure . . .

I've sold and purchased on that site for years but am not always happy with the way they do things . . . .

capper · April 21, 2012, 06:00 PM

I contacted an E bay seller a couple of weeks ago,about a Renegade rifle stock. I wanted to know why he wasn't selling the entire rifle,since it wasn't classified as a firearm. He wrote back,and said that E bay is based out of CA,and they are VERY anti-gun.He also said a few more things I won't repeat here.

He said he would sell me the barrel through Paypal,but COULD NOT do it through E-bay.I just couldn't see paying his asking prices,as I could find an entire rifle for less,elsewhere. Sellers on E-bay are basically hamstrung to do anything else.It's a sad,sad situation we are in lads. We need to stick together on stuff like this,or we will surely see an end to the lifestyle we so much enjoy!!

Hawg · April 21, 2012, 06:19 PM

Quote:

He said he would sell me the barrel through Paypal,but COULD NOT do it through E-bay.

I don't see why not. There's a ton of barrels for sale on ebay.

capper · April 21, 2012, 06:46 PM

Don't know. I DO know however, he was a very upset E-bay seller. I didn't bother getting into it with him,as I said I wasn't going to pay his prices.

sandman_nv · April 21, 2012, 07:25 PM

HOLY MOLY!

I'm getting my junked .44 out of the parts box and selling the parts right now!

Doc Hoy · April 21, 2012, 07:52 PM

I have been doing eBay since about 1995. Obviously I don't make a business out of it, but when I need something I generally check eBay first. Today I got my 622nd positive feedback and I am still at 100%. I actually used that on a resume once.

When it started eBay was truly a venue for individuals to sell things to other individuals. Then it got out of hand.

I used to collect Britains soldiers. There are price guides just as there are price guides for black powder revolvers.

Then over a period of a few years the sets started proliferating on eBay. And the same phenomenon that is driving the price of that junk frame drove the price of the sets through the roof. I can't call myself a serious toy soldier collector just as I can't really call myself a serious BP revolver collector. But it sure was frustrating to see the price of these sets bid up by fools who don't know diddly. All of a sudden the price guides were useless. The best way to find the value of a soldier set was to check eBay and see what numbskulls were paying for them. And, yes, openned sets were going for higher prices than one might pay to an online seller for a brand new set plus shipping.

So a used brass frame goes for 125.00 plus 16.00 shipping when you can buy a new pistol for 179.00. and no shipping because the order is more than 150.00. Maybe the bidder knows something I don't know. Maybe he has a barrel and cylinder and just wants to finish the pistol. Maybe there is something special about the frame that is beyond me. On the other hand maybe he is just another of the blithering idiots who are attracted to eBay and who are beginning to be attracted to Gunbroker who just push the bid button without even the slightest effort at knowing the value of what they are bidding for.

Just one of the things that urks me.

sandman_nv · April 21, 2012, 07:57 PM

Congrats on the positive feedback record, Doc.

It pays to cultivate an excellent rep.

sandman_nv · April 21, 2012, 08:08 PM

Doc,

I'll see your 44 and raise you a 36.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...vip=true&rt=nc

Doc Hoy · April 21, 2012, 08:12 PM

Don't think I didn't go down into the shop and pull out about four boxes of parts, Sandman.

Makes you want to buy an 1851 Brass Navy and sell the barrel, cylinder, and frame in about three different eBay autions. Then take the bids and go buy two more.

Okay....I am off the soapbox for now.

OEF-Vet · April 21, 2012, 08:14 PM

This phenomenon seems to happen at any auction or public sale in the real world or cyberspace. Anyone that goes to these sales has seen tools, guns, household items, lawn mowers, etc sell for more than the price of new. I've even witnessed real estate go for considerably more than the market value.

It's amazing to those of us who have the not so "common sense" to educate ourselves before we make a purchase.

Doc Hoy · April 22, 2012, 04:29 AM

...I suppose I am just whining because I could have used that frame. I think I will resolve never to bring this issue up again.

I know there are plenty of folks on the forum who will be eternally grateful to read that.

Bill Akins · April 22, 2012, 04:35 AM

Quote:

Zullo74 wrote:
Bill Atkins wrote
Quote:
However, as we all know, the National Firearms Act (NFA) does not recognize muzzle loading black powder weapons nor reproductions thereof to be classified as "firearms".
Wrong. It was the GCA '68 that gave that definition.

I am not wrong according to some sources Zullo. See this excerpt from Wikipedia.....

"The United States Supreme Court, in deciding the case of Haynes v. United States in favor of the defendant, effectively gutted the National Firearms Act of 1934. As one could possess an NFA firearm and choose not to register it, and not face prosecution due to Fifth Amendment protections, the Act was unenforceable. To deal with this, Congress rewrote the Act to make registration of existing firearms impossible except by the government (previously, an existing firearm could be registered by any citizen). In addition to fixing the defect identified in Haynes, the revision tightened definitions of the firearms regulated by the Act, as well as incorporating a new category of firearm, the Destructive Device, which was first regulated in the Omnibus Crime Control and Safe Streets Act of 1968. This revision is known as the National Firearms Act of 1968 to differentiate it from the NFA of 1934, which is a different (and now void) law."

Then there's this excerpt from THE BATFE's OWN WEBSITE that says.....

"ATF Home
Firearms
National Firearms Act (NFA)
History of the National Firearms Act

The NFA was originally enacted in 1934. Similar to the current NFA, the original Act imposed a tax on the making and transfer of firearms defined by the Act, as well as a special (occupational) tax on persons and entities engaged in the business of importing, manufacturing, and dealing in NFA firearms."

Notice how the BATFE calls the originally enacted 1934 NFA "Similar to the current NFA". BATFE of course means the Title II 1968 revision of the National Firearms Act that some people call "The Gun Control Act of 1968" or some call it the "GCA" or...some call it...."The NFA"....or some call it "Title II NFA" or some call it...."The National Firearms Act of 1968" (as Wikipedia called it above).

It is significant and noteworthy that BATFE currently uses the phrase "NFA" (National Firearms Act) firearm or device to include any firearm or device covered by the 1968 title II revision of the old 1934 NFA.

And the National Firearms Act of 1968 was what I was talking about and meant. You will note I did not say the National Firearms Act of "1934". I just said "the National Firearms Act (NFA)". I figured most people here would know I meant the National Firearms Act of 1968, because that is the one that exempts muzzleloaders as being "firearms" and as you can see from reading at the BATFE's own website, that they still currently uses the phrase "NFA firearms or devices" to describe firearms and devices which fall into the title II 1968 revision of the "original" 1934 National Firearms Act (NFA).

So if the law is only known as the Gun Control Act of 1968 (as you suppose), or by the initials "G.C.A.", then why does the BATFE currently still call these firearms and devices "NFA" items and not "GCA" items?

Essentially both you and I are both correct. But as you can see, some people including Wikipedia and the BATFE itself, currently use the term...."NFA" (National Firearms Act) (meaning as title II amended in 1968) and some people use the term.... "GCA" (Gun Control Act of 1968).

Toe-may-toe or Toe-mah-toe, either is correct and means the same thing.

But one thing you are definitely incorrect on is....there is no "t" in "Akins".

.

zullo74 · April 22, 2012, 07:40 AM

Sorry for the mis-spelling of your name.

Bill Akins · April 22, 2012, 07:49 AM

No prob.

.

capper · April 22, 2012, 08:00 AM

It's okay Doc,most of us on here share your sentiments.This topic can be very frustrating,and every now and then we need to vent.Besides,no matter what,you are always entertaining.LOL

April 21, 2012, 03:47 AM	#1
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	I swear.... ....I am going to find the winning bidder on this auction and go into business selling him junk pistol parts. http://www.ebay.com/itm/110861796163...84.m1423.l2649 __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

April 21, 2012, 05:23 AM	#2
Bill Akins Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 2007 Location: Hudson, Florida Posts: 1,135	Gosh you're right Doc. He could have had a complete brasser for that price instead of just a frame. I know e bay won't allow complete firearms nor any part that aids the firearm to shoot (what the heck does that mean?? ANY part of a firearm aids it in shooting, yet they allow some parts and not others, crazy). However, as we all know, the National Firearms Act (NFA) does not recognize muzzle loading black powder weapons nor reproductions thereof to be classified as "firearms". Soooo, if Ebay won't allow "firearms" or any part that aids a "firearm" to shoot, to be advertised at their site, and since muzzleloaders aren't "firearms" under the law, then why can't complete muzzleloaders be sold on Ebay according to their very own rules? Or like most anti-gunners do they just make up their own rules as they go along in spite of contradicting what their own "rules" say regarding "firearms"? Lol. . __________________ "This is my Remy and this is my Colt. Remy loads easy and topstrap strong, Colt balances better and never feels wrong. A repro black powder revolver gun, they smoke and shoot lead and give me much fun. I can't figure out which one I like better, they're both fine revolvers that fit in my leather". "To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target".

April 21, 2012, 05:36 AM	#3
Andy Griffith Senior Member Join Date: May 14, 2009 Location: Macon Co. NC Posts: 591	I think I'd list it on the Japanese fleabay site...at least the grips and grip frame...they'd likely bring a whole lot more. The Japanese love to buy grips...or so I'm told. Well Doc...I'd get to takin' pictures and sell all the jun...I mean high-priced quality merchandise to some unsuspecting....I mean connoisseur for a good profit so I's could get something else I wanted. They're likely going to hang it on the wall inside a cheesy cracker barrel anyway. __________________ Barney Fife: "Nip it, nip it, nip it!" Andy Griffith:"Oh now Barn'...."

April 21, 2012, 08:10 AM	#5
deerslayer303 Senior Member Join Date: January 10, 2011 Location: Leesville SC Posts: 2,653	WOW! Maybe I'll bust a few down and sell em! Naw I couldn't do that and sleep at night. __________________ "I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery." - Thomas Jefferson

April 21, 2012, 05:03 PM	#10
bedbugbilly Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2009 Posts: 3,287	Ahhh . . . c'mon Doc . . . you know one man's junk is another man's treasure! As Forrest Gump's mother said . . . "You can't fix stupid!". I will say this though . . . you can't fault the seller. Over the years, I've had a number of long arms that I was going to sell but couldn't get the price for them that they should have brought. (I'm talking some general antique and vintage long arms). Instead, I parted them out and made more money on the parts than on the complete gun had I sold it intact. Go figure . . . As someone stated . for that price, the guy could have purchased a complete brasser. __________________ If a pair of '51 Navies were good enough for Billy Hickok, then a single Navy on my right hip is good enough for me . . . besides . . . I'm probably only half as good as he was anyways. Hiram's Rangers Badge #63

April 21, 2012, 08:04 AM	#4
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,189	Ebay has changed their policy again. You can sell cylinders and barrels etc.

April 21, 2012, 08:35 AM	#6
OutlawJoseyWales Senior Member Join Date: August 18, 2010 Location: Florida Posts: 237	Saw this myself, Wow I think someone needs to do a search and find out that gunbroker.com and Cabela's really does exist. man that's dumb.

April 21, 2012, 05:05 PM	#11
bedbugbilly Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2009 Posts: 3,287	Bill - eBay won't allow ammunition to be sold as well but I've seen lots of "antique cartridges" pass through without a hitch. Go figure . . . I've sold and purchased on that site for years but am not always happy with the way they do things . . . . __________________ If a pair of '51 Navies were good enough for Billy Hickok, then a single Navy on my right hip is good enough for me . . . besides . . . I'm probably only half as good as he was anyways. Hiram's Rangers Badge #63

April 21, 2012, 06:00 PM	#12
capper Member Join Date: April 2, 2012 Location: Turners Falls, MA Posts: 63	I contacted an E bay seller a couple of weeks ago,about a Renegade rifle stock. I wanted to know why he wasn't selling the entire rifle,since it wasn't classified as a firearm. He wrote back,and said that E bay is based out of CA,and they are VERY anti-gun.He also said a few more things I won't repeat here. He said he would sell me the barrel through Paypal,but COULD NOT do it through E-bay.I just couldn't see paying his asking prices,as I could find an entire rifle for less,elsewhere. Sellers on E-bay are basically hamstrung to do anything else.It's a sad,sad situation we are in lads. We need to stick together on stuff like this,or we will surely see an end to the lifestyle we so much enjoy!! __________________ Mmmm, how I love the smell of black powder in the morning!

April 21, 2012, 06:46 PM	#14
capper Member Join Date: April 2, 2012 Location: Turners Falls, MA Posts: 63	He said he would sell me the barrel through Paypal,but COULD NOT do it through E-bay. Don't know. I DO know however, he was a very upset E-bay seller. I didn't bother getting into it with him,as I said I wasn't going to pay his prices. __________________ Mmmm, how I love the smell of black powder in the morning! Last edited by capper; April 21, 2012 at 06:47 PM. Reason: misspelling

April 21, 2012, 07:25 PM	#15
sandman_nv Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2012 Posts: 108	HOLY MOLY! I'm getting my junked .44 out of the parts box and selling the parts right now!

April 21, 2012, 07:52 PM	#16
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	My frustration I have been doing eBay since about 1995. Obviously I don't make a business out of it, but when I need something I generally check eBay first. Today I got my 622nd positive feedback and I am still at 100%. I actually used that on a resume once. When it started eBay was truly a venue for individuals to sell things to other individuals. Then it got out of hand. I used to collect Britains soldiers. There are price guides just as there are price guides for black powder revolvers. Then over a period of a few years the sets started proliferating on eBay. And the same phenomenon that is driving the price of that junk frame drove the price of the sets through the roof. I can't call myself a serious toy soldier collector just as I can't really call myself a serious BP revolver collector. But it sure was frustrating to see the price of these sets bid up by fools who don't know diddly. All of a sudden the price guides were useless. The best way to find the value of a soldier set was to check eBay and see what numbskulls were paying for them. And, yes, openned sets were going for higher prices than one might pay to an online seller for a brand new set plus shipping. So a used brass frame goes for 125.00 plus 16.00 shipping when you can buy a new pistol for 179.00. and no shipping because the order is more than 150.00. Maybe the bidder knows something I don't know. Maybe he has a barrel and cylinder and just wants to finish the pistol. Maybe there is something special about the frame that is beyond me. On the other hand maybe he is just another of the blithering idiots who are attracted to eBay and who are beginning to be attracted to Gunbroker who just push the bid button without even the slightest effort at knowing the value of what they are bidding for. Just one of the things that urks me. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

April 21, 2012, 07:57 PM	#17
sandman_nv Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2012 Posts: 108	Congrats on the positive feedback record, Doc. It pays to cultivate an excellent rep.

April 21, 2012, 08:08 PM	#18
sandman_nv Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2012 Posts: 108	Doc, I'll see your 44 and raise you a 36. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...vip=true&rt=nc

April 21, 2012, 08:12 PM	#19
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Hey... Don't think I didn't go down into the shop and pull out about four boxes of parts, Sandman. Makes you want to buy an 1851 Brass Navy and sell the barrel, cylinder, and frame in about three different eBay autions. Then take the bids and go buy two more. Okay....I am off the soapbox for now. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

April 21, 2012, 08:14 PM	#20
OEF-Vet Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2011 Location: Backwoods, PA Posts: 284	This phenomenon seems to happen at any auction or public sale in the real world or cyberspace. Anyone that goes to these sales has seen tools, guns, household items, lawn mowers, etc sell for more than the price of new. I've even witnessed real estate go for considerably more than the market value. It's amazing to those of us who have the not so "common sense" to educate ourselves before we make a purchase. __________________ Jim "If a man does his best, what else is there?" - General George S. Patton Jr

April 22, 2012, 04:29 AM	#21
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	In the final analysis.... ...I suppose I am just whining because I could have used that frame. I think I will resolve never to bring this issue up again. I know there are plenty of folks on the forum who will be eternally grateful to read that. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

April 22, 2012, 07:40 AM	#23
zullo74 Junior member Join Date: August 8, 2009 Posts: 374	Sorry for the mis-spelling of your name.

April 22, 2012, 07:49 AM	#24
Bill Akins Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 2007 Location: Hudson, Florida Posts: 1,135	No prob. . __________________ "This is my Remy and this is my Colt. Remy loads easy and topstrap strong, Colt balances better and never feels wrong. A repro black powder revolver gun, they smoke and shoot lead and give me much fun. I can't figure out which one I like better, they're both fine revolvers that fit in my leather". "To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target".

April 22, 2012, 08:00 AM	#25
capper Member Join Date: April 2, 2012 Location: Turners Falls, MA Posts: 63	In the final analysis.... It's okay Doc,most of us on here share your sentiments.This topic can be very frustrating,and every now and then we need to vent.Besides,no matter what,you are always entertaining.LOL __________________ Mmmm, how I love the smell of black powder in the morning!