Do you consider a chronograph a necessity for a reloader?

[Smaug]

I'm thinking about this. For the purposes of estimating the trajectory of my 6mm Rem ammo in my rifle, I was going to use published velocities out of about the same length barrel of universal receiver.

Now, I just read in a post somewhere that one guy had never found them to be the same.

This would be for deer hunting, and I would be able to confirm at 25, 100 and 200 yards.

But I get the feeling from reading here that a chrony is one of those purchases for which one thanks oneself for a long time after buying it. Is that true, or is it not really necessary?

[Loader9]

No, it's not necessary for your intended usage and frankly, would be a waste of money. So you know the speed at the place where you set up and shot thru the chrony. If you move to a different altitude, a different humidity, a different temperature, everything changes. Rarely will conditions be the same when hunting. The best way to track your bullet flight is to shoot where you intend to hunt in similar weather conditions at the various ranges. We always use the end of season to test ranges of various loads we have worked up. Hunting is basically over and that way we have a clue about next year and any changes we want to make. Another good source of education concerning bullet flight is to join a traveling shooting team. You'll learn what shoots at home is worthless somewhere else.

[wncchester]

"But I get the feeling from reading here that a chrony is one of those purchases for which one thanks oneself for a long time after buying it. Is that true, or is it not really necessary?"

Necessary? Well, let's put it this way; we've been reloading brass cases a long time, over a hundred years in fact. Hobby level chronographs at affordable prices and usable skyscreens came on the scene about twenty years ago.

I'm glad I have one, it's useful and interesting but ... necessary? Not really.

[Sevens]

I don't think it's necessary at all, but I'd still like to give one a twirl.

I would imagine that if I did go ahead and buy one, I'd use it quite a bit for the first couple times out, then less and less, until eventually it would sit at home and gather dust and never get used.

Especially for me-- the velocity of any/all of my ammo just doesn't have much importance to me. I want accuracy, and I want it to be safe. If I can get those two things, the only other thing I ask for is for it to be cheap.

I'll tell you this, though Smaug...
I'm not sure anyone makes a chrono that will measure the speed of a 6-inch Ruger Redhawk .44 Mag barrel as it flies down range!

[CraigC]

It's one of those "nice-to-haves" but not necessary. I've only had one for about a year and have used it only three times. I did fine without it. Just kinda wanted one.

[fourdogs]

A lot depends on what you want to accomplish with a chrony. They are nice to check SD ( standard deviation ) and nice to calculate muzzle velocity and bullet trajectory within the limits of your shooting environment on that day.

If you can nail down your velocities and trajectories at your range and take careful notes, you can make long range first shot kills, or first shot 0 rings in virtually any shooting environment on earth by extrapolation, intuition, and a great deal of skill.

It's also nice to know when your bullet will go subsonic and destabilize. If someone is only interested in hunting or shooting at several hundred yards, no need for a chrony.

[Archie]

I have one, use it not constantly, but always when I am doing load development for serious purposes.

One can find out which loads are most consistent, and also be able to detect the abnormalities and anomolies indicating problems. Aside from that, one actually knows the results instead of guessing. Knowing is always better.

I suppose it's not an absolute requirement, but I feel it helps the seriously reloader in development and research.

[rg1]

Yes and No. It's not absolutely necessary for loading safe accurate ammo but it is an interesting tool. I reloaded for 15 years without one.
After getting one, I was a little upset finding loads that Manuals says gets 3100fps and finding published data I used got only 2800. Surprised to find that other published data was very close to actual results. The most disappointed with data was in pistols however. Loads published saying 850fps in 45acp actually around 650-700fps, and other pistol loads slower than my results also. Loads I tested were in the same pistols used in their tests and rifles the same and often the same barrel lengths.
What the chronograph did for me was to make certain reloading manuals that I took for the "gospel" to only look at their data for comparison. It made me less trusting of certain manuals and more appreciative of others. I found some powders simply would NOT give velocities published and others did come very close. Now when I find powder data that's HONEST I appreciate it and have switched to that companies powder and sometimes bullets.
A couple times developing loads for pistols I found I was having wild velocity differences from shot to shot. Like 900fps and occasionally one would drop down in the 600's. Found out case neck tension was a problem. Wouldn't have found this so fast without the chrono.
You could compare it to eating a lot of greasy fast food. Everything is fine and dandy until going to the doctor and finding your cholesterol numbers are off the chart. You won't know for sure until an accurate test, and MAYBE you don't want to know. Complicates things.

[wncchester]

"It's also nice to know when your bullet will go subsonic and destabilize."

Huh?

[fourdogs]

Huh ?

What part of that don't you understand ?

[cobra81]

+1 to what Archie said.

I got one a couple years ago and use it occasionally, mostly when developing new loads. The information you get from the chronograph is otherwise a mystery or guesswork. For less than a hundred bucks, you can have all that information. Pretty good investment, as far as I'm concerned.

[Stargazer]

I look at a chrongraph as not a necessity but it is the ulitmate feedback for the reloader. I tried one of the cheaper Chrony boxes and the last suggestion from them was to place the unit 20-25 "yards" down range as I was getting false readings from muzzle blast. I want to know muzzle velocity so I sold that sucker and got a PACT with IR screens. (10 feet away now). What Pact doesn't tell you on these IR screens is you need 120 volts to power the small transformer needed to power the IR's. That was easy enough though to go around with a small 12 volt gel cell and a small regulater circuit to provide the 6 volts DC the IR's need. Now I can read speed data in the dark if I want to, no sun needed! Or at anytime during the day no matter what location the sun is to the screens. Shade trees become "not a problem" using the IR screens.

So while not absolutely necessary to have a chronograph, it is a useful tool for reloading.

[Colorado Redneck]

I have only been reloading for a few years. Got a chrony for christmas. Took it right out to the range and tested some loads I had never fired. The first two shots from my 25-06 were factory loads. Checked out close to published velocities. Tried a few of mine. Two were way high. I was using the recipe from the book.

I posted the problem here. One of the members asked me the trim length of my cases. Immediately after I told him, he informed me that I needed to trim the cases to the minimum trim length. I tried that and the loads worked perfectly. I had not bothered to trim if the case didn't exceed the maximum length. My caliper was a cheapy and after I got a better caliper and trimmed the cases I was in business. So, in my opinion, there is info that can be gained only with a chrony.And I am really thankful for the chrony and the helpful posters on this forum. My chrony cost 95 peso. Probably saved my 700 dollar Ruger.

[Threefeathers]

Not having a chrono is a recipe for a kaboom.

[Nnobby45]

The Chrono is interesting, fun, provides useful information as well as some more critical, and none of us would give up reloading if we didn't have one---- anymore than we'd give up hunting and fishing without a 4WD.

It's an excellent safety tool when devoloping loads.

Now that I've owned both a Chron and a 4WD, I'll never be without either.

[snuffy]

It's also nice to know when your bullet will go subsonic and destabilize. If someone is only interested in hunting or shooting at several hundred yards, no need for a chrony.

Yeah HUH? Please explain this, it's the first time I've heard that a bullet de-stabilizes when dropping below the speed of sound!

As for the op's question, I take my pact chrono with me to the range EVERY time I go. Seldom do I NOT use it. There's so much information it can tell you. I've had one for 30 of the forty years I've been loading. The first one weighed 30 pounds, the "sky" screens were boxes that were 4X6X4 inches and had 9 volt batteries inside them.

Loader9 No, it's not necessary for your intended usage and frankly, would be a waste of money. So you know the speed at the place where you set up and shot thru the chrony. If you move to a different altitude, a different humidity, a different temperature, everything changes.

Umm, not so. Knowing the base line of a particular load will allow you to calculate what those variables will do to your velocity. Extremes in temp. will have the most effect on velocity. Notice I said EXTREMES. If you develope a load on a 70 degree summer day, then hunt in 20 degree winter, you will not see a huge difference. Same with humidity, little difference, except at very long range. Altitude? Yes that is probably the biggest factor, the thinner air results in maintaining velocity over a longer distance. Resulting in shooting higher than at a lower altitude.

[CraigC]

Not having a chrono is a recipe for a kaboom.

How do you figure?

[ringworm]

no, but having a friend with a chrono is a must.

[WESHOOT2]

If it is someone satisfied with the noise, or finds their handloads hit where aimed, then a chronograph is not needed.

If someone wants to know what's happening, other than hitting where aimed, then the tool becomes mandatory.

What does one know without one?

[sundog]

Gotta have when using surplus powders.

[Edward429451]

I reloaded for a long time without one so it's not really necessary, I had no KB's.

Then I got one and started seeing what all my tried and true loads were really doing. Quite a few were giving velocities above book data, even though below published max powder charges. If the velocities are there then the max is there even though no pressure signs...soo, yes, now I feel they're necessary.

When ya read max velocities from starting loads (with only the one teeny deviation from book data...!) it makes yur eyebrows go up a little.

[fourdogs]

It's also nice to know when your bullet will go subsonic and destabilize.

Yeah HUH? Please explain this, it's the first time I've heard that a bullet de-stabilizes when dropping below the speed of sound!

It's been over fifteen years since I've loaded for, or shot a rifle, but when I did I shot extreme ranges. I'm a natural. Started shooting at age six. When I shoot a round, I become the bullet. I literally feel the forces at work as the bullet travels on it's flight path. Trying to be honest, I've probably forgotten more about shooting than most of the guys here will ever know.

Now, I might not be up on the latest trends, but there are laws of physics that can't be disputed. When a bullet transitions from sonic to subsonic, the bullet destabilizes or more accurately that is the moment that destabilization first occurs and gets progressively worse. It doesn't matter what bullet. They all do it. The reason is, rotation keeps a bullet stable. The faster a bullet is traveling, the faster it spins. When a bullet reaches the subsonic threshold, it's going too slow for the spin rate to keep it stable, and it will start to yaw and essentially drop like a rock. You can only accurately calculate a bullet trajectory until it reaches the sub sonic threshold. Once your bullet slows to about 1000 fps, all bets are off. You can see for yourself on some trajectory tables if they go out to 1500 yards. There will be a marked increase in drop rate at about the 1000 fps threshold. It's helpful to know what distance your bullet goes subsonic even if you never shoot extreme ranges. It's nice to know the envelope of your round.

Now, some of you might think I don't know much about anything, because I keep calling a bullet in flight a bullet and not a projectile. It takes too much time to type projectile, but let me simply say this. Technically a bullet is a bullet until it leaves the barrel. The moment a bullet leaves the muzzle, it becomes a projectile because it has been projected from the gun.

BTW, a chrono is nice to have no matter what. It's great for load development. It's an important step in understanding on a deeper level the connection you have with your weapon. Use your skills wisely. Never kill anything for fun or practice. All life must be respected.

[DEDON45]

While I voted that it is a necessity, one can (and I have) get by without one. However, for the information you can learn using one (knowing when you're approaching max, finding loads that have consistent velocities for greater accuracy, etc.), the cost is not that high. I purchased a Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital a month or two ago, and it has greatly improved my load development (and my buddy's, since I let him shoot over it... if he busts it he'll pay for the replacement, about 45.00, from the mfg. As it is we've both hit the guide wires once testing .45ACP) process. It was only about 90.00 from Graf's... since I am a computer nerd, I ended up also buying the remote control / serial interface module so I can dump the stats into Excel on my home computer. If 90.00 is too high, go in with a friend or two on one, and agree to share the expense of replacement (most mfg. will sell you a replacement refurb unit for 1/2 the cost of new)... I've actually tried some of the more expensive ones, and this one seems to be more reliable and unaffected by muzzle blast (I put the thing about 8 ft. away from the bench) than the expensive ones.

Besides, it's hard to beat the feeling you get when your rounds are more accurate, and more consistent, than "premium" factory ammo is, and can prove it. Do be prepared to be a little "dissappointed" with the results of your beloved handloads that you have guesstimated the velocities on... all the stuff I tested came in low, except one surprise, very hot, .45ACP JHP load... the thing was going 50fps faster than the book showed, and I wasn't even at max... it's basically a +p load!

[wncchester]

"It's also nice to know when your bullet will go subsonic and destabilize. If someone is only interested in hunting or shooting at several hundred yards, no need for a chrony."

"Yeah HUH? Please explain this, it's the first time I've heard that a bullet de-stabilizes when dropping below the speed of sound!"

Exactly. ???? Course I've only been doing this since '65 and I'm sure I haven't learned it all yet. I 'specially ain't learned THAT!

One fact of bullet spin is it's established by twist rate and velocity and, yes, forward velocity starts dropping immediately after exiting the muzzle. But the established spin - or rotational velocity - is largely maintained during the entire flight. Spin, and stability, surely doesn't decrease as a direct function of the decreasing forward velocity. That's just a "FACT" of the laws of physics as they exist, not from any spiritual sense of you or me or Shirley McClain joining minds with the bullet!

Is it your position that sub-sonic bullets are, ipso facto, unstable? And, do you also hold that a bullets forward velocity somehow negates gravity until it drops to 1kfps, after which it begins to fall?

[tomh1426]

Id love to have one but I dont think Its somthing you HAVE to have to reload.
My fathers been reloading since befor I was born and he never once shot threw a chrono.