.223 Case question

Mattp27 · September 12, 2010, 07:19 PM

I recently bought some brand new Lake City 09' brass. I finally made it out to the range today and after cleaning my cases I went to inspect them. I noticed a small indention around the base of the case almost like a magnum case. Not all of them have it just a few. Does this look concerning? Should I just toss these or what? Could this be the begining of case seperation? I have been reloading Lake City once fired military brass and have not seen anything like this.

The case on the top shows it really well. The bottom one has a bit but not as bad. Has anyone seen this before?

Thanks

jaguarxk120 · September 12, 2010, 07:32 PM

Maybe pressure ring signs. Could be a softer case and the brass is flowing causing the ring.

Mattp27 · September 12, 2010, 07:44 PM

Ok if it is a pressure issue I was already planning on cutting back on my load. Should I toss these cases?

hammie · September 12, 2010, 08:13 PM

Looks like incipient head separation to me. If they've been resized prior to firing, I would wonder about pushing the shoulder back too far. If they've not been resized, then perhaps you have a chamber that is too long.

Mattp27 · September 12, 2010, 08:36 PM

I did resize them. I guess I will check before I resize next load. I was also at the upper limit of a max load on these too. 25.0gr AA2230 with 55gr Nosler BT. I am going to back down to 23.5gr and see if I get the same results. I just have not seen this on any other cases I've loaded for this gun.

About 10 of the thirty I shot today after the resize they will not fit in my go / no go case. So I set those aside and loaded the 20 up with the lower charge.

t45 · September 12, 2010, 08:46 PM

It looks like they have stretched. Can you see a ring on the inside of the case? If so, they are ready to come apart.

Mattp27 · September 12, 2010, 08:56 PM

No I can't see a ring on the inside of those cases.

t45 · September 12, 2010, 09:10 PM

The only other thing I can think of is that ring is where your sizing die stopped. I would check the other cases you have that you have not re-sized yet and then run them through your full length sizing die and see if the ring shows up. Just a thought.

hammie · September 12, 2010, 09:16 PM

The other thing to do, is take a hack saw or a dremel with a cut-off wheel, and then longitudinally cross section a case and look. You will clearly see any thinning of the walls. I'd do that before throwing them away.

t45 · September 12, 2010, 09:32 PM

Hammie, thats a good idea.

Mattp27 · September 12, 2010, 09:40 PM

Aight heres a case cut in half.

hammie · September 12, 2010, 09:50 PM

t45: These things are hard to tell for me. I have a ruger 7 x 57mm with a slightly oversized chamber near the base of the cartridge. So the brass expands to fill the chamber, just before it thickens at the web. When you iron it out with the die, you get a very pronounced burnished ring.

hammie · September 12, 2010, 09:51 PM

Wow Mr. Matt. You're efficient. They look good to me. Now I wonder what it is?

t45 · September 12, 2010, 09:53 PM

Matt, the brass appears fine to me. Did you check to see if your full length die is leaving the ring?

Mattp27 · September 12, 2010, 10:05 PM

It doesn't leave a ring on new brass. These were the first ones. I will shoot some new loads in a couple days and see if they do the same. I chambered one of these cases in my AR15 and it looks like where the mark is on the case is about what is sticking out of the chamber. Not sure if that is right. I never looked before. But the bolt appears to close and lock in with no issues. I am assuming on the AR15 that's how it is supposed to be.

hpg · September 13, 2010, 01:15 PM

I'd bet it's the resizing die also..............hpg

Krieger9 · September 13, 2010, 02:51 PM

I had something very similar to that once that was worrying me but it was far more up towards the neck. Couldn't figure out what was doing that, it turns out I was doing it myself when I was deburring, right at the depth my deburring tool would mark a circle on the brass.

Check your process and see, I think lots of things can marr them.

Mattp27 · September 17, 2010, 09:29 AM

It must have been the die. I had a extra .223 die so I swapped it out. I have reloaded the same cases 3 times already and looks like I should be able to get at least 1 or two more loads out of this LC brass with no issues. I haven't tried the old die again. But something I did when I resized that first time was the culprit. Maybe I didn't have enough lube on the cases? Anyway thanks for the help.

September 12, 2010, 07:19 PM	#1
Mattp27 Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2009 Location: Houston Texas Area Posts: 107	.223 Case question I recently bought some brand new Lake City 09' brass. I finally made it out to the range today and after cleaning my cases I went to inspect them. I noticed a small indention around the base of the case almost like a magnum case. Not all of them have it just a few. Does this look concerning? Should I just toss these or what? Could this be the begining of case seperation? I have been reloading Lake City once fired military brass and have not seen anything like this. The case on the top shows it really well. The bottom one has a bit but not as bad. Has anyone seen this before? Thanks

September 13, 2010, 01:15 PM	#16
hpg Senior Member Join Date: September 14, 2002 Location: in the Bluegrass State Posts: 1,610	I'd bet it's the resizing die also..............hpg __________________ NRA member Semper Paratus

September 13, 2010, 02:51 PM	#17
Krieger9 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2009 Location: Howell Michigan Posts: 130	Once I had something very similar to that once that was worrying me but it was far more up towards the neck. Couldn't figure out what was doing that, it turns out I was doing it myself when I was deburring, right at the depth my deburring tool would mark a circle on the brass. Check your process and see, I think lots of things can marr them.

September 12, 2010, 07:32 PM	#2
jaguarxk120 Senior Member Join Date: February 28, 2008 Location: Michigan Posts: 2,620	Maybe pressure ring signs. Could be a softer case and the brass is flowing causing the ring.

September 12, 2010, 07:44 PM	#3
Mattp27 Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2009 Location: Houston Texas Area Posts: 107	Ok if it is a pressure issue I was already planning on cutting back on my load. Should I toss these cases?

September 12, 2010, 08:13 PM	#4
hammie Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Location: Temple, TX Posts: 959	Looks like incipient head separation to me. If they've been resized prior to firing, I would wonder about pushing the shoulder back too far. If they've not been resized, then perhaps you have a chamber that is too long.

September 12, 2010, 08:36 PM	#5
Mattp27 Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2009 Location: Houston Texas Area Posts: 107	I did resize them. I guess I will check before I resize next load. I was also at the upper limit of a max load on these too. 25.0gr AA2230 with 55gr Nosler BT. I am going to back down to 23.5gr and see if I get the same results. I just have not seen this on any other cases I've loaded for this gun. About 10 of the thirty I shot today after the resize they will not fit in my go / no go case. So I set those aside and loaded the 20 up with the lower charge.

September 12, 2010, 08:46 PM	#6
t45 Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2010 Location: Foothills, NC Posts: 782	It looks like they have stretched. Can you see a ring on the inside of the case? If so, they are ready to come apart.

September 12, 2010, 08:56 PM	#7
Mattp27 Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2009 Location: Houston Texas Area Posts: 107	No I can't see a ring on the inside of those cases.

September 12, 2010, 09:10 PM	#8
t45 Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2010 Location: Foothills, NC Posts: 782	The only other thing I can think of is that ring is where your sizing die stopped. I would check the other cases you have that you have not re-sized yet and then run them through your full length sizing die and see if the ring shows up. Just a thought.

September 12, 2010, 09:16 PM	#9
hammie Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Location: Temple, TX Posts: 959	The other thing to do, is take a hack saw or a dremel with a cut-off wheel, and then longitudinally cross section a case and look. You will clearly see any thinning of the walls. I'd do that before throwing them away.

September 12, 2010, 09:32 PM	#10
t45 Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2010 Location: Foothills, NC Posts: 782	Hammie, thats a good idea.

September 12, 2010, 09:40 PM	#11
Mattp27 Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2009 Location: Houston Texas Area Posts: 107	Aight heres a case cut in half.

September 12, 2010, 09:50 PM	#12
hammie Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Location: Temple, TX Posts: 959	t45: These things are hard to tell for me. I have a ruger 7 x 57mm with a slightly oversized chamber near the base of the cartridge. So the brass expands to fill the chamber, just before it thickens at the web. When you iron it out with the die, you get a very pronounced burnished ring.

September 12, 2010, 09:51 PM	#13
hammie Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Location: Temple, TX Posts: 959	Wow Mr. Matt. You're efficient. They look good to me. Now I wonder what it is?

September 12, 2010, 09:53 PM	#14
t45 Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2010 Location: Foothills, NC Posts: 782	Matt, the brass appears fine to me. Did you check to see if your full length die is leaving the ring?

September 12, 2010, 10:05 PM	#15
Mattp27 Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2009 Location: Houston Texas Area Posts: 107	It doesn't leave a ring on new brass. These were the first ones. I will shoot some new loads in a couple days and see if they do the same. I chambered one of these cases in my AR15 and it looks like where the mark is on the case is about what is sticking out of the chamber. Not sure if that is right. I never looked before. But the bolt appears to close and lock in with no issues. I am assuming on the AR15 that's how it is supposed to be.

September 17, 2010, 09:29 AM	#18
Mattp27 Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2009 Location: Houston Texas Area Posts: 107	It must have been the die. I had a extra .223 die so I swapped it out. I have reloaded the same cases 3 times already and looks like I should be able to get at least 1 or two more loads out of this LC brass with no issues. I haven't tried the old die again. But something I did when I resized that first time was the culprit. Maybe I didn't have enough lube on the cases? Anyway thanks for the help.