No.4 Buck vs 00 Buck in Terms of Penetration

dgludwig · October 14, 2015, 02:00 PM

I'm having a debate with a friend regarding the depth of penetration between these two shot sizes. Which penetrates deeper, everything else being equal, No. 4 Buck or 00 Buck? Thanks.

Cheapshooter · October 14, 2015, 03:24 PM

Here is a couple youtube video tests. The pellets vary in penetration depth for both shot size, and the penetration range is pretty close for either.
But for pure destruction of the target medium, be it ballistic gel, or flesh, I will stick with 00.

https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=w6cmGHz-4O4
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dbFLY9OIqPA

amd6547 · October 14, 2015, 06:27 PM

I'm a fan of buckshot, and have been shooting quite a bit with 00 and #4 in two different shotguns (Mossberg 500' and Beretta 1201FP).
The shotgun cognoscenti have written off #4 in recent years, but I'm not convinced. I like the large number of pellets, and I think it would perform fine at typical close engagements.
#1 buck is the latest greatest thing according to the experts...but seems largely unavailable. My LGS recently started keeping Winchester #1 on the shelf. I've tried five rounds and liked it enough to buy some more.
I keep a mixture of FliteControl buckshot and standard old fashioned buck on hand, and personally, I like the standard loads for my purposes better. Plus, my LGS sells the Estate 00 load for $6.99/25rd box. Cheap enough to shoot.

precision_shooter · October 15, 2015, 07:52 AM

I think for deeper penetration, the fiocchi nickel plated #4 and 00 would penetrate deeper than the bare lead shown in the videos posted.

Also, the fiocchi comes in boxes of 10 for about the same price as 5 of other brands. It's some warm ammo as well.

Stevie-Ray · October 15, 2015, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Plus, my LGS sells the Estate 00 load for $6.99/25rd box. Cheap enough to shoot.

Cheap enough? That's incredible!

RMcL · October 18, 2015, 02:59 PM

In an article entitled: Buckshot: The Good, The Bad and The Ugly, Bryce M. Towsley reported testing buckshot penetration in wet newspaper.
The reported results:
-----------------------------------------------------
#4 Buckshot (.24 / 21 grains): 3.5 inches

#1 Buckshot (.30 / 40 grains): 5 inches

#00 Buckshot (.33 / 54 grains): 7 inches

.30-30, 170 grain soft point: 14 inches (control load)
----------------------------------------------------

In my own testing, Dixie TriBall buckshot, (.60"/315 grains), penetrated 31" in wet newspaper.

bamaranger · October 26, 2015, 07:31 PM

At the front of my career, ('79) my agency had adopted #4B, so had a number of other Federal agencies as well. The argument was indeed higher pellet count, thus denser patterns, and to a certain degree, higher hit/wounding rate. I have a 1965 or so dated article from the "Rifleman" that was endorsing #4B in combat use in Vietnam, using the same logic.

All well and good at bedroom ranges. But afield, when the shotgun got deployed for an LE incident, or certainly in a combat zone, one would think, the ranges are longer. or have good potential to be longer.

There the #4B pellet runs out of steam due to its smaller mass. The lighter #4B does not do so well on obstacles either (nor does 00B for that matter). Auto glass, sheet metal, even simple interior doors are a formidable barrier. For those reasons, many of my acquaintance carried slugs as a duty load in their shotgun, untill the advent of the patrol carbine as a regular item became a reality.

Finally, after about a decade, 1990', the agency went back to 00B. That, I think, is a national trend. For all that, one of the two shotguns here at bamahouse in the ready mode is indeed loaded with #4B. Intended for marauding coyotes at night, it would be bad news for human threat as well, within its limited range.

October 14, 2015, 03:24 PM	#2
Cheapshooter Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2007 Location: Missouri Posts: 8,306	Here is a couple youtube video tests. The pellets vary in penetration depth for both shot size, and the penetration range is pretty close for either. But for pure destruction of the target medium, be it ballistic gel, or flesh, I will stick with 00. https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=w6cmGHz-4O4 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dbFLY9OIqPA __________________ Cheapshooter's rules of gun ownership #1: NEVER SELL OR TRADE ANYTHING!

October 14, 2015, 06:27 PM	#3
amd6547 Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2006 Posts: 2,313	I'm a fan of buckshot, and have been shooting quite a bit with 00 and #4 in two different shotguns (Mossberg 500' and Beretta 1201FP). The shotgun cognoscenti have written off #4 in recent years, but I'm not convinced. I like the large number of pellets, and I think it would perform fine at typical close engagements. #1 buck is the latest greatest thing according to the experts...but seems largely unavailable. My LGS recently started keeping Winchester #1 on the shelf. I've tried five rounds and liked it enough to buy some more. I keep a mixture of FliteControl buckshot and standard old fashioned buck on hand, and personally, I like the standard loads for my purposes better. Plus, my LGS sells the Estate 00 load for $6.99/25rd box. Cheap enough to shoot. __________________ The past is gone...the future may never happen. Be Here Now.

October 18, 2015, 02:59 PM	#6
RMcL Senior Member Join Date: May 7, 2006 Location: Alabama Posts: 273	In an article entitled: Buckshot: The Good, The Bad and The Ugly, Bryce M. Towsley reported testing buckshot penetration in wet newspaper. The reported results: ----------------------------------------------------- #4 Buckshot (.24 / 21 grains): 3.5 inches #1 Buckshot (.30 / 40 grains): 5 inches #00 Buckshot (.33 / 54 grains): 7 inches .30-30, 170 grain soft point: 14 inches (control load) ---------------------------------------------------- In my own testing, Dixie TriBall buckshot, (.60"/315 grains), penetrated 31" in wet newspaper. Last edited by RMcL; October 19, 2015 at 04:59 PM.

October 26, 2015, 07:31 PM	#7
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,312	#4B v. 00B At the front of my career, ('79) my agency had adopted #4B, so had a number of other Federal agencies as well. The argument was indeed higher pellet count, thus denser patterns, and to a certain degree, higher hit/wounding rate. I have a 1965 or so dated article from the "Rifleman" that was endorsing #4B in combat use in Vietnam, using the same logic. All well and good at bedroom ranges. But afield, when the shotgun got deployed for an LE incident, or certainly in a combat zone, one would think, the ranges are longer. or have good potential to be longer. There the #4B pellet runs out of steam due to its smaller mass. The lighter #4B does not do so well on obstacles either (nor does 00B for that matter). Auto glass, sheet metal, even simple interior doors are a formidable barrier. For those reasons, many of my acquaintance carried slugs as a duty load in their shotgun, untill the advent of the patrol carbine as a regular item became a reality. Finally, after about a decade, 1990', the agency went back to 00B. That, I think, is a national trend. For all that, one of the two shotguns here at bamahouse in the ready mode is indeed loaded with #4B. Intended for marauding coyotes at night, it would be bad news for human threat as well, within its limited range.

October 14, 2015, 02:00 PM	#1
dgludwig Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2005 Location: North central Ohio Posts: 7,486	No.4 Buck vs 00 Buck in Terms of Penetration I'm having a debate with a friend regarding the depth of penetration between these two shot sizes. Which penetrates deeper, everything else being equal, No. 4 Buck or 00 Buck? Thanks. __________________ ONLY AN ARMED PEOPLE CAN BE TRULY FREE ; ONLY AN UNARMED PEOPLE CAN EVER BE ENSLAVED ...Aristotle NRA Benefactor Life Member

October 15, 2015, 07:52 AM	#4
precision_shooter Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: DFW, Texas Posts: 2,475	I think for deeper penetration, the fiocchi nickel plated #4 and 00 would penetrate deeper than the bare lead shown in the videos posted. Also, the fiocchi comes in boxes of 10 for about the same price as 5 of other brands. It's some warm ammo as well. __________________ "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." - Thomas Jefferson, 1776