November 21, 2011, 04:40 PM | #1551 | |
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This paper belongs in the bottom of a bird cage.... thanks for the link.
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Molon Labe Last edited by BGutzman; November 21, 2011 at 05:34 PM. |
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November 21, 2011, 05:04 PM | #1552 |
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It's not an "article." It's an opinion piece authored by Carolyn Maloney. From the piece: "Maloney, a Democratic congresswoman, represents parts of Manhattan and Queens."
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November 21, 2011, 05:06 PM | #1553 |
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Just so everyone is aware, that was an op-ed piece by one of New York City's Representatives to Congress - it was most definitely not a news article.
It was basically "The Bush Administration started it and the Obama Administration stopped it" sort of rationalization for what happened. But on one point she does have a point - perhaps somewhere down the road, it would be nice to hear what Michael Mukasey and Alberto Gonzales have to say. I don't care if it's a Republican or Democrat administration. Gun-walking is utterly nuts. I don't, though, buy for a second the notion that Eric Holder caught wind of Fast and Furious and put the brakes on it at once. If anything, I would accept the idea that Holder, by dint of being a poor manager and leader, had no idea what sort of major operations were underway in his department and once he found out what he should have known already, he enabled damage control mode. I'd accept that. But he's no heroic figure who put a stop to a corrupt operation. Not in my mind.
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November 21, 2011, 05:49 PM | #1554 |
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^^^Hardcase, Holder IMO was present at the birth of F+F, without the fine points of Wide Receiver, such as really tracing guns or taking down straw buyers. Those ideas were dropped because they weren't part of the objective. Holder might have stopped F+F as it zoomed out of control and into public view, and failed to produce the crisis his boss would fix...
The Obama regime has such a great batting average for bad ideas and failure it is impossible to write it all off to incompetence. Nobody is that consistently "successful". Incompetence surely has a big role, mostly in being too clever by half or just blindly uninformed. It's not enough to explain what they have done and its patterns.
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November 21, 2011, 05:58 PM | #1555 |
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Its a sad fact that no high ranking political appointee, much less Holder, is ever going to be held accountable for F&F. i seriously doubt that any political appointee will ever be held accountable: They almost never are.
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November 21, 2011, 06:00 PM | #1556 | |||
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1. Mexican authorities were notified of the plan and attempted to interdict weapons that crossed into Mexico. 2. The ATF made an effort to put tracking devices on the weapons. 3. Wide Receiver was shut down as a scandalous failure when a little less than 250 guns went missing. Quote:
How about DOJ sending Ronald Weich to testify that ATF had never walked guns to Mexico, and then later qualify that statement to say that ATF hadn't DIRECTLY walked guns to Mexico - a statement that even now needs to be qualified again given John Dodson's testimony (and recording and letters) showing that he sold weapons directly to the cartel at the behest of Dennis Burke? Quote:
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November 21, 2011, 06:24 PM | #1557 |
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This blather is further confirmation as to what the objective of F+F really was, and how weakly some in Congress think they can spin a story.
Disconnection from reality is no impediment at all for some to tell and others to buy a story that tells them what they want to believe. I guess it's part ideology, part a lack of critical thinking skills. Maybe too there is some tribalism or groupthink, that grasps any straw to justify what "everyone (in my group) knows". A blogger observed today that it seems some MSM people are not reporting news but reassuring their niche audience that the world really is what they think it is. This could be an explosive factor of civil destruction in the future.
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November 21, 2011, 10:24 PM | #1558 |
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Hardcase:
Re your characterizatuion of Holder as a "poor manager", I submit that you are are, re that terminology, generous to a fault. |
November 21, 2011, 10:36 PM | #1559 |
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Alan, I probably should have said "at best". I'm not really that generous I might have an open mind but it only opens so wide.
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November 21, 2011, 10:39 PM | #1560 |
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HarrySchell writes:
This blather is further confirmation as to what the objective of F+F really was, and how weakly some in Congress think they can spin a story. Disconnection from reality is no impediment at all for some to tell and others to buy a story that tells them what they want to believe. I guess it's part ideology, part a lack of critical thinking skills. Maybe too there is some tribalism or groupthink, that grasps any straw to justify what "everyone (in my group) knows". A blogger observed today that it seems some MSM people are not reporting news but reassuring their niche audience that the world really is what they think it is. This could be an explosive factor of civil destruction in the future. ------------------------ Well said sir, I don't think I could have done better myself. Seems that the Obama Administration is akin to a household implement, the corkscrew, in that like the corkscrew, there is nothing straight about Obama et al. Of course, corkscrews need to be shaped the way they are, in order to work. Can the same be said for administrations, I would hope not, but then who knows. |
November 21, 2011, 10:40 PM | #1561 |
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Hardcase:
Touche. |
November 22, 2011, 05:06 AM | #1562 |
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A note for anyone wishing to post a comment at the NYP link. The site truncates everything after the use of an ampersand. If you post "I believe that F and F is a bad program" you are fine. If you post "I believe that F&F is a bad program" is will post as "I believe that F".
I don't know why that is the way the site works.
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Gun Control: The premise that a woman found in an alley, raped and strangled with her own pantyhose, is morally superior to allowing that same woman to defend her life with a firearm. "Science is built up with facts, as a house is with stones. But a collection of facts is no more a science than a heap of stones is a house." - Jules Henri Poincare "Three thousand people died on Sept. 11 because eight pilots were killed" -- former Northwest Airlines pilot Stephen Luckey |
November 22, 2011, 09:34 AM | #1563 |
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News report traces the majority of sales of U.S. firearms to Mexican drug cartels to two major gun dealers in the United States: Department of State and Department of Defense.
Source: http://biggovernment.com/tstilson/20...g-cartel-guns/ |
November 22, 2011, 11:04 AM | #1564 |
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The question comes to mind - what is the overall goal. On a functional and operational level I have every belief the Hope and Change crew is incompetent and is trying to make its own news to support it beliefs.
They want more and further gun control so they create murder, mayhem and chaos by operations such as Felonious Failure. The state department would be more concerned with international agreements and relationships so the release of weapons to drug dealers might be to back one side or another. Overall it seems to be a insane policy though because no matter who you arm you can’t control how the weapons are used and the end result is instability not stability. (More Hope and Change incompetence) The really odd part is any DOD involvement because they have a duty to follow the orders of the civilian chain of command and a duty to protect our nation and this seems to be a direct conflict. It seems to me on a surface level that any order given in this regard was highly likely unlawful and the whole chain of command all the way to the Commander in Chief would bear the consequences and the responsibility. Still in the end (I don’t know enough about the Mexico situation to have an education opinion on its internal struggles) it seems the only reasonable outcome was murder on both sides of the border. I have said it before but if we weren’t a military super power Mexico would rightly be able to consider this the act of war that it is. Our national government armed felons and drug dealers with weapons that it expected would be used against our citizenry and Mexico’s citizens. You can be right or left or whatever on the political scale but there’s no getting around that US Agents were murdered without committing crimes and without a trial and without a judgment and that is a crime against the Constitution because it was an act our government funded and was the only reasonable expectation that a reasonable person could have. Also given the overall breath and apparent width of the operation the executive responsible for leadership of all these departments must be held responsible for the actions he had responsibility to know of and supervise. Our system has impeached itself even if our congress hasn’t.. this cannot stand...
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Molon Labe Last edited by BGutzman; November 22, 2011 at 04:24 PM. |
November 22, 2011, 11:46 AM | #1565 | |
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Even stupid lying politicians know that. Draw your own conclusion. |
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November 22, 2011, 12:50 PM | #1566 | |
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Alan writes:
Quote:
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November 22, 2011, 02:30 PM | #1567 | |
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November 22, 2011, 02:33 PM | #1568 |
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Harry:
Thanks for the kind words. I thought that my aphorism might catch someone's atteention. |
November 22, 2011, 04:03 PM | #1569 |
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Alan,
I had not seen it before. It is perfect. A corkscrew is pointed and can hurt people, and never has a hope of getting straight. Any dog can get a hind leg straighter if they want to, but a corkscrew...it can't change even if it wants to. It has few alternative uses, also! Use it too much and you end up incapacitated, ill and messy all over yourself... Hilarious and descriptive. Harry
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November 22, 2011, 05:54 PM | #1570 | |
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The weapons that are mostly talking about were sold/ transferred to Mexican Government agencies and then stolen and given to the Drug Gangs.
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November 23, 2011, 11:07 AM | #1571 | |
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November 23, 2011, 06:45 PM | #1572 | |
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November 23, 2011, 08:42 PM | #1573 |
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Watch the skirting into pure politics. Always a risk. Stay with the facts and avoid just ranting. Even if the rant might be valid. Otherwise we end up ranting about the faults of all politicians.
Thank you. Eat turkey and relax.
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November 23, 2011, 09:53 PM | #1574 |
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No turkey. Having Thanksgiving tacos.
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November 24, 2011, 04:11 AM | #1575 |
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I once heard it said "He's as crooked as a snake in a hurry."
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Gun Control: The premise that a woman found in an alley, raped and strangled with her own pantyhose, is morally superior to allowing that same woman to defend her life with a firearm. "Science is built up with facts, as a house is with stones. But a collection of facts is no more a science than a heap of stones is a house." - Jules Henri Poincare "Three thousand people died on Sept. 11 because eight pilots were killed" -- former Northwest Airlines pilot Stephen Luckey |
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