help identify please

georgedexter · July 6, 2005, 10:30 PM

Hi, Got this one from an auntie who had no clue. It's only markings are "7070d". Long rifled barrel,possable letters wg on top. Any body recognize make or model? Thanks glad I found you guys.(and gals).. George Dexter

**Mike Irwin** · July 6, 2005, 11:40 PM

Austrian Werndl, probably a Model 1873 Infantry Rifle, judging by the front barrel band.

A few seconds out on the web and I found this...

Go to this page. You'll find a lot of information...

http://www.militaryrifles.com/Austria/67Werndl.htm

**4V50 Gary** · July 6, 2005, 11:58 PM

Looks alike except one has an internal hammer and the other an external hammer. From the lock's action, you can see how it's a transitional gun utilizing a back action lock. Betcha in the one GeorgeDexter shows it has a sear/hammer combo. Saved themselves a part that way.

Sir William · July 6, 2005, 11:59 PM

Similar. I think it is a Spanish Eibar region Basque knock-off.

georgedexter · July 7, 2005, 05:38 AM

Any idea what the 7070d means?

**Mike Irwin** · July 7, 2005, 10:26 AM

"Looks alike except one has an internal hammer and the other an external hammer."

Say what?

To the best of my knowledge, ALL Werndl designs used an external hammer. The rotary breechblock would have made it very difficult to do an internal hammer.

The 7070d could be just about anything from a serial number to a marking added much later.

There should be QUITE a few markings on this rifle, from manufacturer to proofs.

"I think it is a Spanish Eibar region Basque knock-off."

That would be the first I've ever heard of the Spanish copying the Werndl, which had limited distribution and use.

Sir William · July 7, 2005, 01:29 PM

I see what I believe are signs of crude work. If you loo closely, there are angular differences between the hammers, there is a marked variance in the trigger and the angles of the piece behind the trigger assembly. The whole piece seems crude in construction.

**Mike Irwin** · July 7, 2005, 01:33 PM

To be honest, I noticed some discrepancies, too, but I think there are a number of viable explanations for that, ranging from a training rifle to a contract-made rifle to poorly done repairs.

Again, I've never heard of anyone making copies of the Werndl, but am definitely open to that possibility.

georgedexter · July 7, 2005, 08:23 PM

Still not finding LOTS of markings. Mostly #7070 and tiny "wg 881"
Also some small numbers and letters/crest carved in bottom of stock by rear sling. I think this makes it an 1881. Hope the better pix get you guys thinking somemore. Thanks. Drove 300 miles today to pick up an outboard.
Setteling down now for some hotdogs and beans.

**Mike Irwin** · July 8, 2005, 09:32 AM

WG881 is a typical marking style for Werndls (and pretty much all Austrian firearms).

The 7070d could be a serial number.

I'm seeing nothing that makes me think that this is anything other than an authentic Austrian Werndl.

July 6, 2005, 11:58 PM	#3
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,829	Looks alike except one has an internal hammer and the other an external hammer. From the lock's action, you can see how it's a transitional gun utilizing a back action lock. Betcha in the one GeorgeDexter shows it has a sear/hammer combo. Saved themselves a part that way. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

July 7, 2005, 05:38 AM	#5
georgedexter Junior Member Join Date: July 6, 2005 Posts: 3	thanks! Any idea what the 7070d means?

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July 6, 2005, 11:40 PM	#2
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,379	Austrian Werndl, probably a Model 1873 Infantry Rifle, judging by the front barrel band. A few seconds out on the web and I found this... Go to this page. You'll find a lot of information... http://www.militaryrifles.com/Austria/67Werndl.htm

July 6, 2005, 11:59 PM	#4
Sir William Senior Member Join Date: October 13, 2004 Posts: 3,261	Similar. I think it is a Spanish Eibar region Basque knock-off.

July 7, 2005, 10:26 AM	#6
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,379	"Looks alike except one has an internal hammer and the other an external hammer." Say what? To the best of my knowledge, ALL Werndl designs used an external hammer. The rotary breechblock would have made it very difficult to do an internal hammer. The 7070d could be just about anything from a serial number to a marking added much later. There should be QUITE a few markings on this rifle, from manufacturer to proofs. "I think it is a Spanish Eibar region Basque knock-off." That would be the first I've ever heard of the Spanish copying the Werndl, which had limited distribution and use.

July 7, 2005, 01:29 PM	#7
Sir William Senior Member Join Date: October 13, 2004 Posts: 3,261	I see what I believe are signs of crude work. If you loo closely, there are angular differences between the hammers, there is a marked variance in the trigger and the angles of the piece behind the trigger assembly. The whole piece seems crude in construction.

July 7, 2005, 01:33 PM	#8
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,379	To be honest, I noticed some discrepancies, too, but I think there are a number of viable explanations for that, ranging from a training rifle to a contract-made rifle to poorly done repairs. Again, I've never heard of anyone making copies of the Werndl, but am definitely open to that possibility.

July 8, 2005, 09:32 AM	#10
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,379	WG881 is a typical marking style for Werndls (and pretty much all Austrian firearms). The 7070d could be a serial number. I'm seeing nothing that makes me think that this is anything other than an authentic Austrian Werndl.