Drop in 10mm barrel

Topthis · March 7, 2013, 02:42 PM

Anyone ever try the drop in 10mm barrel in their 1911 .45's? I saw something on the internet about them. Says only need the barrel and the bushing and it will work in a .45 1911. Oh and obviously different magazines.

Hammerhead · March 7, 2013, 02:55 PM

Never tried it, but what about the extractor and ejector?

AZAK · March 7, 2013, 03:04 PM

Might be a bit more than that.

I have a Colt Delta Elite and it differs in quite a few "parts" compared to a Government in .45 auto.

One very notable difference would be the recoil spring strength. Shooting full house 10mm auto is very different than factory .45 auto. Huge pressure differences result in the need for a stronger recoil spring.

Your ejector, extractor, breech face, barrel, bushing, magazine, recoil spring, perhaps mainspring and firing pin spring, firing pin, I believe are all different.

I have considered the opposite, going from 10mm to .45 on a government frame; just to do it, as I already have Government .45 ACPs. At this point I just have different pistols for the different chamberings/cartridges.

Occasionally on gunbroker one can find a complete slide for either .45 ACP or Delta Elite. That might be the way to go. In my case, by the time I look at the time and expense I just end up with a different entire 1911 instead.

YMMV

Topthis · March 7, 2013, 03:06 PM

...sounded a little to simple to me. I did wonder about the extractor too.

Andrewh · March 7, 2013, 03:45 PM

never heard of anyone switching just the barrel from 45 to 10mm.

a few people have been lucky starting with a 9mm 1911 they were able to keep the 9mm ejector, but still had to swap top halfs to do the 10mm and 45 swaps with the same frame.

typically the only changes you can do with just a barrel starting with a 45 is 400 corbon.

starting with 9mm, you can do 38 super, 9x21 and seems like there is 1 more, but don't remember.

and if you happen to have a 10mm obviously you can swap out for 40 and 357 sig.

K1500 · March 7, 2013, 05:28 PM

You can drop a 10mm conversion barrel into a Glock 21 (45 ACP) and shoot 10mm with no other mods. I kind of doubt it would work as well in a 1911.

RickB · March 7, 2013, 06:25 PM

Yeah, the only differences between a 1911 in .45 and one in 10mm are the barrel, magazine, slide, frame, extractor, ejector, firing pin . . .
The main problem is the breechface, which varies with chambering. A lot of .40s on the market share a slide with the same company's .38 Super, or the Super shares with 9mm, as the dimensions are not too different, but .40 to .45 is too big a difference to allow one slide to work for both calibers.
SVI makes slides with interchangeable breechface inserts, allowing one slide to work for multiple chamberings. Big bucks.
Even if you got a complete 10mm top end, you'd still have a frame with a .45-specific feed ramp cut in it; the feed ramp is also somewhat caliber-specific. You might be able to make the frame work for both calibers, but you could get around that by using ramped barrels for both calibers. The barrel ramp replaced the ramp in the frame, so you're not trying to get one ramp to work for multiple calibers.

2ndAmendmentFounder · March 7, 2013, 07:41 PM

The two cartridges are completely different dimensions and geometry. you need will need to modify the extractor, ejector, feed ramp, magazine, barrel ,recoil spring etc.

You can do a conversion but it would necessarily include a slide, barrel, springs and magazine.

Some models of 9mm will interchange a barrel only swap or minor parts, mag and barrel.

The 9mm and .40 S&W case heads are almost identical and therefore easy to swap out without gunsmithing (drop in) but on the .45auto the case dimension differences are going to create more parts out of alignment. Look at hte new polymer pistols for a easy swap candidate.

igousigloo · March 7, 2013, 09:05 PM

Me thinks it just might be cheaper and hurt less to buy a 10mm.

1911A1 45/10MM · August 23, 2013, 04:38 PM

Greetings all. I have converted my springfield armory 1911 in 45 ACP to also use 10mm Auto ammo.
Contrary to popular belief, the only PART I needed was new barrel. Same Mag, barrel bushing, and upper reciever. The barrel is just thicker.
You DO, however, need to tweak the extractor a bit (not replace) to get it to reliable extract the 10mm cases. Upper reciever(slide) remains unmolested.
The reason I did it was because I also have a "parker" 10MM auto from "wyoming arms" and saw that the 45 and 10mm were the same except for the barrel. Got me thinking. I use the same mag as came with the SA pistol.
I have 30 years of gunsmithing experience but I must say that I did the whole "mod" with a belt sander, files, dremel, and time.
The hardest part is the extractor actually. I have to tune it a bit to swap barrels and go from one caliber tho the other at the range without incident. 45ACP is great, but at first the extractor would not pull out the smaller diameter 10 mm case reliably. I can cover the serial number and post pics to prove it. The GI spec 45 ACP is 5" barrel. The 10MM auto is actually a 40 S&W chamber reamed to 10mm. And, yes, the barrels are the same but for caliber. Slide says "45 ACP", barrel says " 40 S&W", it shoots 10MM auto and swaps back and forth.
PS. ONLY reason is to shoot pigs and to increase variety. 45 ACP still rules!

PPS: 10MM auto barrel is 6"

RickB · August 23, 2013, 04:48 PM

The unaltered .45 ACP frame feeds 10mm reliably from .45 mags? I wonder if using the .45 mags helps, compared to trying to feed from 10mm mags???

1911A1 45/10MM · August 23, 2013, 04:50 PM

maybe. But it works, and after two trips to the range, the third time it extracts both just fine.
The only real pain was the extractor. milled it so it would go close enough to grab 10mm, but had to reshape the front side's angle so it would slip past the bigger 45ACP case upon it's return to battery.

Hunter Customs · August 24, 2013, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Yeah, the only differences between a 1911 in .45 and one in 10mm are the barrel, magazine, slide, frame, extractor, ejector, firing pin . . .
The main problem is the breechface, which varies with chambering. A lot of .40s on the market share a slide with the same company's .38 Super, or the Super shares with 9mm, as the dimensions are not too different, but .40 to .45 is too big a difference to allow one slide to work for both calibers.

Rick is correct however you can add slide stop to the list.
Colt made 5 different slide stops and the 10mm is listed as a #4.

As Rick has pointed out the breech face is the big difference.
The ones I've measured the 40/10 measure 0.430 to 0.435, the 45 measures 0.480 to 0.490.
So were talking anywhere from 0.045 to 0.060 difference in breech face, keep in mind that most extractor claws will only be about 0.040 in depth.

Now the extractor themselves are different, it has to do with the extractor pad and the nose of the extractor.
The difference in the pad dimensions is 0.10 on the ones I've measured, the 10mm being thinner.
Keep in mind the pad thickness controls the amount of distance the extractor claw can move toward the center of the breech face.
Also the nose of the extractor is tuned differently, if one looks at the extractor rebate on the case of both cartridges it will be plain to see why.

Now the rim size of the two cartridges themselves is an issue that needs to be considered, the 10's I've measured will be 0.417 to 0.420 the 45's were 0.470 to 0.475, we are looking at a difference of 0.050 to 0.058.

Now factor in the slide to frame fit tolerances and all the tolerances I listed above, if you are lucky and they all stack in your favor the 10mm conversion may work on a gun setup for 45acp.

If they do work you still have feed ramp depths and angles, plus slide speed to deal with.

As for the mags, I've fed many 10 mm single stacks with CMC Shooting Star 45acp mags.

Best Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com

**Aguila Blanca** · August 24, 2013, 09:43 AM

It might be made to work (and we have one person who has already said he made it work), but it won't be right. Every 1911 maker offering a .40 S&W and/or 10mm model uses a different slide for those calibers. I have 1911s in 9mm, .40 S&W, .38 Super, and .45 Auto. The 9mm and .38 Super share slides, .40 is unique (I don't have any 10mm), and .45 is unique.

I converted a Para-Ordnance from .45 to .40. To make it work I bought a new Para ramped barrel, a new Para .40 S&W slide, a new firing pin, and a new extractor. (And new magazines, of course.)

Hunter Customs · August 24, 2013, 01:38 PM

Quote:

It might be made to work (and we have one person who has already said he made it work), but it won't be right.

Very true.

Quote:

Every 1911 maker offering a .40 S&W and/or 10mm model uses a different slide for those calibers.

Again very true, and I can assure anyone reading this that if all the makers of 1911 style guns could save money by using one slide and frame ramp for all calibers they would be doing so.

I've done a lot of 10mm conversions on Para P16's and have built several switch top guns (9mm, 9x23, 38 Super, 357SIG, 40S&W and 10mm) I always use caliber specific slides.
The 40/10/357 Sig use the same slide and everything in the 9 family can use the same slide.
That being said at one time I believe you could order a Caspian slide with a 9mm or 38 Super breech face.

Best Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com

KyJim · August 26, 2013, 09:16 PM

Just buy a 10mm. Then you can buy a "drop in" .40 SW barrel and spring. Some of the 10mm ammo being sold is no more stout than .40 SW but this would give you another caliber option. I plan on doing this at some point with my Dan Wesson 10mm, though I may have it fitted by a gunsmith.

March 7, 2013, 02:42 PM	#1
Topthis Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2005 Posts: 863	Drop in 10mm barrel Anyone ever try the drop in 10mm barrel in their 1911 .45's? I saw something on the internet about them. Says only need the barrel and the bushing and it will work in a .45 1911. Oh and obviously different magazines.

March 7, 2013, 03:04 PM	#3
AZAK Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2008 Location: the object towards which the action of the sea is directed Posts: 2,123	Might be a bit more than that. I have a Colt Delta Elite and it differs in quite a few "parts" compared to a Government in .45 auto. One very notable difference would be the recoil spring strength. Shooting full house 10mm auto is very different than factory .45 auto. Huge pressure differences result in the need for a stronger recoil spring. Your ejector, extractor, breech face, barrel, bushing, magazine, recoil spring, perhaps mainspring and firing pin spring, firing pin, I believe are all different. I have considered the opposite, going from 10mm to .45 on a government frame; just to do it, as I already have Government .45 ACPs. At this point I just have different pistols for the different chamberings/cartridges. Occasionally on gunbroker one can find a complete slide for either .45 ACP or Delta Elite. That might be the way to go. In my case, by the time I look at the time and expense I just end up with a different entire 1911 instead. YMMV __________________ The lowest paid college major/degree in this country after graduation... Elementary Education. Now, go figure...

March 7, 2013, 07:41 PM	#8
2ndAmendmentFounder Junior Member Join Date: January 17, 2013 Location: Charlestown, SC Posts: 4	You cant easily interchange .40 and .45 The two cartridges are completely different dimensions and geometry. you need will need to modify the extractor, ejector, feed ramp, magazine, barrel ,recoil spring etc. You can do a conversion but it would necessarily include a slide, barrel, springs and magazine. Some models of 9mm will interchange a barrel only swap or minor parts, mag and barrel. The 9mm and .40 S&W case heads are almost identical and therefore easy to swap out without gunsmithing (drop in) but on the .45auto the case dimension differences are going to create more parts out of alignment. Look at hte new polymer pistols for a easy swap candidate. __________________ NRA 2nd Amendment Task Force Founding Member NRA Distinguished Life Member - NRA Pistol Instructor Soo many guns, not enough range time

August 23, 2013, 04:38 PM	#10
1911A1 45/10MM Junior Member Join Date: August 22, 2013 Posts: 2	45/10MM auto Greetings all. I have converted my springfield armory 1911 in 45 ACP to also use 10mm Auto ammo. Contrary to popular belief, the only PART I needed was new barrel. Same Mag, barrel bushing, and upper reciever. The barrel is just thicker. You DO, however, need to tweak the extractor a bit (not replace) to get it to reliable extract the 10mm cases. Upper reciever(slide) remains unmolested. The reason I did it was because I also have a "parker" 10MM auto from "wyoming arms" and saw that the 45 and 10mm were the same except for the barrel. Got me thinking. I use the same mag as came with the SA pistol. I have 30 years of gunsmithing experience but I must say that I did the whole "mod" with a belt sander, files, dremel, and time. The hardest part is the extractor actually. I have to tune it a bit to swap barrels and go from one caliber tho the other at the range without incident. 45ACP is great, but at first the extractor would not pull out the smaller diameter 10 mm case reliably. I can cover the serial number and post pics to prove it. The GI spec 45 ACP is 5" barrel. The 10MM auto is actually a 40 S&W chamber reamed to 10mm. And, yes, the barrels are the same but for caliber. Slide says "45 ACP", barrel says " 40 S&W", it shoots 10MM auto and swaps back and forth. PS. ONLY reason is to shoot pigs and to increase variety. 45 ACP still rules! PPS: 10MM auto barrel is 6" Last edited by 1911A1 45/10MM; August 23, 2013 at 04:40 PM. Reason: forgot 1 detail

August 23, 2013, 04:50 PM	#12
1911A1 45/10MM Junior Member Join Date: August 22, 2013 Posts: 2	Could be. maybe. But it works, and after two trips to the range, the third time it extracts both just fine. The only real pain was the extractor. milled it so it would go close enough to grab 10mm, but had to reshape the front side's angle so it would slip past the bigger 45ACP case upon it's return to battery. Last edited by 1911A1 45/10MM; August 23, 2013 at 05:00 PM. Reason: forgot

March 7, 2013, 02:55 PM	#2
Hammerhead Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2004 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,432	Never tried it, but what about the extractor and ejector?

March 7, 2013, 03:06 PM	#4
Topthis Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2005 Posts: 863	...sounded a little to simple to me. I did wonder about the extractor too.

March 7, 2013, 03:45 PM	#5
Andrewh Senior Member Join Date: July 7, 1999 Posts: 966	never heard of anyone switching just the barrel from 45 to 10mm. a few people have been lucky starting with a 9mm 1911 they were able to keep the 9mm ejector, but still had to swap top halfs to do the 10mm and 45 swaps with the same frame. typically the only changes you can do with just a barrel starting with a 45 is 400 corbon. starting with 9mm, you can do 38 super, 9x21 and seems like there is 1 more, but don't remember. and if you happen to have a 10mm obviously you can swap out for 40 and 357 sig.

March 7, 2013, 05:28 PM	#6
K1500 Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2011 Posts: 163	You can drop a 10mm conversion barrel into a Glock 21 (45 ACP) and shoot 10mm with no other mods. I kind of doubt it would work as well in a 1911.

March 7, 2013, 06:25 PM	#7
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	Yeah, the only differences between a 1911 in .45 and one in 10mm are the barrel, magazine, slide, frame, extractor, ejector, firing pin . . . The main problem is the breechface, which varies with chambering. A lot of .40s on the market share a slide with the same company's .38 Super, or the Super shares with 9mm, as the dimensions are not too different, but .40 to .45 is too big a difference to allow one slide to work for both calibers. SVI makes slides with interchangeable breechface inserts, allowing one slide to work for multiple chamberings. Big bucks. Even if you got a complete 10mm top end, you'd still have a frame with a .45-specific feed ramp cut in it; the feed ramp is also somewhat caliber-specific. You might be able to make the frame work for both calibers, but you could get around that by using ramped barrels for both calibers. The barrel ramp replaced the ramp in the frame, so you're not trying to get one ramp to work for multiple calibers.

March 7, 2013, 09:05 PM	#9
igousigloo Senior Member Join Date: September 22, 2011 Location: central Ohio Posts: 135	Me thinks it just might be cheaper and hurt less to buy a 10mm.

August 23, 2013, 04:48 PM	#11
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	The unaltered .45 ACP frame feeds 10mm reliably from .45 mags? I wonder if using the .45 mags helps, compared to trying to feed from 10mm mags???

August 24, 2013, 09:43 AM	#14
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,468	It might be made to work (and we have one person who has already said he made it work), but it won't be right. Every 1911 maker offering a .40 S&W and/or 10mm model uses a different slide for those calibers. I have 1911s in 9mm, .40 S&W, .38 Super, and .45 Auto. The 9mm and .38 Super share slides, .40 is unique (I don't have any 10mm), and .45 is unique. I converted a Para-Ordnance from .45 to .40. To make it work I bought a new Para ramped barrel, a new Para .40 S&W slide, a new firing pin, and a new extractor. (And new magazines, of course.)

August 26, 2013, 09:16 PM	#16
KyJim Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2005 Location: The Bluegrass Posts: 9,142	Just buy a 10mm. Then you can buy a "drop in" .40 SW barrel and spring. Some of the 10mm ammo being sold is no more stout than .40 SW but this would give you another caliber option. I plan on doing this at some point with my Dan Wesson 10mm, though I may have it fitted by a gunsmith.