Never show your cards and don't bluff... - Page 2

scottaschultz · May 5, 2009, 09:28 AM

You're right, I don't have all the details. I don't want them and I certainly don't need them. All I know is that you seem to be walking proof of the old saying, "No good deed goes unpunished!"

God speed.

Scott

5whiskey · May 5, 2009, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Once they have attempted to break in , get spooked by the surprise and run off ... they will be back and now the element of surprise is gone. You are right back to the point of " they know I have an alarm now, what it sounds like , how it reacts etc....

And if they did attempt a B&E and my plan worked as anticipated, I WOULD invest in cameras the very next day to catch them on film next time. I couldn't really afford it, but it would be there... along with a newly adopted boxer.

Bear in mind I'm not really expecting this to happen, but I'm prepared. I'm not sure they would escalate things to the point of breaking in if they ever find out where I live. I'm not going out to get a dog and put in a camera system right now. I already have a very capable alarm, but even the most capable of one is more effective when it's presence isn't advertised. If they do decide to play that game, then it's money I'm going to have to spend to get big boxer/cctv system. I reiterate that all of this is primarily for when I'm not at home. I REALLY don't think they would invade home for the purpose of killing, but I do think they might break in to steal and get even. Don't construe my thought process to be that of "I'm baiting these boys in so I can legally create a situation to defend myself and cause them pain and grief". That's not what I want at all, but I get the impression that some of you believe that's what is going on.

And for the deterring the amatuers part... I'll replace doors all day long before I replace my guns. If a chump kicks the door every year, gets surprised and runs off, then that's better than a pro coming up with a plan to get what I have regardless. And no, it's not that I choose not to have signs because I'm praying I get the opportunity to shoot someone

onthejon55 · May 5, 2009, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottaschultz

This scares the hell out of me! Most of us here (I hope) keep firearms in our homes praying (or hoping if praying isn't your thing) that we will never have to use them. You, on the other hand, sound like the kind of person that can't wait to use them.

Scott

People like this do not scare me and shouldnt scare anyone else. If you are worried about getting shot then stay off his property and do not try to fight him.

AirForceShooter · May 5, 2009, 10:06 AM

Wheeler,
Take it one step further.
The choice of firing has been made when you draw.
It will not be changed.
It's draw and fire. No thought is involved anymore.

AFS

5whiskey · May 5, 2009, 11:14 AM

One more thing... thanks for the responses fellows. I appreciate it. Twellons, I appreciate your side and view on these matter. As always, there are always two sides to a matter... you see a sign as a good way to avoid a possible confrontation all-together. I certainly think that's rational. I personally think that a sign, at least in my situation, may as well say "be sure to cut the phone/cable line and have a plan to disable the sirens BEFORE you kick the door in". That's valid as well. You did bring up an excellent point that I hadn't completely thought through. If they do manage to attempt a B&E once, I will have to step up the game because they'll know what I have.

I don't mind input, even if it contradicts my own thoughts, as long as no one tries to insinuate that I'm seeking out a conflict. I didn't think my wording would lead to that impression, but different people take things differently. Long story short, thanks for the input.

Brian Pfleuger · May 5, 2009, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Take it one step further.
The choice of firing has been made when you draw.
It will not be changed.
It's draw and fire. No thought is involved anymore.

That is not good advice. There are many instances/scenarios wherein you may draw your gun and not fire. It is not only not illegal, it is specifically cited as justified in some laws and should be obvious from a common sense standpoint in certain situations.

Carne Frio · May 5, 2009, 11:54 AM

If you can, file a stalking charge and get a restraining order.
That way, it will be easier to prove malice on their part,
should you have to pull a trigger.

5whiskey · May 5, 2009, 12:05 PM

Quote:

If you can, file a stalking charge and get a restraining order.
That way, it will be easier to prove malice on their part,
should you have to pull a trigger.

A step ahead of ya there bud

. Appreciate the insight, but I already have court dates

Enoy21 · May 5, 2009, 12:07 PM

Wheeler , no problems my friend , I also see your side of it as well and again think alot will depend on weather this is your average , street punks that are wanting retaliation but not too brite or determined , or someone with a higher level of experience that knows what to do and how to do it.

I did learn alot from your posts about how to disable an alarm and some of the dangerous of having keypads in near by areas that they can easily destroy ( kill the alarm ).

5whiskey · May 5, 2009, 12:13 PM

hey, no worries wellons. No worries man. If anyone has any alarm questions I happily take PMs. I haven't been in the business for about 7 years now, but not too much has changed except the advent of internet monitoring. In that case you still have to have internet connection via cable/phone line so that still disables the alarms' monitoring.

Oh, and the keypad is safe. It can be smashed all they want to and the alarm is still operable (on all systems except ademco lynksis). It's the main control panel that is the real biggie. If you DO have an alarm, make sure you have a short delay. It also helps to put a good lock on the closet door that holds the main control panel, and to put alarm contacts on the crawl space door. Oh... didn't mean to get started again

Senator Vitaman · May 5, 2009, 01:38 PM

Quote:

but they know a place that I frequent

Don't frequent that place. They could see your car and follow you.

txbirddog · May 10, 2009, 03:34 PM

Quote:

I'm pretty sure these folks are armed, but I don't think they would use it.

5whiskey, NEVER, EVER UNDERESTIMATE YOUR OPPONENT!!!!

If there is more than one of them, they could goad one into doing what you "don't think they would use".

Kyo · May 10, 2009, 07:44 PM

yea, peer pressure to prove "your a man" makes idiots do stupid things beyond their own idiotic scope.

Dallas Jack · May 10, 2009, 08:06 PM

If a pro tries to break in he most likely cut the phone line sign or not. If you went to the trouble of hardening the alarm system why not do the same for the phone line. Also half a dozen dummy security cameras will go a long way to avoiding a break in whether it's a pro or amateur. The dummy cameras don't cost alot just be sure and get some that have a battery operated red LED on it and add a small piece of wire going into the attic for that little touch of realism. I don't know about your alarm but mine has a setting (instant) to set it off as soon as the contact is broken. This leaves no time for anything.

Do not under estimate anyones ability to find out where you live or just catch you making a stop on the way home. If you think they are serious with the threat your only options are legal fileings. You can not legally be proactive to circumvent the threat. You have to wait for them to make a move. Good luck.
Dallas Jack

racejmac · May 10, 2009, 08:20 PM

I learned a lesson a long time ago...

I learn more by watching and listening... The sound of my own voice affords me nothing.

5whiskey · May 10, 2009, 08:27 PM

Quote:

I learn more by watching and listening... The sound of my own voice affords me nothing.

Sage advice I could apply more often....

1shotonekill · May 10, 2009, 09:31 PM

whiskey...

Why do you have compromised phone lines on your security system? Don't know the details of your house but I'd make those phone lines invisible first. Maybe encased in rigid metal conduit that enters through the basement or other means that is not exposed and also not even visible from the exterior? How about a cellular backup? I've done security systems for LEO's that were always concerned about BG's coming after their families and can tell you there are many ways to make your system not only well secured from the planning BG but also keep the signs to let the less determined crooks know to stay away too.

5whiskey · May 10, 2009, 09:45 PM

I'm on a slab, the only way to secure the phone lines is through conduit and a lock box. It could be done... I probably should. I've thought about cell backup but I get discounted monitoring by doing everything myself. They don't take cell backup (or not DSC anyway)

You DO have a good point though. If I did have a crawl space where I could run the phone box into the crawl, I would. I wouldn't worry then. Even with a lock box and conduit, someone could circumvent by digging to get to bare wire. That may sound absurd but it would only take a couple of minutes. Maybe I over-think things. VERY few people would ever know to dig and find bare wire to cut.

A_McDougal · May 11, 2009, 10:02 AM

Maybe I missed it, but:
Restraining Order(s)
-allows the police to take more decisive action, earlier in the escalation

May 10, 2009, 09:45 PM	#43
5whiskey Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2005 Location: US Posts: 3,657	I'm on a slab, the only way to secure the phone lines is through conduit and a lock box. It could be done... I probably should. I've thought about cell backup but I get discounted monitoring by doing everything myself. They don't take cell backup (or not DSC anyway) You DO have a good point though. If I did have a crawl space where I could run the phone box into the crawl, I would. I wouldn't worry then. Even with a lock box and conduit, someone could circumvent by digging to get to bare wire. That may sound absurd but it would only take a couple of minutes. Maybe I over-think things. VERY few people would ever know to dig and find bare wire to cut. Last edited by 5whiskey; May 10, 2009 at 09:51 PM.

May 5, 2009, 09:28 AM	#26
scottaschultz Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2009 Location: Missouri Posts: 392	You're right, I don't have all the details. I don't want them and I certainly don't need them. All I know is that you seem to be walking proof of the old saying, "No good deed goes unpunished!" God speed. Scott

May 5, 2009, 10:06 AM	#29
AirForceShooter Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2005 Location: Sarasota (sort of) Florida Posts: 1,296	Wheeler, Take it one step further. The choice of firing has been made when you draw. It will not be changed. It's draw and fire. No thought is involved anymore. AFS

May 5, 2009, 11:14 AM	#30
5whiskey Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2005 Location: US Posts: 3,657	One more thing... thanks for the responses fellows. I appreciate it. Twellons, I appreciate your side and view on these matter. As always, there are always two sides to a matter... you see a sign as a good way to avoid a possible confrontation all-together. I certainly think that's rational. I personally think that a sign, at least in my situation, may as well say "be sure to cut the phone/cable line and have a plan to disable the sirens BEFORE you kick the door in". That's valid as well. You did bring up an excellent point that I hadn't completely thought through. If they do manage to attempt a B&E once, I will have to step up the game because they'll know what I have. I don't mind input, even if it contradicts my own thoughts, as long as no one tries to insinuate that I'm seeking out a conflict. I didn't think my wording would lead to that impression, but different people take things differently. Long story short, thanks for the input.

May 5, 2009, 11:54 AM	#32
Carne Frio Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 2008 Location: Near Fairbanks Alaska Posts: 829	If you can, file a stalking charge and get a restraining order. That way, it will be easier to prove malice on their part, should you have to pull a trigger.

May 5, 2009, 12:07 PM	#34
Enoy21 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2009 Posts: 240	Wheeler , no problems my friend , I also see your side of it as well and again think alot will depend on weather this is your average , street punks that are wanting retaliation but not too brite or determined , or someone with a higher level of experience that knows what to do and how to do it. I did learn alot from your posts about how to disable an alarm and some of the dangerous of having keypads in near by areas that they can easily destroy ( kill the alarm ).

May 5, 2009, 12:13 PM	#35
5whiskey Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2005 Location: US Posts: 3,657	hey, no worries wellons. No worries man. If anyone has any alarm questions I happily take PMs. I haven't been in the business for about 7 years now, but not too much has changed except the advent of internet monitoring. In that case you still have to have internet connection via cable/phone line so that still disables the alarms' monitoring. Oh, and the keypad is safe. It can be smashed all they want to and the alarm is still operable (on all systems except ademco lynksis). It's the main control panel that is the real biggie. If you DO have an alarm, make sure you have a short delay. It also helps to put a good lock on the closet door that holds the main control panel, and to put alarm contacts on the crawl space door. Oh... didn't mean to get started again

May 10, 2009, 07:44 PM	#38
Kyo Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2009 Posts: 897	yea, peer pressure to prove "your a man" makes idiots do stupid things beyond their own idiotic scope.

May 10, 2009, 08:06 PM	#39
Dallas Jack Senior Member Join Date: February 25, 2005 Location: Dallas Posts: 386	If a pro tries to break in he most likely cut the phone line sign or not. If you went to the trouble of hardening the alarm system why not do the same for the phone line. Also half a dozen dummy security cameras will go a long way to avoiding a break in whether it's a pro or amateur. The dummy cameras don't cost alot just be sure and get some that have a battery operated red LED on it and add a small piece of wire going into the attic for that little touch of realism. I don't know about your alarm but mine has a setting (instant) to set it off as soon as the contact is broken. This leaves no time for anything. Do not under estimate anyones ability to find out where you live or just catch you making a stop on the way home. If you think they are serious with the threat your only options are legal fileings. You can not legally be proactive to circumvent the threat. You have to wait for them to make a move. Good luck. Dallas Jack

May 10, 2009, 08:20 PM	#40
racejmac Junior Member Join Date: May 8, 2009 Posts: 1	I learned a lesson a long time ago... I learn more by watching and listening... The sound of my own voice affords me nothing.

May 10, 2009, 09:31 PM	#42
1shotonekill Junior Member Join Date: March 2, 2009 Posts: 2	whiskey... Why do you have compromised phone lines on your security system? Don't know the details of your house but I'd make those phone lines invisible first. Maybe encased in rigid metal conduit that enters through the basement or other means that is not exposed and also not even visible from the exterior? How about a cellular backup? I've done security systems for LEO's that were always concerned about BG's coming after their families and can tell you there are many ways to make your system not only well secured from the planning BG but also keep the signs to let the less determined crooks know to stay away too.

May 11, 2009, 10:02 AM	#44
A_McDougal Member Join Date: May 1, 2009 Posts: 48	Maybe I missed it, but: Restraining Order(s) -allows the police to take more decisive action, earlier in the escalation