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Old January 15, 2002, 06:25 PM   #1
Carbon_15
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Join Date: October 8, 2001
Location: Lexington, SC
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Avoid Botach tactical!

I ordered 2 boxes of Winchester 127gr +p+ SXT's from Botach's website near the first of October. Its now the middle of January and ONE box finaly got here...and thats only after jumping through the same set of hoops over and over. I kept sending the same responses to the same questions and ended up sending 15 copys of my ID to 15 seperate requests. I had finaly said to he!! with it and bought a box at the Gunshow. Well, Today I got one of the 2 boxes I ordered 3 monthes ago and it was not what was advertised!!!! Run, dont walk away for Botach Tactical. They had a picture of the box and bullet, depicting the brown and blue Ranger SXT box and a picture of the Lubalox bullet in a brass case. What showed up was the white box non-lubalox 127gr +p+ version.
Can someone clue me in to what the actual difference is. The white box non-lubalox SXT's felt quite a bit softer shooting than the Rangers, but not as soft as the Civilian SXT's I had as a controle group. The real Ranger +p+ SXT's caused some minor sting in my palm and a bit of trigger slap, not so with the Non-lubalox SXT's. I think they toned down the non-lubalox version a little bit. I wish I had a chrony.
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Old January 15, 2002, 06:51 PM   #2
blades67
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I have never dealt with botac because of similar posts on this forum over a year ago. :barf:
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Old January 15, 2002, 07:03 PM   #3
harrydog
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I've bought things from them twice (not ammo) and never had a problem. In fact, I was pleased that I received the items very promptly.
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Old January 15, 2002, 07:07 PM   #4
Kentucky Rifle
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Somebody always seems to say", I had a order that was perfect".

However, I've read so many complaints regarding Botac that I wouldn't order from them. And the complaints that I've read haven't all came from TFL, either. It's a disappointing and aggravating thing for orders to be wrong, late, or "lost". I've heard the same thing regarding Botac too many times. I like to place an order and get the product I paid for in just a few days. (Like the gun belt I received from Don Hume Leather today.) No muss, no fuss. The item just comes.

KR
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Old January 15, 2002, 07:24 PM   #5
Shmackey
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Botach's practices are legendary on BladeForums.com. Check out the Good, Bad, and Ugly section there.
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Old January 15, 2002, 07:35 PM   #6
Archer1440
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Sorry to hear that stuff about Botach. They seem to carry a lot of hard-to-find items. It's not the first time I've heard of problems with orders from them.

On the other hand, I can wholeheartedly recommend SKD Tactical for the items they carry. Fast and personal service, I was very impressed with how they handled my orders.

Another good one, with good selection, is Arizona Gun Runners.

Google searches will find either.
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Old January 15, 2002, 09:36 PM   #7
mguffey
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Botach Impractical

I also recently had a bad experience with this vendor.

When I started calling, I got an answer at 7:30 local time
and was told by a lady with an accent that customer
service wasn't yet open or available. So I called back
later and asked for customer service. Got the same lady
now posing as a customer service response person.

The long and short of it was that I got a credit a month
later and was left with an impression this is an outfit
run out of a backroom somewhere. For two months they
gave me a UPS tracking number for a package they never
gave over to UPS. Reason: items were not in stock.

Yes, they are still up to their strange ways... as we speak.
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Old January 15, 2002, 11:09 PM   #8
Coronach
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I am the 'other guy' with Botach

You ever wonder who ends up with the stuff they say was sent to you but never arrived? You ever wonder who has the good karma when you have the bad? Who is the Ying for your Yang?

That, my friends, is me.

I have never had a real problem with Botach. Sure, once something that I ordered was not in, but it was a small item (a pen, I think) that was bought on a lark. I have, in fact, had the opposite experience.

Botach has sent me stuff that I never ordered.

They also did not charge me.

When I called to advise them of this, they not only denied having made a mistake, the refused to pay to have it shipped back. I told them that I was just going to keep it, then, and they said that was fine, since the stuff didn't come from them and, presumably, did not exist.

No, I do not order from them anymore. Why?

Any gambler will tell you: quit while you're ahead.

Mike
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Old January 16, 2002, 12:37 AM   #9
Double Naught Spy
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I just love these posts. I have ordered from Botach more than 10 times and only once has my order not been completely filled.

Carbon_15, when you order originally did not arrive, why didn't you call back and cancel the order? If they are going to make it that hard on you, do business elsewhere.

I never buy anything from them that I need by a certain point and time. That being said, with the one exception, all the orders have been filled, shipped, and arrived within just a few days of my order.

A lot of customers who are upset with Botach and who can't get Botach to credit their credit cards for bad orders, returned stuff, or stuff that didn't arrive are people who simply don't know how to play the game. If a vendor, any vendor, does not refund money due to you that you charged on a credit card, then you simply challenge the charge through your credit card company. Over the years, I have had to do it 3 times and have always gotten my money back (credit card credited for the improper debit). That is one good reason to use a credit card for this sort of thing.

Sure, so Botach is evil, but you can get some really good deals from them as well.
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Old January 16, 2002, 07:38 AM   #10
ragingbull454
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Location: Portage, IN
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avoid miwallcorp.com

Just a suggestion:

Avoid miwallcorp.com. They were extremely unreasonable with me when I tried to place my order. The only thing that set me off was they required that you fax a hard copy of your credit card to them. I called my credit card co., and they advised me against it, and for good reason. They say they put it in a safe, but do they really? Who knows who is going to see it before it is locked away? They said they were too busy to call in for verification on credit cards. To me, that sounds like pure laziness.

I just didn't feel safe faxing my credit card to them. I offered to fax a copy of it to them, with the last 4 numbers scratched out, but they disallowed it.

On the other hand, natchezss.com, ammoman.com and cheaperthandirt.com are all good places. I find my ammo to be cheapest at cheaperthandirt.com. natchezss.com is good for gun parts, though. I did call them with a ton of questions, and they stayed on the phone with me until I felt that I fully understood their ordering policy. Unlike miwallcorp.com, you don't have to fax a hard copy of your credit card to them.

Its your decision, just watch out for miwallcorp.com. Personally, I don't want to take any risks for unauthorized charges, because I think it would be really hard to prove that I didn't make those charges, so I try to safeguard my information as best as possible.

Erick
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Old January 16, 2002, 12:09 PM   #11
Erik
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It seems that they have a habit of running out of stock, and not informing orderers.

If you're dealing with stocked items, you're in luck. The prices are right and the deliveries quick. I've received prompt delivery the two times I've used Botach.

If not... Well, the complaints will begin to mount up soon.

They really must fix their ongoing problems with consistancy.
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Old January 16, 2002, 03:58 PM   #12
pvanosta
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Location: Long Beach, CA
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I agree with Erik

I ordered 1000 rounds of IMI .45 ACP 230 FMJ ball amo.
I know this ammo to be powerful and accurate.
The Botach price is excellent ($193 delivered to my door).

Two days after ordering online, I got shipping confirmation. Can't complain about that...
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Old January 16, 2002, 05:19 PM   #13
Double Naught Spy
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Posts: 10,568
Right now, they have a pretty good sale on Sure Fire lights!
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Old January 17, 2002, 03:12 AM   #14
TheeBadOne
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I've bought many items from them over the past 2 years and have not had a problem. Good prices and timely service.
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Old February 2, 2002, 06:21 PM   #15
Acujeff
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Location: Boston
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I tried ordering from Botach a few months ago. They confirmed my order and claimed it was shipped, on the phone and through E-Mail.

Never got it. Had to register complaints through my credit card company and their BBB before Botach would credit back my card. They are consistently unreliable and irresponsible at best, and deceptive at worst.
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Old February 3, 2002, 05:13 PM   #16
bjdealer
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For further BAD MARKS, read my comments under "Inexpensive West Coast Ammo???"

They couldn't give a S... Less about Customer Service!!
:barf: :barf:
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Old February 4, 2002, 08:48 AM   #17
Monty Grubbs
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Location: City of Champions-Artesia, NM
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I have tried ordering a couple of times from Botach. Neither was a good experience. Each time, they did not have what I ordered in stock. They never let me know. Each time, about a month after ordering I worked the phones for a few days before finally getting thru to them. Then I could not understand what they were saying!!!

Nothing against people with ethnicities other than my own, but if you are going to sell something over the phone, in an English-speaking country, try to speak decent English!!

Long story short, they never had what I wanted, so I canceled my order each time.

I am not trying for a third time
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Old February 4, 2002, 12:37 PM   #18
geegee
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Coronach:
Quote:
Botach has sent me stuff that I never ordered
Man, I'm just imagining coming home and seeing a few large cartons on the doorstep. Inside are the dozen Colt 20 round AR mags I never ordered , accompanied by a case of Balck Talons I never ordered !!
And the they say they never sent it!!! Well, Merry Christmas geegee!
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Old February 5, 2002, 09:28 PM   #19
Tango 1
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Join Date: April 13, 2001
Posts: 5
I tried to order from them a couple of months ago, even after all the complaints I thought hey they have what I want.
BDU's in my LG Long size and boots onsale.
So I ordered 5 items total.
Had an email Conformation sent to me.
I thought great.
A few weeks goes by and I had forgot about my order, I received a email saying every item was out of stock and my order was canceled by them.
They didnt call and ask me if I wanted to try any other colors or anything just canceled it.
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Old February 7, 2002, 06:14 AM   #20
Legionnaire
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I like to order from Botach. It's sort of like hunting. Figure I'll get my deer sooner or later, but it's always an adventure! I have ordered and received many things from Botach that were far less expensive from them than anywhere else. Yes, I have horror stories as well . . .

- telephoned to see if a specific item/color/style is in stock
- have been told "yes."
- place my order
- get a call a couple days later: "color isn't in stock; is another okay?"
- tell 'em "no, it's not okay."
- "Shall we cancel your order?"
- No, just hold it until the correct color is in.
- Months and many phone calls later, I finally got the item . . . which I paid $149 for, $50 less than anywhere else I've found on the web and close to $100 less than any local retail outlet.

I've experience order errors in my favor, like a couple of others here. Hey, it's an adventure. Right now I'm wearing a pair of Royal Robbins pants I bought from them for far less than I've found them anywhere else.

I don't think they are intentionally deceptive. I just think they are incompetent. Their online order system sucks (allows you to place orders for things that are not in stock); their service folks you talk to on the phone seem a couple cards short of a full deck; and they deny they made errors even when you're holding stuff in your hand. I've gotten to the point where Botach is a place I love to hate. But I'll probably keep shopping there as when the price is right, the price is right. Always go by credit card, though, so you can contest charges on order that don't make it.

Go ahead! Order from Botach! As they say, "It's the hunt!"
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Old March 2, 2002, 11:18 PM   #21
Carbon_15
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Responce from BBB
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