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Old August 25, 2014, 01:55 PM   #1
Pond, James Pond
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DA trigger reach on CZ75s.

It happened with the great grip angle on Glocks and now it seems I've finally understood what people were talking about when they spoke of the trigger reach in DA on the CZ 75 platform.

After reading an excellent post just now on good ways of improving trigger control (talkin' about you, Frank!) I decided to do a spot of DA dry practice and all is well and good on my little .38, my Redhawk is fine, but on the SP-01, I fell that I need do dislocate my trigger finger to make it reach.

It is very hard to pull that trigger straight back as I first need to feed my finger tip round the trigger before I can exert any leverage.
Note that the gun is still virtually brand new. About 40-500 rounds through it about about half as many dry fires...

Can I fix this or mitigate it?

Conditions:
No gunsmiths
Only the most basic home smithing allowed
Nothing that involves sending it to CZ custom.
Nothing that will make the gun likely to light-strike etc

In other words, only drop-in CZ replacement parts.
Suggestions?
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Old August 25, 2014, 03:08 PM   #2
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I haven't used a CZ75 yet, but many in the Israeli National Police loved the TZ75, the Tanfoglio clone. I had used the BHP for a long time and just could not like the TZ75. I also found the DA reach to be too long, and the trigger had a very tinney, springy feel to it.
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Old August 25, 2014, 03:17 PM   #3
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That trigger is why I didn't buy one when they first came here 30 plus years ago. Too big for my hand.
Short of sewing on more finger there's nothing you can do. Mind you, the CZ 75 isn't a DA. Their SP line is though.
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Old August 25, 2014, 03:44 PM   #4
Jim Watson
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MY CZ75 is double action; DA/SA or SA selective, as Jeff Cooper would say.

I agree, the trigger reach is long.
I don't know of any CZ parts to reduce it.
There is a US firm making a Reach Reduction Kit but I don't know if they will send parts abroad.
http://cajungunworks.com/miscellaneous_items.html
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Old August 25, 2014, 04:26 PM   #5
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Cajungunworks is your best bet if he will send you parts and you are capable of putting them in the gun yourself.
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Old August 25, 2014, 04:37 PM   #6
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Could technically turn it SA Only and it would solve the problem but idk if you want to do that.



Though Cajun gunwork seems to be the solution.
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Old August 25, 2014, 05:01 PM   #7
Pond, James Pond
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Quote:
I don't know if they will send parts abroad.
Quote:
if he will send you parts
More relevant would be if US and Estonian customs let him!

Certain gun parts are controlled purchases over here, for example barrels: need to apply for those. And I know that a while back US customs did not allow bits that would fit guns to be shipped out of the US to private individuals, so if couldn't buy a scope from a US site.

Quote:
Could technically turn it SA Only and it would solve the problem but idk if you want to do that.
I'd rather not go down that route, and I seem to recall that IPSC don't allow SAO guns in their production categories.

Hmmm. I had hoped someone would offer some easy solution like the competition hammer for the camming issue.

Going to start hanging weights of my index finger...
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Old August 25, 2014, 05:07 PM   #8
Walt Sherrill
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Both the CZ Custom Shop and Cajun Gun Works have drop-in parts that will make the DA trigger pull less long. The problem is that I don't know that either of those businesses will EXPORT parts to your part of the world.

Check their websites.
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Old August 25, 2014, 05:30 PM   #9
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Yup was going to say it effectively ruins the gun for production.
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Old August 25, 2014, 05:49 PM   #10
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It's my understanding (someone will correct me if I'm wrong I'm sure) but with the 75B you can safely place the hammer on the half cock notch and carry the gun ready for a da first shot. This brings the trigger closer for a shorter trigger pull and still pulls the hammer fully back to allow for a full force strike of the primer. The method reduces the length of pull. Check with your manual to see it that's the case.

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Old August 25, 2014, 05:50 PM   #11
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Actually, in this case I'd say contact CZ-UB in Prague and see who they recommend for after market trigger reach reduction kits in Europe. I will say I have a CZ P-09 that had the "touch" by Cajun Gun Works, and while the difference looks small, the feel is really there.. As you say, US Customs is very wiggy about gun parts coming in or out - the trouble I had getting a 20 round vz-58 magazine in country was insane...the CZ-UB shop might have access to parts you or I can't get a hold of, and would know the legality of sending it to Estonia.
Good luck!


BTW, as stupid as this sounds - do you run the gun from the half cock notch? Is it decocker or safety model? There is a half cock notch for both, and the gun is designed to be carried there. Reduces reach and travel. Like this.

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Old August 25, 2014, 05:54 PM   #12
Pond, James Pond
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Quote:
BTW, as stupid as this sounds - do you run the gun from the half cock notch? Is it decocker or safety model? There is a half cock notch for both, and the gun is designed to be carried there.
TBH, this is mostly a race gun for IPSC, but I personally like getting proficient in DA as I believe if I can do that well, then SA should be a breeze.

However, in IPSC the courses start hammer down, be they loaded or chamber empty.

I don't carry the SP-01 due to its size and a condition 3 carry rule here that makes revolvers a better choice for CCW.
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Old August 25, 2014, 06:20 PM   #13
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in ISPC the hammer is down when the gun is un-loaded, but once you chamber it, it's in single action anyway, right? from unloaded, you put a magazine with a single cartdridge and charge the gun, releasing the mag showing you have a round in the chamber and your cocked and locked. then you insert the fully loaded mag and your off. that was just my understanding. you don't put the hammer back down after racking the slide, right? you put the hammer down when the gun is clear

as for condition 3 carry, same goes for that, once your charge the pistol, your in SA.

I'm with you if its something you want to do, but I don't undertand the need for, unless i'm understanding things wrong

*edit: I see you that you were just saying you do not carry it because of the condition 3 rule, I get it. not having anything to do with the trigger
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Old August 25, 2014, 06:39 PM   #14
Walt Sherrill
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Quote:
TBH, this is mostly a race gun for IPSC, but I personally like getting proficient in DA as I believe if I can do that well, then SA should be a breeze.
I suspect that few if ANY race guns based on the CZ pattern are DA/SA. I've never seen or read about any. Why is that? One reason might be that a CZ that can do both DA and SA can't use the best CZ trigger -- the two-way adjustable trigger. That trigger just won't work in a DA/SA gun.

A DA/SA race gun seems almost a contradiction in terms.

If you want to do IPSC Production, then practicing your DA/SA skills may be useful. But if you're serious about shooting against other RACE guns, mastering the DA trigger wouldn't really help you as much as becoming more proficient when starting from cocked & locked.
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Old August 25, 2014, 07:44 PM   #15
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I think he is using the term "race gun" as a generic for a competition only pistol in any division; not the jargon for a souped up compensated scoped Open gun.
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Old August 25, 2014, 08:03 PM   #16
Walt Sherrill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tipoc
It's my understanding (someone will correct me if I'm wrong I'm sure) but with the 75B you can safely place the hammer on the half cock notch and carry the gun ready for a da first shot. This brings the trigger closer for a shorter trigger pull and still pulls the hammer fully back to allow for a full force strike of the primer. The method reduces the length of pull. Check with your manual to see it that's the case.
That IS the case. And the half-cock notch is where the decockers leave the hammer when they are decocked. It's safe. (The decocker models based on the 75B design have only one hammer hook [with one removed to make room for the decocker mechanism]; the safety-equipped models have two.)

I'm not sure whether an IPSC Production gun is allowed to start from the half-cock notch. That was disallowed in IDPA in the past -- but I've not checked the IDPA rule book or heard a decision on that in the last couple of years.

Last edited by Walt Sherrill; August 26, 2014 at 10:59 AM.
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Old August 25, 2014, 08:08 PM   #17
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Cajun Gunworks:

http://www.cajungunworks.com/miscellaneous_items.html

Two people I work with have this kit in their pistols and they are both extremely happy with it.
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Old August 25, 2014, 08:09 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skizzums
in ISPC the hammer is down when the gun is un-loaded, but once you chamber it, it's in single action anyway, right? from unloaded, you put a magazine with a single cartdridge and charge the gun, releasing the mag showing you have a round in the chamber and your cocked and locked. then you insert the fully loaded mag and your off. that was just my understanding. you don't put the hammer back down after racking the slide, right? you put the hammer down when the gun is clear
If he is shooting production he will have to draw and fire the first shot DA. And since there is no point shooting minor in limited, he will need to fix the double action reach if he intends to compete in production. Don't know the official word for the rules but those are it. Hence why the 75 SA and Shadow SA isn't legal in production.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncgU...s-pDKYOIdcX1Bg

Buddy of mine shooting his cz-75 Shadow you'll see him put the hammer down.
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Old August 25, 2014, 08:19 PM   #19
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okay, I was just mis-understanding the rules then. thanks
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Old August 25, 2014, 08:30 PM   #20
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No problem i don't know the rules verbatim, just know this case in particular. Because i wanted to do just that grab a shadow SA only and run production. Or convert a SP01 SA and run production. Which i'll probably still run an SP01 SA only but i doubt i ever shoot production, if i do it's likely with a striker fired handgun.
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Old August 25, 2014, 08:47 PM   #21
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Pond, James Pond,

I'd give a call to Angus over to the CZ custom shop in Mesa, AZ. I think they will be well informed of what parts kits may be available as well as options for you.

A link to them here...

http://czcustom.com/

You could also check at the CZ forum.

The Beretta 92 is seen in the games so da/sa ain't uncommon but it's complicated by the longer reach for the CZ 75B trigger. So either that issue is resolved or you need another CZ.

CZ builds guns for a variety of competitive games.

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Old August 25, 2014, 11:39 PM   #22
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Assuming you have the standard black rubber grips, even changing out to something like VZ grips can make a huge difference for hopefully not a ton of money.
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Old August 25, 2014, 11:54 PM   #23
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Or the Aluminum CZ grips which are even thinner, they basically run with the frame contour. Though they can be pricey i think i saw them for 65$ either at cajun or czcustom.
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Old August 26, 2014, 01:21 AM   #24
Pond, James Pond
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When I say Race Gun, I mean "my" race gun, rather than "a" race gun.

I run production category and stages start hammer down. If that is chamber loaded, then first shot is DA.

Aluminium grips are an option, certainly. Perhaps I should take my grips off and see what the reach is like with a bare frame.

CZ Custom: I can certainly call them, but I strongly suspect that they will have no options for me due to shipping constraints and a lack of knowledge surrounding EU stock.
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Old August 26, 2014, 06:40 AM   #25
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i think it's something like 17". kind of tough to reach without some kind of mechanism or using your off hand to start the trigger pull. i've rigged up a trigger bar on mine similar to that of a bullpup rifle. it makes the trigger feel a bit mushy, but you get used to it.
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