Bolt assembly question

odugrad · January 11, 2014, 07:34 PM

I just bought a Daniel Defense V3 today and shot it. When I was home cleaning it I noticed a lot of crud on the bolt assembly right behind the rings. Is this normal?

5whiskey · January 11, 2014, 07:39 PM

Yes it is... especially if it's the rear of the bolt that tapers down to just a little bigger than the firing pin. You will find that all of the other crud on the BCG is pretty easy to clean off, but there is always some baked on carbon in this area and sometimes on the base of the firing pin that is almost impossible to get off. I used to obsess over trying to keep it cleaned off... but it's more trouble than it's worth IMO.

**44 AMP** · January 11, 2014, 07:53 PM

Quote:

I used to obsess over trying to keep it cleaned off... but it's more trouble than it's worth IMO.

its worth the trouble if the alternative is "DROP and give me 50 MAGGOT!", and then, clean it anyway.

Functionally, the AR system can built up a lot of this crap in that place, and still work. My DI, however never could see the rational of that argument...

odugrad · January 11, 2014, 08:52 PM

Should I even worry about cleaning it off? Is it odd that the rifle is brand new and has a lot of build up so soon?

Ritz · January 11, 2014, 10:48 PM

How many rounds did you put through it? And what brand/type of ammo?

5whiskey · January 12, 2014, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Should I even worry about cleaning it off? Is it odd that the rifle is brand new and has a lot of build up so soon?

I always clean what I can off... but if you're trying to get it all off then you'll be there for a while.

Quote:

its worth the trouble if the alternative is "DROP and give me 50 MAGGOT!", and then, clean it anyway.

Been there and done that, sir. One of the biggest reasons I don't stress over it now is because I was forced to stress over it at one point

. At any rate, I'm pretty anal about keeping my guns clean (not really in the "over-cleaning" wears em' out faster camp) and I'm a believer in cleaning the loose crud out of this area but I repeat that I wouldn't worry about trying to get all of the baked-on carbon off of the rear of the bolt. For one, it doesn't affect anything. Heck, it doesn't even dirty anything. After you've cleaned all the loose crud off the bolt you can white glove it around the back and barely see anything on the glove. You know it's there, though, if you look at the bolt through good light. I just let that be as it's more trouble than it's worth. I tried to get it off (for a change) of the last new AR I bought after the first range trip. Nearly an hour with a bronze brush didn't do it. Out comes steel wool. A few minutes with the steel wool and I decide that I'm done. The only quick way to get it off is to scratch it off with a knife (what I did when I was in the Marine Corps). I don't care to do that to my guns, so the baked on stuff stays.

odugrad · January 12, 2014, 07:41 AM

I fired about 120 rounds of Fiocchi ammo through it.

PawPaw · January 12, 2014, 07:55 AM

Quote:

I fired about 120 rounds of Fiocchi ammo through it.

Evidently, that's enough to do it.

I don't obsess over it either. Like others, I learned to maintain an M16 while under the tender mercies of a drill instructor. I get it, but I also understand that what they were doing was not so much rifle maintenance as military discipline instruction.

Quote:

Is it odd that the rifle is brand new and has a lot of build up so soon?

Nope, it's not odd. Perfectly normal. That's how the rifle operates and that's where the gasses from the cartridge find their way into the operating system. That's how it's supposed to work.

Quote:

Should I even worry about cleaning it off?

Well, as a general rule, you should try to clean your rifle, but many of us learned a long time ago that a little baked-on carbon in that area isn't something to obsess over. I scrape it off once a year or so, but as long as you don't have loose crud in there, the carrier group should continue to operate as designed.

Ritz · January 12, 2014, 09:36 AM

With my previous Colt AR, over about 25-ish years, I think I scraped the crud off the bolt maybe 3 or 4 times over the course of maybe 6-8000 rounds. I agree with the previous poster who said to just make sure you get all the loose crap out of there when you do your normal cleaning and then when you see the carbon build-up getting heavy, you can disassemble and go to town on it. A couple of boxes of ammo is more than enough to give the appearance of it being "dirty."

Of course, for those OCD types, there's certainly nothing wrong with giving the bolt a full strip and clean after every usage. I just never found it to be necessary.

Happy shooting!

odugrad · January 12, 2014, 01:42 PM

Also, not to change subjects, but I noticed a lot of smoke coming from the barrel when I was shooting it for the first time. Is this normal, too?

marine6680 · January 12, 2014, 02:15 PM

Yeah... that is oil burning off creating that smoke.

odugrad · January 12, 2014, 03:37 PM

The smoke isn't damaging anything, is it?

Ritz · January 12, 2014, 05:35 PM

Heh...no, it isn't damaging.

Derbel McDillet · January 12, 2014, 06:53 PM

I scrub off what little I can of the carbon buildup with an old brass bore brush and then apply a generous amount of oil to the carbon that remains to prevent corrosion. I dont obsess over it. Been doing it this way for almost 40 years and it's worked well for me.

As for the smoking barrel, it's not a problem. Neither is a glowing cherry red gas tube when you shoot two or three magazines rapid fire.

marine6680 · January 12, 2014, 07:40 PM

Sometimes in rapid fire, the thin outer coat of oil on the barrel can cook off... sometimes its old cleaning product still in nooks and crannies.

Other times, if after only a couple shots, it can mean you just had a little too much oil in the barrel and chamber last time you cleaned.

The smoke won't hurt a thing... but don't leave too much oil in your barrel after cleaning, not really damaging necessarily, just not good practice. After cleaning, use a clean patch with a few drops of oil, then follow it with a dry patch, that will leave a thin layer inside for protection.

Dfariswheel · January 12, 2014, 07:43 PM

If you want or need to clean the bolt and carrier there are two main methods:

One is to use a carbon removal liquid cleaner like Slip 2000 Carbon Killer.
This is a human and gun safe cleaner that, along with a little brushing removes most of the fouling.

The second method is mechanical. This method uses a special scraper tool that removes the carbon from the tail of the bolt, from the inside of the carrier, and from the front of the flange on the firing pin.

The best are the CAT 4 tool and the Otis BONE tool:

http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-to...prod31857.aspx

http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-to...prod57170.aspx

I haven't tried the Otis BONE tool but I use the CAT 4 with excellent results.

I regularly use Slip 2000 Carbon Killer on the muzzle brake of my AK-74.

January 11, 2014, 07:34 PM	#1
odugrad Senior Member Join Date: March 13, 2013 Location: The East Coast Posts: 477	Bolt assembly question I just bought a Daniel Defense V3 today and shot it. When I was home cleaning it I noticed a lot of crud on the bolt assembly right behind the rings. Is this normal?

January 11, 2014, 07:39 PM	#2
5whiskey Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2005 Location: US Posts: 3,676	Yes it is... especially if it's the rear of the bolt that tapers down to just a little bigger than the firing pin. You will find that all of the other crud on the BCG is pretty easy to clean off, but there is always some baked on carbon in this area and sometimes on the base of the firing pin that is almost impossible to get off. I used to obsess over trying to keep it cleaned off... but it's more trouble than it's worth IMO.

January 11, 2014, 08:52 PM	#4
odugrad Senior Member Join Date: March 13, 2013 Location: The East Coast Posts: 477	Should I even worry about cleaning it off? Is it odd that the rifle is brand new and has a lot of build up so soon?

January 11, 2014, 10:48 PM	#5
Ritz Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2013 Location: Virginia Posts: 283	How many rounds did you put through it? And what brand/type of ammo?

January 12, 2014, 07:41 AM	#7
odugrad Senior Member Join Date: March 13, 2013 Location: The East Coast Posts: 477	I fired about 120 rounds of Fiocchi ammo through it.

January 12, 2014, 09:36 AM	#9
Ritz Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2013 Location: Virginia Posts: 283	With my previous Colt AR, over about 25-ish years, I think I scraped the crud off the bolt maybe 3 or 4 times over the course of maybe 6-8000 rounds. I agree with the previous poster who said to just make sure you get all the loose crap out of there when you do your normal cleaning and then when you see the carbon build-up getting heavy, you can disassemble and go to town on it. A couple of boxes of ammo is more than enough to give the appearance of it being "dirty." Of course, for those OCD types, there's certainly nothing wrong with giving the bolt a full strip and clean after every usage. I just never found it to be necessary. Happy shooting!

January 12, 2014, 01:42 PM	#10
odugrad Senior Member Join Date: March 13, 2013 Location: The East Coast Posts: 477	Also, not to change subjects, but I noticed a lot of smoke coming from the barrel when I was shooting it for the first time. Is this normal, too?

January 12, 2014, 02:15 PM	#11
marine6680 Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2012 Location: Parker, CO Posts: 4,594	Yeah... that is oil burning off creating that smoke.

January 12, 2014, 03:37 PM	#12
odugrad Senior Member Join Date: March 13, 2013 Location: The East Coast Posts: 477	The smoke isn't damaging anything, is it?

January 12, 2014, 05:35 PM	#13
Ritz Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2013 Location: Virginia Posts: 283	Heh...no, it isn't damaging.

January 12, 2014, 06:53 PM	#14
Derbel McDillet Junior member Join Date: September 6, 2013 Location: Kitsap County, Washington Posts: 316	I scrub off what little I can of the carbon buildup with an old brass bore brush and then apply a generous amount of oil to the carbon that remains to prevent corrosion. I dont obsess over it. Been doing it this way for almost 40 years and it's worked well for me. As for the smoking barrel, it's not a problem. Neither is a glowing cherry red gas tube when you shoot two or three magazines rapid fire.

January 12, 2014, 07:40 PM	#15
marine6680 Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2012 Location: Parker, CO Posts: 4,594	Sometimes in rapid fire, the thin outer coat of oil on the barrel can cook off... sometimes its old cleaning product still in nooks and crannies. Other times, if after only a couple shots, it can mean you just had a little too much oil in the barrel and chamber last time you cleaned. The smoke won't hurt a thing... but don't leave too much oil in your barrel after cleaning, not really damaging necessarily, just not good practice. After cleaning, use a clean patch with a few drops of oil, then follow it with a dry patch, that will leave a thin layer inside for protection.

January 12, 2014, 07:43 PM	#16
Dfariswheel Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2001 Posts: 7,479	If you want or need to clean the bolt and carrier there are two main methods: One is to use a carbon removal liquid cleaner like Slip 2000 Carbon Killer. This is a human and gun safe cleaner that, along with a little brushing removes most of the fouling. The second method is mechanical. This method uses a special scraper tool that removes the carbon from the tail of the bolt, from the inside of the carrier, and from the front of the flange on the firing pin. The best are the CAT 4 tool and the Otis BONE tool: http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-to...prod31857.aspx http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-to...prod57170.aspx I haven't tried the Otis BONE tool but I use the CAT 4 with excellent results. I regularly use Slip 2000 Carbon Killer on the muzzle brake of my AK-74.