The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The North Corral > Black Powder and Cowboy Action Shooting

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old November 13, 2013, 02:53 PM   #1
TomADC
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2009
Posts: 554
So it might be loaded!

Member off another board bought a old spanish smooth bore percussion about 28 gage. He just did the dowel check to see if its loaded and looks like it is.
Since he has no idea what its loaded with how would you safely clear it?
__________________
US Navy Retired,NRA Life Member,SASS member, Time magazine's Person of the Year 2006!
TomADC is offline  
Old November 13, 2013, 03:07 PM   #2
maillemaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 30, 2010
Posts: 1,013
CO2 discharger.

http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product...j5du71hk5d6rq1

Steve
maillemaker is offline  
Old November 13, 2013, 03:38 PM   #3
robhof
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 16, 2007
Posts: 701
robhof

Oil the bore with some light vegetable oil, try to get oil behind the charge as well to nullify the powder and ease the discharge. Besides the CO2 discharger, if you have a good compressor or access to one with a tank with 120psi or above, you can use a spray nozzle and a short length of heavy rubber tubing, like brake line or grease hose and connect to the percussion cap and spray nozzle and power it up, be sure muzzle of gun is facing in a safe direction.
robhof is offline  
Old November 13, 2013, 04:58 PM   #4
indy1919
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 15, 2011
Posts: 277
Has anyone seen the c02 discharger advertised in dixiegunworks in use before??? It almost looks to small & simple to work.
indy1919 is offline  
Old November 13, 2013, 05:02 PM   #5
maillemaker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 30, 2010
Posts: 1,013
I own one. I don't think I bought it from Dixie but I own the same one. It works fantastically. It has saved at least 3 days at the range when I had a shot that would not go off. Twice from oil fouling and once I was not paying attention and double-loaded. I noticed the double load when my ramrod did not go down to its usual position.

CO2 blows it right out. I'll never fart around with a ball puller again.

Steve
maillemaker is offline  
Old November 13, 2013, 05:52 PM   #6
Captchee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 2, 2013
Posts: 313
Warning .
Oiling the charge will NOT nullify the charge . again it will NOT nullify a BP charge . the only thing it will do is raise the ignition temperature .
I have personally had old original charges go off while heating breech plugs after those barrels have been set to soak in oil tanks for up to a week ..
At one time I thought this not to be the case .

Its not uncommon to Buy loaded muzzle loading guns , be they original or reproductions . I have bout barrels from e-bay that showed up loaded with old original charges .
a lot of times people don’t even know they are loaded . I have even had cases where people brought me old guns that after I informed them they were loaded , they remarked how they had played with the gun when they were kids , even to the point of holding matches to the nipples and such.
Anyway , some years back I was working on an original set of SXS barrels that were over 130 years old . The barrels had a charge in them so I set them in a 50 gal drum of oil for over a week .
I then removed th barrels and drilled through the charge . What came out looked like dirt .
I then removed the nipples and drilled through the flash channel .
We went to de breech the barrels and found the plugs would not budge . So we went to apply some heat .a torch was held to the flash channel for a couple second with no ignition . So we ste the barrel to a barrel vice and began to heat the plugs while apply pressure from a breech plug wrench . Just as the first plug began to turn the barrel went off . A split second later the 2nd barrel went off .

Even though charges had been drilled and air could be pushed through the bore . There was still enough powder in the 12 gage bores to blow 2 ,1 inch deep holes in the floor .

Never ever think that concerning BP that you have nullified the charge . Even if you soak it in water . All the chemicals are still there unless the powder is actually rinsed completely out , the only thing you will do is raise the ignition temperature. Once it dries out or the resulting paste reaches the required temperature , it will go off

Co2 discharges work and work well as long as the charge has not set to strongly to the bore .
If the discharger does not blow the charge what I often do is try an air compressor. If that wont budge it , then carfuly remove the nipple and replace it with a grease zert . Use a grease gun to start to move the charge . One it moves or begins to move , then go back to the air compressor to blow it the rest of the way out .
If this is an original piece and the charge has set itself , there is a good chance the bore in the area of the charge will have been damaged beyond repair

Last edited by Captchee; November 13, 2013 at 06:12 PM.
Captchee is offline  
Old November 14, 2013, 08:52 AM   #7
4V50 Gary
Staff
 
Join Date: November 2, 1998
Location: Colorado
Posts: 16,849
Agree that one should not rely on oil to kill the powder. It's the moisture that does it. Still, with the muzzle pointed in a safe direction, use the C02 discharger to unload it.
__________________
Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. Molon Labe!
4V50 Gary is offline  
Old November 14, 2013, 10:30 AM   #8
shortwave
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 17, 2007
Location: SOUTHEAST, OHIO
Posts: 5,937
+1 on the C02 charger or compressor.

I use an air compressor simply cause that's what I have ... but have used the C02 charger's with great success as well.

On the real stubborn loads, pour some soapy water or oil down the bore for softening/lubing purposes only. Then use the C02 or compressor.

Last edited by shortwave; November 16, 2013 at 03:13 PM.
shortwave is offline  
Old November 14, 2013, 10:54 AM   #9
Sure Shot Mc Gee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 2, 2012
Posts: 2,053
Change out the nipple with a Grease Zerk Fitting (metric size probably) and pump grease into the barrel to dislodge a load safely. Sometimes those little spendy CO-2 thingy's just don't have enough excessive pressure to get the job done before their little air cartridge tank is empty. I've never seen a pumped in greased job ever fail. A little messy to clean up afterwards. But it works. And the grease used is recyclable. (Just encase your pick-up needs a grease job too.)
Sure Shot Mc Gee is offline  
Old November 14, 2013, 11:19 AM   #10
TomADC
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2009
Posts: 554
Another member lives close to him and has the stuff and knowledge to empty the gun.
__________________
US Navy Retired,NRA Life Member,SASS member, Time magazine's Person of the Year 2006!
TomADC is offline  
Old November 14, 2013, 05:52 PM   #11
Pahoo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 16, 2006
Location: IOWA
Posts: 5,588
maillemaker + 8 or so.

Not to do over-kill on the CO2 Discharger but to really emphasis their performance. I currently use the one from Dixie but I bought mine else where and mine came with more accessories. I have pushed most of the common projectiles and on two occasions, stuck ramrods. These work great and if used properly, are very safe !!!


Be Safe !!!
__________________
'Fundamental truths' are easy to recognize because they are verified daily through simple observation and thus, require no testing.
Pahoo is online now  
Old November 16, 2013, 12:41 PM   #12
TomADC
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2009
Posts: 554
Should know today what they found, it surprises me just how many old muzzleloaders turn up loaded when sold..
__________________
US Navy Retired,NRA Life Member,SASS member, Time magazine's Person of the Year 2006!
TomADC is offline  
Old November 16, 2013, 05:09 PM   #13
44 Dave
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 24, 2013
Posts: 111
This old man once told me "two useless things are a unloaded gun and an empty whiskey bottle".
44 Dave is offline  
Old November 28, 2013, 10:17 AM   #14
Ozzieman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 14, 2004
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 4,964
Air compresses and water does not. Wouldn’t it be safer to use water under pressure? Don’t know how you would do it but 120 PSI sounds a little high when it finally let’s go.
__________________
“Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading.” – Thomas Jefferson.

Politician's are like diapers.
You need to change them often,,,,, for the same reason!
Ozzieman is offline  
Old November 28, 2013, 02:02 PM   #15
Boomer58cal
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 18, 2013
Location: closer than you think
Posts: 968
The co2 dischargers work pretty good, but I've seen a ball stuck after 20 or 25 rounds on the range without running a patch down the bore that the discharge wouldn't even budge. It's always good to have a manual ball puller just in case.

Boomer
__________________
The number one cause of death in the 20th century. 290,000,000 citizens were first disarmed and then murdered by their own governments. This number does not include those killed in war.
We're from the government, we're here to help
Boomer58cal is offline  
Old November 28, 2013, 02:21 PM   #16
4V50 Gary
Staff
 
Join Date: November 2, 1998
Location: Colorado
Posts: 16,849
Quote:
This old man once told me "two useless things are a unloaded gun and an empty whiskey bottle".
I have teachers who kept their muzzle loaders loaded. That was a practice in the frontier days. That said, I wouldn't sell one that was loaded nor would I want to examine a loaded gun prior to buying it. I want to know it's loaded first.
__________________
Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. Molon Labe!
4V50 Gary is offline  
Old November 28, 2013, 07:55 PM   #17
Pahoo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 16, 2006
Location: IOWA
Posts: 5,588
Getting lazy, I guess !!!

Quote:
It's always good to have a manual ball puller just in case.
In the early years, I had a CO2 TC discharger that I hardly used. This was during my BuckSkinner days and pretty much took a bit of bride about pulling a dry-ball, manually. When teaching some of the new M/L instructors, I would purposely dry-ball and then demonstrate the process of manually pulling. Many M/L instructors had a real dry-ball phobia. They felt more confident after this pulling exercise. ......

Then one day, we met our Waterloo when we had a stuck ramrod. I was forced to use the pusher and with a "Thunk" the rod went flying into the bank. After that on other stuck rods as well as plated projectiles, started using them on a regular basis. Heck, now instead of popping a cap prior to loading, I use my CO2. .....

Be Safe !!!
__________________
'Fundamental truths' are easy to recognize because they are verified daily through simple observation and thus, require no testing.
Pahoo is online now  
Old November 29, 2013, 01:08 PM   #18
shortwave
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 17, 2007
Location: SOUTHEAST, OHIO
Posts: 5,937
Quote:
Don’t know how you would do it but 120 PSI sounds a little high when it finally let’s go.
Whether using the C02 or an air compressor, if muzzle is pointed in a safe direction when used, it doesn't matter.

Far as how to do it? Somewhere around here is an air valve I made up years ago that would thread into my Hawkins. Never had to use it.

I have a rubber tipped blow gun that I've always had success with. Remove the nipple, press the rubber tipped blow gun down in nipple port and use short burst of air. On really jammed loads, pour TC13 or soapy water down the bbl. and let set for 5-10 mins.
Have had a couple over the years people have brought to me that I had to leave the TC13/soapy water set in for a couple hrs or so before any success but from the looks of lack of maintenance on the entire rifle, it was hard telling how long the thing set loaded.

On one CVA I remember doing many years ago, I had to end up pouring automatic trans. fluid into the breech, plugging the breech, then pouring some down the bore as well and letting it set for a couple days.
After dumping the ATF out, the load, with the jag of the busted off ball puller left there by when the owner was previously tryin to pull load, pushed out rather easily.
shortwave is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:50 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.10654 seconds with 9 queries