The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Art of the Rifle: Semi-automatics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old June 20, 2013, 09:54 PM   #1
rmocarsky
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 27, 2009
Posts: 367
Hornady .30 Carbine

Gunners,

Just saw this month Rifleman inside cover Hornady now makes critical defense ammo for .30 Carbine.

Wonder if this would significantly improve the little carbine's effectiveness on whitetail?

Rmocarsky
rmocarsky is offline  
Old June 20, 2013, 10:12 PM   #2
slim9300
Member
 
Join Date: January 7, 2013
Posts: 72
Hornady .30 Carbine

I wonder if that ammo might lack penetration for deer sized animals? Isn't self-defense ammo designed to penetrate roughly 8-10" into soft tissue?
slim9300 is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 03:09 AM   #3
rmocarsky
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 27, 2009
Posts: 367
ad says:

Ad says "routinely delivers 15" of penetration in ballisic gelatin tests. At 2,000 fps.

Rmocarsky

Last edited by rmocarsky; June 21, 2013 at 03:10 AM. Reason: spelling
rmocarsky is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 04:25 AM   #4
couillon
Member
 
Join Date: August 3, 2012
Posts: 57
Might be worth trying out on a hog hunt or two first.
couillon is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 05:31 AM   #5
amd6547
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 27, 2006
Posts: 1,414
I found a box at my LGS a month ago. Have not had a chance to shoot any yet.
Great looking ammo though, I have a feeling it will work out great. Bullet profile fairly tapered for good feeding.
__________________
The past is gone...the future may never happen.
Be Here Now.
amd6547 is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 07:18 AM   #6
Mobuck
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2010
Posts: 2,243
Thousands of Japs know it works.
I'm not at all impressed with the 30 carbine BUT Mom's cousin survived the "island campaign" as a US Marine in WW2 on the performance of his M1 carbine. His comment during one of the very few times I heard his talk about the war was "when you saw one, you gave him the full mag and he didn't walk away from that". This guy carried a carbine for deer hunting and I always knew when he had seen a deer during the season. There would be a 3,5, or 10 shot volley of little pops.
With this comment in mind, make sure you're prepared to "give him the full mag" if confronted.
Mobuck is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 08:23 AM   #7
amd6547
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 27, 2006
Posts: 1,414
Nonsense.
__________________
The past is gone...the future may never happen.
Be Here Now.
amd6547 is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 08:40 AM   #8
slim9300
Member
 
Join Date: January 7, 2013
Posts: 72
Hornady .30 Carbine

Quote:
Originally Posted by rmocarsky View Post
Ad says "routinely delivers 15" of penetration in ballisic gelatin tests. At 2,000 fps.

Rmocarsky
That's actually perfect for whitetail or blacktail deer but maybe a little excessive for people. I wonder how this compares to the construction of a typical hunting bullet in terms of weight retention. There are a bunch of hunting bullets that are designed to penetrate roughly the same distance and retain the vast majority of their mass. Why not just use them for self defense since they are tried and true?

What's the BC of the new bullet?

Last edited by slim9300; June 21, 2013 at 09:06 AM.
slim9300 is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 10:53 AM   #9
RickB
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 1, 2000
Location: Western WA
Posts: 5,712
What exactly is "excessive penetration"?
RickB is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 11:45 AM   #10
csmsss
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: Orange, TX
Posts: 2,986
Quote:
What exactly is "excessive penetration"?
Dunno. It is not in my lexicon.
csmsss is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 04:59 PM   #11
smee78
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 14, 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1,006
I'm just glad manfuctures are still making new ammo for these great guns, I wonder how well these will work in my Blackhawk?
__________________
We know exactly where one cow with Mad-cow-disease is located, among the millions and millions of cows in America, but we haven't got a clue where thousands of illegal immigrants and terrorists are
smee78 is offline  
Old June 21, 2013, 06:17 PM   #12
jrothWA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 11, 2006
Posts: 1,955
Will have to compare it against the box...

of Winchester 110gr HP that waits the the three mags for HD use and against my handloads on paper.
jrothWA is offline  
Old June 23, 2013, 02:11 PM   #13
coldbeer
Junior member
 
Join Date: February 21, 2012
Location: Woodhaven MI
Posts: 477
It kills me when people say the 30 carbine is underpowered, but the 7.62x25 out of a Tokarev pistol is a death ray that can penetrate both sides of a battleship and everything in between.
coldbeer is offline  
Old June 26, 2013, 09:27 AM   #14
slim9300
Member
 
Join Date: January 7, 2013
Posts: 72
Hornady .30 Carbine

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
What exactly is "excessive penetration"?
It's when you shoot a deer/elk a little poorly (say liver) with a FMJ and it runs away to die a long and waisted death where you have minimal chance of recovery. All thanks to a bullet that excessively penetrated the animal making a 'clean' hole, and wasn't designed to maximize internal damage/hemorrhaging through expansion.
slim9300 is offline  
Old June 26, 2013, 11:38 AM   #15
gak
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 28, 2005
Location: Aridzona
Posts: 2,767
I was going to say, all they hooey aside about heavy, quilted Chicom uniforms stopping the "weak" carbine, lack of penetration is the not the .30 Carbine's problem. They had no problem going through helmet, head and out the other side of the helmet. Try standard 110 ball on an old (ie heavy gauge metal) car body--no problem. It was that it often did not "dump" its energy when it "needed" to and, if anything, over-penetrated (for the shooter's particular quarry--two or four legged). When it did well, obviously the comparatively narrow wound channel(s) and/or energy it did expend/transfer was sufficient to do the job--ie, "chancing" upon vitals (multiple successive hits of course increasing those chances) or smaller (enough) quarry to begin with to not matter. Soft points developed over the past several years have done wonders to render the Carbine as an excellent home/self defense, small game and pest'er weapon/round, and the Hornady round sounds like it's taken it one better yet.

Last edited by gak; June 26, 2013 at 12:19 PM.
gak is offline  
Old June 26, 2013, 02:27 PM   #16
RickB
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 1, 2000
Location: Western WA
Posts: 5,712
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB
What exactly is "excessive penetration"?

It's when you shoot a deer/elk a little poorly (say liver) with a FMJ and it runs away to die a long and waisted death where you have minimal chance of recovery. All thanks to a bullet that excessively penetrated the animal making a 'clean' hole, and wasn't designed to maximize internal damage/hemorrhaging through expansion.
No, that's poor marksmanship.
RickB is offline  
Old June 26, 2013, 04:16 PM   #17
slim9300
Member
 
Join Date: January 7, 2013
Posts: 72
Hornady .30 Carbine

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
No, that's poor marksmanship.
Let me make this as simple as possible for you to understand. Shooting though a game animal without bullet expansion (ie. excessive penetration) is not ideal. This has been proven 1000 times over. It does not kill in the most efficient manor possible and to hunt big game with a FMJ round is irresponsible and stupidity (except for some dangerous game). .

Last edited by slim9300; June 26, 2013 at 04:21 PM.
slim9300 is offline  
Old June 26, 2013, 04:32 PM   #18
RickB
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 1, 2000
Location: Western WA
Posts: 5,712
The only animal I'd shoot with a Carbine is a varmint of the two-legged variety. Let me make this as simple for you as I can; two holes bleed twice as much as one hole.
RickB is offline  
Old June 26, 2013, 04:43 PM   #19
slim9300
Member
 
Join Date: January 7, 2013
Posts: 72
Hornady .30 Carbine

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
The only animal I'd shoot with a Carbine is a varmint of the two-legged variety. Let me make this as simple for you as I can; two holes bleed twice as much as one hole.
Maybe you are being sarcastic but two holes with a broadhead tipped arrow is clearly better for blood trailing, but not with a FMJ bullet. It has been proven that an expanding bullet creates far better bloodtrails than a FMJ (despite most hunting bullets failing to exit the body cavity of their target).
slim9300 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:06 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.10975 seconds with 9 queries