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Old May 12, 2013, 12:44 AM   #1
Truckn14269
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Looking to buy a .308

What goin on y'all... I'm I'm the market for a .308 and have been for the past couple of years.... No issues other than I can't make up my mind. I have 3 or 4 models that I'm hung up on and 1 of which I'm leaning heavily towards which is the M77 Hawkeye sporter. Does anyone happen to know anything about this rifle and why I can't find any to purchase right now.. Unless for obvious gun scare reason.
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Old May 12, 2013, 08:13 AM   #2
jmr40
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Manufacturers make guns in batches. New hunting rifles show up on shelves during mid to late summer. Ruger and everyone else is too busy making handguns, 10-22's, AR's and related stuff right now to make hunting rifles. I'd expect some to start showing up soon. Even in normal times it might be a little harder to find a specific model at this time of year.

Rugers are not my favorite, but near the top. They make a good rifle for the money. Especially the newer Hawkeye's made since 2006. I don't much care for the sporter with the laminated stock. They are also one of the least popular models and will be harder to find. You'll have better luck finding one of the standard walnut stocked rifles or the stainless/synthetic All Weather. I like them much better and they are made in greater quantaties.

If you can afford about $150 more I like the new Winchesters a lot better. I think the extra $150 or so is money well spent. Kimbers are another good gun, but are $1,100+ so they might be over your budget. Kimbers are a better gun, but not sure they are enough better to justify the expense unless you really want the lightest gun possible.

Winchester, Kimber or Ruger are my top 3 picks in order of preference.
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Old May 12, 2013, 10:09 PM   #3
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Thanks jmr40

I appreciate the input. I have looked at every make and model of rifle that I could think of including; Winchester, Remington, Browning, Savage, Kimber, Cooper,Les Baer, Ed Brown No longer makes rifles(highly over-rated... And terrible Customer service... if you can even call it that), Styer, and Ruger. I out my hands on every model that was appealing to me and it has taken me 2 years to narrown it down to 4 rifles. I ruled out all walnut stocks due to the fact that I live in the deep south and the humidity level is always high near 75-100%, and it rains constantly which moisture and humidity causes wood to swell....not enough to be visibly noticed all the time but enough to alter the POI. I ruled out rifles with high gloss blued barrels because I am already scared to take my M70 super grade in the woods for fear of a another scratch and having to wipe the barrel clean constantly out of paranoia of fingerprints. No rifle budget... Just buy a rifle that feels good in my hands ad serves my purpose ya know. Thanks again for the input

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Old May 12, 2013, 10:31 PM   #4
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Kimbers are fine rifles don't get me wrong... But most of their rifles weigh 5-6 lbs. a bit light for what I had in mind for this go around. I want a rugged and dependable gun, I'm not keying on aesthetics this time just proven reliability when it counts most... Yes I know there are a few rifles that fit the bill on this one... But ask any dangerous game hunter what type of rifle they would use if they had their choice if they were staring down the barrel at a lion or Cape buffalo (yes a little exaggerated). They will tell you something with a Mauser style action and a substantial extractor claw.... And that narrowed it down for me to my 4 rifles I have in mind including the Hawkeye Sporter.
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Old May 13, 2013, 02:47 AM   #5
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If you can find a pre hawkey laminate stainless gun you might like it better than current stainless with cheap plastic stocks. If buying matte blue you should like the current hawkey just fine. Ruger 308s will shoot good and I like the 77s a lot!
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Old May 13, 2013, 06:14 AM   #6
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Ruger changed from matte blue to polished blue about a year ago. I actully liked the matte blue better, but there were enough complaints and Ruger responded.

I live in GA and know what you mean. All of my bolt rifles are in synthetic stocks because of the humidity and POI changes and I prefer SS as well. I prefer to upgrade mine with McMillan, but most of the factory stocks are just fine. Laminated is just barely better than walnut and weighs a ton. I wouldn't have a laminated stock.

For your uses I'd try to find one of these if it were my money.

http://www.winchesterguns.com/produc...01C&mid=535135

Street price isn't much more than a Ruger. You already have a nice walnut/blue rifle in the Supergrade. Might as well go all the way with a true all weather, do anything, anywhere tough rifle. This way you have 2 Winchesters, everything operates exactly the same.
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Old May 13, 2013, 07:20 AM   #7
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I had looked a the Ultimate shadow as well.. Along with the SS versions of the Shadow and the Shadow hunter.... I ruled them out because of the grip inserts. There are several guys in my hunting club that all of them have had problems with the insert coming loose and falling off. I prefer laminate stocks to basic injection molded synthetic stocks. Every synthetic stock I considered I knew that I would have to upgrade the he stock to a composite stock with an aluminum bedding block or it would drive me crazy. Trust me there isn't a production rifle today that you can name that I haven't put my hands on or shot if i had taken them into consideration..... Remember.... I've taken 2 years to contemplate which rifle I would add to te safe.
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Old May 13, 2013, 07:20 AM   #8
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Looking to buy a .308

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truckn14269 View Post
Kimbers are fine rifles don't get me wrong... But most of their rifles weigh 5-6 lbs. a bit light for what I had in mind for this go around. I want a rugged and dependable gun, I'm not keying on aesthetics this time just proven reliability when it counts most... Yes I know there are a few rifles that fit the bill on this one... But ask any dangerous game hunter what type of rifle they would use if they had their choice if they were staring down the barrel at a lion or Cape buffalo (yes a little exaggerated). They will tell you something with a Mauser style action and a substantial extractor claw.... And that narrowed it down for me to my 4 rifles I have in mind including the Hawkeye Sporter.
Their guns are certainly light, but I wouldn't write them off... The Montana's are a Kevlar stock w Mauser action... I've beat the tar out of mine and they still function flawlessly....

I too have some 84L & M classics that shoot great but like you I'm half scared to scratch them... They're a beautiful piece of wood though.
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Old May 13, 2013, 07:25 AM   #9
Truckn14269
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RC

RC.... I really like the M77's as well... I love the Mauser style action coupled with the 3 position safety.. I have enough walnut stock rifles
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Old May 13, 2013, 07:40 AM   #10
603Country
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Sounds like you want the Ruger. So buy it. I have several Rugers, the newest of them is a stainless Hawkeye in 223, and it shoots great.
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Old May 13, 2013, 07:45 AM   #11
Truckn14269
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My 4 rifles I am choosing from no order of preference
1. Kimber 84M Montana ( light for my taste but still considering)
2. Winchester extreme weather SS
3 Ruger M77 Hawkeye Sporter
4.Kimber 84M Mountain ascent ( again VERY light but not written off yet)
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Old May 13, 2013, 07:56 AM   #12
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603country.... The Ruger is just the most recent rifle that I have done research on.... I'm highly interested in the recent QC of Ruger as of late... I try to find out different thing such as when was the grove cutter for the rifling last changed in relation to the serial number of the rifle. I have very accurate rifles simply because I want to know all the details of the rifles I purchase, I can't just go to a gun shop an pick out a rifle Hoping that it will shoot close to MOA or better... Just not who I am. The time a rifle reaches the end of production an the day it was produced matters. I have annoyed a lot if customer service representatives... Believe me.... But it's my money.. Not theirs that is being spent.
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Old May 13, 2013, 08:48 AM   #13
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Truckn14269, I think all Ruger centerfire barrels are hammer forged these days. All the grooves are made at the same time. Contact Ruger and ask them how often they change the tools that make their barrels.

Years ago, when many commercial rifle barrels were rifled with a broach cutting all the grooves at the same time, those made when the broach was worn down had smaller groove diameters and shot bullets the most accurate. If the mandrel used in hammer forging barrels gets smaller after all that hammering the blank onto it, they also should make more accurate barrels than when new.

Given a choice, I would take the last barrel rifled with either method before replacing the rifling tools used. Best accuracy has always happened when the bullet's a bit larger in diameter than the barrel's groove diameter; even a whole lot larger is better than a tiny bit smaller.
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Old May 13, 2013, 11:33 AM   #14
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Bart B..... This is exactly the reason I call and ask about the rifling tools. I referred to these tools as cutting tools because most people don't know what a broach or mandrel is, and most dont the difference between Ridge and Groove rifling and Polygonal rifling but apparently you do.
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Old May 13, 2013, 04:48 PM   #15
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Truckn, if you are that interested in getting just exactly what you want, that being an outstanding shooter, you should probably just go with a custom rifle or something that comes with a MOA guarantee (5 shot guarantee and not 3 shot guarantee). There are some folks out there that'll make you a marvelous shooting rifle and to your exact weight and barrel length and contour needs. It's only money, and we forum folk do love spending your money.
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Old May 13, 2013, 05:23 PM   #16
Bart B.
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Truckn14269, I've never heard of "Ridge and Groove" rifling. What's it shaped like? Or is that just another name for "Land and Groove" rifling?

603country, I'd ask what accuracy a rifle would produce with 30 shot groups with shots fired every 20 to 30 seconds apart so the issue of barrel heating changing point of impact. If the 'smith said it would start walking when the barrel got hot, I'd say thanks anyway then walk away.
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Last edited by Bart B.; May 13, 2013 at 05:29 PM.
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Old May 13, 2013, 06:29 PM   #17
603Country
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Yeah Bart, I hear ya, but you're just stirring up mud for grins. Why be critical? Back to the topic. Knowing what the OP wants, which is a real fine shooter, is your suggestion to go custom or would you suggest a non-custom cross-the-counter rifle by anybody? Maybe Savage, Winchester, or Cooper? Maybe Kimber or Dakota? Maybe Jarrett or sombody like that. Lex Webernick could build what he wants. Lots of folks could. It's only money. So offer a worthwhile suggestion. With what you know, it should be easy.
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Old May 13, 2013, 06:57 PM   #18
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Is anyone besides me surprised there's been no mention of Remington? I can no longer hunt due to age and health problems, but I'd be looking for a good 700 ADL or BDL. Still miss the ADL I had in .243 Win. Sporter barrel, but a tack-driver.
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Old May 13, 2013, 07:05 PM   #19
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Yes Bart B.. Ridge and Land are the same, It jut has always got on my nerves to call it land
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Old May 13, 2013, 07:49 PM   #20
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Shouldazagged....... I only wanted a rifle with a Mauser style action for this rifle.
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Old May 13, 2013, 11:29 PM   #21
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I think the M77 is an excellent platform. I have a pretty old one that was passed down to me by my late father. It's gotta be from the early 80's. It's served both of us well. I'm sure its capable of shooting much more accurately than I can! So I recommend it.

I did have one of the other rifles mentioned- Kimber 8400 in 300wsm. It was a beaut. Slide smooth as butter, light, accurate, etc... As nice as it was I ended up trading it because I just never shot it. If I were going to spend over a grand on a bolt action rifle right now it would be probably be some variant of the M700. But that's just because I have my old faithful M77.

I've posted it before but here's a pic of it with my GSR.

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Old May 14, 2013, 04:14 AM   #22
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Good lookin rifles ..... Thanks for the input
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