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Old May 3, 2013, 08:40 PM   #26
James K
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While shooter skill is obviously important, the best shooters want the best tools. (If you have to dig a ditch, a backhoe beats a teaspoon every time!)

The traditional single action (not a DA revolver fired SA) has several drawbacks as a target revolver. First is the long hammer fall. Not only does it allow more time for the gun to drift off target, but the heavy hammer makes the striking impact higher, jarring the gun off target.

The second major concern is trigger pull. The traditional SA (though not the new Rugers) has three hammer notches, and the trigger pull has to be heavy enough that the trigger/sear will clear both the "safety" and half-cock (loading) notches as the hammer falls. That means that the very light trigger pulls used for target work are unobtainable with a traditional SA lockwork.

Other drawbacks, such as grip shape, which affects recovery in rapid fire, and (often) poor sights, can be overcome, though not always easily.

Jim
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Old May 3, 2013, 09:43 PM   #27
newfrontier45
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As for trigger pull, there isn't a Ruger of any kind that compares with a K22.
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That means that the very light trigger pulls used for target work are unobtainable with a traditional SA lockwork.
Sorry but this simply isn't true. An Old Model Single Six, particularly one tuned by a professional, gives up nothing to the K-22. A crisp 2lb trigger is easily obtained and no, you don't need heavy springs.


Quote:
First is the long hammer fall. Not only does it allow more time for the gun to drift off target, but the heavy hammer makes the striking impact higher, jarring the gun off target.
Tuning and lighter springs cures this issue, if it even is one. I've spent enough time with both guns to believe it is not but it sounds good in theory.


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Other drawbacks, such as grip shape, which affects recovery in rapid fire, and (often) poor sights, can be overcome, though not always easily.
More nonsense. Rapid fire, cocking with the weak thumb, poses no issues with the grip shape. The only Single Sixes with what could be considered poor sights are the Colt SAA style fixed sight guns. The drift adjustable guns have a sight picture no unlike a Bomar.


The Single Six, on average, will not be as accurate as a K-22. I believe it has little to do with the compromise bore and more to do with the way the cylinders are made and fitted. They are not. They are made in batches and whichever one comes out of the parts bin and functions makes the grade. Rugers have good barrels but sometimes the crowns and forcing cones leave some to be desired. This has an effect. The Single Six was simply never intended to be a target revolver. That said, they tend to be plenty accurate enough for casual work.
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Old May 3, 2013, 10:04 PM   #28
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Guys, the last thing I wanted to do is to start a gun fight here! Let me draw back... I do not intend to become a professional shooter. If I'll be able to get results similar to what Saleen had shown I'll be one happy camper. I simply like shooting targets. I did it a lot when I was a kid and then had to take almost 20 years brake. Now I am back on the range and happen to fall in love with revolvers... that's all. I don't anticipate to do any competitive shooting, at least not any time soon.

The only reason I ask all these detailed questions is because by nature I like to gather as much knowledge as I can if I get interested in something. If I shoot a revolver I'd like to know everything I can about that revolver including history of it, strong and weak points, how it fairs to competition, etc. I am sure that right now both K22 and Ruger Single Six exceed my ability to shoot by a mile.

So, while I appreciate all the answers and knowledge I am getting here I don't want to you to get into heated arguments of which revolver is better. Worst comes to worst I can buy both of them eventually
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Old May 3, 2013, 10:09 PM   #29
James K
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Sorry, newfrontier45, I know you have a lot of love for and attachment to the SA, and I respect that. But if all the drawbacks are "nonsense" and the SA is so suited to target work, how come we don't see them on the ranges at places like Perry?

In fact, it is very hard to find any revolver in use today for serious target work, let alone an SA.

Jim
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Old May 3, 2013, 10:34 PM   #30
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James, I'm sure you're right about camp perry, but that's not where he is headed with this. The intangible's, the "feel" of the Single six in particular seem to have a way of helping a novice shoot better.
I know this because of my own experience, as well as the wisdom of the man who handed my first one to me. He said that he had noted it for himself with his kids. I should probably note my kids shoot better with my single six than anything else as well. The gun points more naturally than anything else I've found, the sights seem to find the targets on their own. This meant two rattlers died over the years instead of getting a chance to try to kill me. His wisdom might have saved my life.

I'm not at all the only one to mention this, every time Single Sixes are discussed it seems to come up.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if all of you were right about the limitations of single action revolvers, but this design in particular seems to be more than the sum of it's parts.
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Old May 4, 2013, 05:02 AM   #31
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The 3 screw Rugers have a great trigger,at least mine
do.
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Old May 4, 2013, 09:46 AM   #32
rodfac
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I"ll go with rclark's recommendation; the Ruger Single Six in .22 lr or the convertible model. My wife and I have shared a 5-1/2" barreled 3-screw model since 1973 and it still shoots as good as the day it left Ruger. I"d conservatively estimate that it's had 15,000 round through it.

It's a Super Single Six, the convertible model, with the add'l .22 Magnum cylinder, but we've rarely used that louder faster round...I"d say less than 400 rounds. Accuracy with the .22 lr cylinder in place is all that can be asked: with Remington Golden Bullet, bulk buy .22 lr solids or HP's is very close to one inch at 25 yds. It opens up with the magnums, but it's still less than 2" at 25 yds...

Here's a representative target, shot at 25 yds sitting from an arm rest across my knees. It's a damn fine gun and one that you'll never sell. Check out that 1+" gp on the blue masking tape!! I've long since lost track of the Scouts, relatives, and "new to hand guns" people I've trained with it.

HTH's, Rodfac

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Old May 5, 2013, 12:44 PM   #33
newfrontier45
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I know you have a lot of love for and attachment to the SA, and I respect that.
I've spent enough time with DA's to be more than acquainted with their capabilities. I've also spent enough time with SA's to know that much of what people complain about is either exaggerated or contrived.


Quote:
But if all the drawbacks are "nonsense" and the SA is so suited to target work, how come we don't see them on the ranges at places like Perry?
No idea. I'm not familiar enough with bullseye shooting to know. Tons of them are used in silhouette competition so I reckon it's not as cut and dried as some DA snobs think. I do know that the most accurate revolvers in the world are single actions, as was argued about in another thread.
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Old May 6, 2013, 05:48 PM   #34
Ben Dover
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I seriously doubt that you will find a .22 revolver more accurate than a K-22.

My favorite SA is an old Colt New Frontier. Their accuracy is also quite acceptable.
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Old May 6, 2013, 06:29 PM   #35
newfrontier45
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I seriously doubt that you will find a .22 revolver more accurate than a K-22.
That's easy, Freedom Arms 97 or 252. By a long shot, myths about locktime and bullseye shooting aside.
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Old May 6, 2013, 08:04 PM   #36
Bellevance
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The S&W Model 14 SA is one of the finest target revolvers ever produced.
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Old May 6, 2013, 08:59 PM   #37
rclark
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I realize this is only 10 Yards, but this is what I got just leaning against a post with my Single Six today:



Off hand here is a ten shot group at same distance. Opened up a bit....



Seems 'acceptable' to me for this little Single-Six. Definitely hit some tin cans, or do some hip shoot'n, or .... I know it isn't a FA... But shoot I'll take this Single-Six any day for the price and fun I get out of it!



Sometimes I wish I could get a ransom rest and see what our guns can do when you take the human element out of it....
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