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Old April 18, 2013, 11:31 PM   #1
preacherblb
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Cowitness?

I just bought a DPMS AR15. I was looking at some holographic sights @ Amazon.com & read some references to Cowitnessing the sight to the iron sights. What the heck are they talking about and how do you do it? I'd like to take it to the range & sight it in Saturday.
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Old April 18, 2013, 11:50 PM   #2
BarryLee
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Basically it is the ability to utilize your iron sights with your optic installed by simply aligning the rear sight to the front sight through the optic.
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Old April 19, 2013, 07:55 AM   #3
globemaster3
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Barry's on it. Case in point, on my M-4 that I took to Afghanistan last year, if I raised by rear BUIS, the red dot of my M-68 (Aimpoint M4S) rested on top of my front sight.

On a non-magnified optic, it provides a quick recovery capability if your batteries run out or your optic takes a whack that breaks something electronically.

The USAF has us sight each independently... M-68 with the rear BUIS folded down; then the BUIS by turning off the M-68, raise the rear BUIS, and sight in.
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Old April 19, 2013, 08:06 AM   #4
doofus47
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BarryLee
Quote:
Basically it is the ability to utilize your iron sights with your optic installed by simply aligning the rear sight to the front sight through the optic.
To help you avoid a newbie red dot issue that I had, I spent a lot of time trying to get my red dot to sit exactly on top of my front sight post. Accuracy, speed both suffered. When your red dot is on, just look at the dot. If it fails, then pop up your BUIS and just look at those.

happy shooting.
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Old April 19, 2013, 10:00 AM   #5
preacherblb
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Ok guys thanks for the info. I've been shooting for 60 years but never owned
an AR until now. With all that's going on I figured it was high time I bought one. I have an idea what you're talking about but I guess I better make sure. What does BUIS stand for.
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Old April 19, 2013, 10:07 AM   #6
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Back-up iron sights.
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Old April 19, 2013, 10:45 AM   #7
preacherblb
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Thanks.
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Old April 19, 2013, 11:31 AM   #8
Dr Big Bird PhD
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Also, just so you know preacherblb

There's two types of co-witnessing.

The first is where the iron sights line up directly over the optic's red dot. Makes it a little easier to zero the other sight once the iron sights are zero'd, and vice versa.

The second is a lower third co-witness, which means the BUIS line up through the glass, but below the Red Dot/crosshairs. Its roughly in the "lower third" of the glass.
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Old April 19, 2013, 11:43 AM   #9
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Also,you can't achieve it with every sight combination.
I have a Stag AR that puts the dot right on top of the front sight with both irons up, I have a Colt with a different setup & the combination on that one doesn't co-witness.

It varies.
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Old April 19, 2013, 09:08 PM   #10
Metal god
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Here is this AR utilizing co-wittiness


.



A complete waist of time IMO . All it seems to do is block my view while looking through my red dot . One of the things I love about red-dots is . when and if they fail you can use you irons right through them . No need to take it off .
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Old April 20, 2013, 07:50 AM   #11
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More co-witness.



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Old April 20, 2013, 10:41 AM   #12
slim9300
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Cowitness?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metal god View Post
Here is this AR utilizing co-wittiness


.



A complete waist of time IMO . All it seems to do is block my view while looking through my red dot . One of the things I love about red-dots is . when and if they fail you can use you irons right through them . No need to take it off .
If you were actually fighting it wouldn't be a waste of time. You would continue fighting with accuracy (albeit reduced FOV) until you had a second to safely remove your defective red dot and proceed. That is the point.
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Old April 20, 2013, 01:14 PM   #13
DPris
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The co-witness capability isn't used all the time, it functions as a quick backup IF the red dot dies.
You normally leave your irons folded down out of the way, do a quick flip up if the dot goes bad.

You can continue shooting "through" your glass.
Without a co-witness capability, if you lose your dot your gun's out of the game until you can remove the optic and just revert to the flip-up irons.
Depending on the situation, your mount & what tools you may or may not have on you, that may take anywhere from a few seconds to the rest of your life.

I don't have a setup that blocks the optic on any of my ARs during normal use. The irons are either folded down out of the way or (as with two older carry handle versions) well below the glass.
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Old April 20, 2013, 02:37 PM   #14
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Quote:
All it seems to do is block my view while looking through my red dot . One of the things I love about red-dots is . when and if they fail you can use you irons right through them . No need to take it off .
This doesn't make sense. You don't like the co-witnessed iron sights when looking through your red dot, but you like the iron sights for backup.

The only way to do both that I know of is to use fold down front and rear sights and not flip them up until needed. I have a fold down rear sight and the sight picture has never bothered me with a standard front sight. My only pic of my AR:

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Old April 20, 2013, 09:52 PM   #15
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Sorry if I was not clear .

Quote:
You don't like the co-witnessed iron sights when looking through your red dot, but you like the iron sights for backup.
I think your quote saws what I mean . I only use the red dot by it self . If it fails , then I use the flip up irons . Thats why I said this .

Quote:
One of the things I love about red-dots is . when and if they fail you can use you irons right through them . No need to take it off
Meaning unlike a magnified optic that would need to be removed to use your back up irons . Maybe I'm missing something , are the back up sights different with a red dots then they are with a scope . I always thought a back up sight was just that . If your primary optic fails you can use your irons for back up .

Sure I get the co-wittiness concept I just don't like how it blocks my field of fiew .
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Old April 21, 2013, 07:22 AM   #16
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Metal god, SOP for us was to keep the rear BUIS folded down unless your M-68 failed, then raise it up. That kept it out of the FOV until needed. Now as for the front sight, I didn't even notice it unless I was shooting or verifying the BUIS.

As for magnified optics, if you had it on a QD mount, you could remove it quickly should it become disabled.

Another option, should you have rail up front and not an A post frame, would be the offset BUIS. I've seen a couple rifles so equipped when using magnified optics. Optic fails, a slight 45 degree roll counterclockwise, and viola, BUIS. I've not actually shot that setup to see how I'd like it, but it seems good.
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Old April 21, 2013, 09:03 AM   #17
slim9300
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Cowitness?

Quote:
Originally Posted by globemaster3 View Post
Another option, should you have rail up front and not an A post frame, would be the offset BUIS. I've seen a couple rifles so equipped when using magnified optics. Optic fails, a slight 45 degree roll counterclockwise, and viola, BUIS. I've not actually shot that setup to see how I'd like it, but it seems good.
Yep. Instead of the 45 degree offset mounts and traditional BUIS, he could get a set of these like I plan on doing for my RRA with Zeiss 3x9 scope. They are going to take me a little while to save for but they seem to be the only one their kind.

http://www.knightarmco.com/shop/inde...products_id=96

I just found these cheap Airsoft ones. I wouldn't trust them but I guess they are only 10% the cost of the KAC's.

http://www.amazon.com/Front-Degree-R...xp_grid_pt_0_1

Last edited by slim9300; April 21, 2013 at 09:09 AM.
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